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You're welcome (back) Henning. It's always interesting with some industry insight. Side topic, but have you gotten any industry info about Fuji film production lately?
Excellent that you returned to photrio!
Over the years I have learned so much from your explanations and numerous tests about films, chemistry, lenses, cameras and film production.
@Henning Serger Thank you for the detailed write-up. Can you speculate how much money EK makes per roll of 135mm CN consumer film?
NSS. The sensor size for the 48 MP camera in the iPhone 14 Pro is 9.8mm x 7.3mm vs 36mm x 24mm in a full frame camera. It is like comparing Minox to 35mm film.The 48MP mode on the 14 Pro doesn’t even begin to touch a 24MP camera with a 24mm lens either.
But if there is truth in that rumour, then our honourable photrio member Agulliver will not be obliged to fulfill his promise to "eat his most smelly socks".........
Thanks!
Well, Infos about Fujifilm: I have heard one rumour, and just lately got one reliable info which would be an indication that the rumour could be right.
But the rumour is so far really only a rumour, and not from a source, which we Germans would define as "belastbar" (one of these numerous wonderful German words I as a scientist love so much ......).
Therefore I will not talk about that rumour publicly.
But if there is truth in that rumour, then our honourable photrio member Agulliver will not be obliged to fulfill his promise to "eat his most smelly socks".........
Best regards,
Henning
even while using some artsy sounding made up name so they wouldn't have to say, "inkjet"
Like “giclée”?
The one I see most often is 'Archival pigment print'. Not quite as fancy as giclée
Not quite as fancy as giclée
Nothing sounds as cheap as giclée.
Nothing sounds as cheap as giclée.
Like “giclée”?
Is that an Italian ice cream?
Gelato alla Crema
DPReview.com to close
After nearly 25 years of operation, DPReview will be closing in the near future. This difficult decision is part of the annual operating plan review that our parent company shared earlier this year.www.dpreview.com
Seems out of the blue.
Anyone can look up the respective patents.
It lasted too long to call it a crraze and it ain't dead by any stretch of the imagination. There are far more pictures taken on digital devices than on film.
Ah. Very helpful. I was hoping for some more concrete evidence than "just believe me because I say so and I know some people". FYI: I've worked for a company heavily invested in inkjet, both on its own R&D as well as working with pigment dispersions of major manufacturers. Dyes weren't part of in-house manufacturing, nor were they part of the supply chain. The simple reason is that no dyes were in the inks.Just do what I said.
Koraks - it is simply impossible to make or dispense any of those inkjet systems on the premise of actual pigments alone. Not only is it impossible to achieve all the specific colorant hues involved without resorting to organic dyes, but even less would it be possible to get them through those tiny inkjet nozzles. It's hell to do it even with architectural pigments. Inkjet systems don't use
CMYK process colors at all, but a quantity of colorants which involve complex blends. Your allegedly definitive test that dyes aren't present is technically incorrect because you don't sufficiently admit how those dyes are bound to the colorant particles themselves; that's part of the whole R&D process behind it. No dyes come out by themselves, or else the system wouldn't consistently work.
Lakes are indeed a complex topic (the term is derived from lac), but should be differentiated from true pigments. Permanence is a whole other layer to the topic; but as an example, a yellow mono-azo lake like Charles Berger of Richard Kaufman chose might be more permanent than a yellow azo dye, but not as permanent as a true cadmium yellow pigment. Nearly all the most permanent red pigments are toxic; hence nearly all the commercially sold true red colorants are some kind of quinacridone lake. The purest most permanent blues and greens are extremely expensive and somewhat toxic, so the next best thing is thalo colorants, which aren't as pure-hued.
Another problems with inkjet is blacks themselves. Lampblack is not a neutral black at all, and trends purplish if lightened. Mineral blacks, on the other hand, trend greenish. Hence the need for more than one black - the darkest essentially being equivalent to a K printer, and the others deep gray. And this is one of real kinks still needing to be worked out in inkjet, because these often dry at mismatched sheens.
But I can do without your condescending attitude. I've been involved with this for half a century, and was in contact with those in the forefront of advancing pigment technology both in the US and EU right up till the time I retired (most of them are now retired too). The whole question of a true process set of nano-pigments is the still undiscovered holy grail, but there are people working on it on an entirely different premise than anything currently inkjet-oriented.
You are actually way way behind the curve by referring to the kind of pigments used by Ultrastable (Charles Berger) or Galvin Grier. All kinds of R&D is going on, mainly for sake of auto and industrial coatings, but with spinoff potential to other applications as well like color printing is the right colorants can be developed. And yes, pigments are highly ground for sake of dispersion in automatic programmable systems. They have to be. I had accounts with the finest grinders in the world. That's something done on industrial scale, not by mortar and pestle. And you don't find those products in art stores. I made an ultra-fine process set myself simply for experimental testing, but with true pigment printing in mind, not inkjet. But I don't have the time to undertake that kind of printing myself.
Pigment dispersion technology itself can be proprietary and hush-hush in some cases. The kinds of companies are multi-billion dollar enterprises with massive R&D labs. Their job is to come up with endless "what if" formulations, with only a small percentage of those ever likely to see the light of day commercially. But all it can take is one really big home run, just like in all the Biotech and Pharmaceutical R&D around here. Some grad student up at the University gets an idea, then a couple decades later he's a billionaire. And if there is another big seismic change in color printing, taking the place of inkjet in due turn, it will be due to research with something else in its sights all along, as a spinoff of that.
But please don't keep asking me to prove this or that to you, when if you took the time to dig more deeply into all of this, you could find out for yourself. Photrio isn't really the kind of place these things are discussed anyway. And I haven't stated a single thing that isn't common knowledge to the industry itself. I've actually given classes concerning the usage of nano-pigments, and don't see the need to given any longer sermons than I already have simply to convince web jockeys unwilling to do their own homework. There are mountains of patents out there relative to inkjet printing, with only a few of those themselves having actually seen the light of day commercially. The fact is, the mere fact so many mismatched colorants are used in inkjet systems mean that one of its weak points
is inevitable difference fading. At least with Cibachrome, all three of the azo dyes involved faded at the same rate, so no color shift was apparent, until almost the whole print finally crashed.
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