Is straight photography dead?

[Rolleiflexible]

I personally prefer one subject matter on one negative presented on one print.

I am using this springboard to remember the incredible Don Hong Oai, a Chinese photographer who lived in Vietnam for many years before coming to California in the 1970s. He printed amazing landscapes reminiscent of Chinese ink scrolls, that he created from multiple negatives.

Don Hong-Oai | Escape Into Life

www.escapeintolife.com

A brilliant artist RIP.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I am using this springboard to remember the incredible Don Hong Oai, a Chinese photographer who lived in Vietnam for many years before coming to California in the 1970s. He printed amazing landscapes reminiscent of Chinese ink scrolls, that he created from multiple negatives.

Don Hong-Oai | Escape Into Life

www.escapeintolife.com

A brilliant artist RIP.

I like his work especially the Chinese lettering that he adds to the print. Don't now what it says maybe someone else here does.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

I'm not saying the below quotes are authoritative, only, it just seems a pretty simple concept to adhere to. So, AA, in his autobiography, writes:

"Group f/64 became synonymous with the renewed interest in the philosophy of straight photography: that is, photographs that look like photographs, not imitations of other art forms."

I love Ansel Adams, admire a lot of his work, but I have to say, "photographs that look like photographs" has got to be, in retrospect, the most absurd, nonsensical statement ever uttered about photography . A photograph can only look like the thing photographed, to paraphrase Winogrand, and I certainly hope that that's what Adams meant.

What Adams couldn't (or didn't want to) see was that the medium contained within itself possibilities which, through exploration and experimentation, would lead to the development of new art forms that had nothing to do with existing art forms. One can point at the development of abstract photography in the 60s and 70s, but that Adams would write such a statement at a time when people such as Sudek, Man Ray or Moholy-Nagy were starting to explore the possibilities of the medium shows that there was a bit narrow-mindedness at work, or, at least, an ignorance of what was going on elsewhere (understandable in a context in which information wasn't as readily available as today).

 

[Rolleiflexible]

I love Ansel Adams, admire a lot of his work, but I have to say, "photographs that look like photographs" has got to be, in retrospect, the most absurd, nonsensical statement ever uttered about photography . A photograph can only look like the thing photographed, to paraphrase Winogrand, and I certainly hope that that's what Adams meant.

A fellow photographer criticizes my landscape kallitypes as too "painterly," and says I should make photographs that look like photographs. Like Eggleston, he says. But I don't want to be a second-rate Eggleston.

I get his point. But there's room enough for all tastes. In the end, we all spend way too much time in the taxonomic weeds. I'd rather go make stuff.

 

[AnselMortensen]

I love Ansel Adams, admire a lot of his work, but I have to say, "photographs that look like photographs" has got to be, in retrospect, the most absurd, nonsensical statement ever uttered about photography . A photograph can only look like the thing photographed, to paraphrase Winogrand, and I certainly hope that that's what Adams meant.

What Adams couldn't (or didn't want to) see was that the medium contained within itself possibilities which, through exploration and experimentation, would lead to the development of new art forms that had nothing to do with existing art forms. One can point at the development of abstract photography in the 60s and 70s, but that Adams would write such a statement at a time when people such as Sudek, Man Ray or Moholy-Nagy were starting to explore the possibilities of the medium shows that there was a bit narrow-mindedness at work, or, at least, an ignorance of what was going on elsewhere (understandable in a context in which information wasn't as readily available as today).

Ansel was referring to (and rebelling against) Pictorialist imaging...photos, heavily allegorical, soft focus, heavily retouched (Mortensen), or using artistic printing techniques like Bromoil, Gum Prints, etc. (think Robert Demachy, early Steichen, etc.).
Taken in that context, "a photograph that looks like a photograph" just means 'a photograph that isn't trying to emulate a Salon painting'.

 

[VinceInMT]

I like his work especially the Chinese lettering that he adds to the print. Don't now what it says maybe someone else here does.

If I remember correctly from art history classes, in many cases, the inscriptions were the name of the owner/collector. In other cases they could be comments made by a viewer.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

Ansel was referring to (and rebelling against) Pictorialist imaging...photos, heavily allegorical, soft focus, heavily retouched (Mortensen), or using artistic printing techniques like Bromoil, Gum Prints, etc. (think Robert Demachy, early Steichen, etc.).
Taken in that context, "a photograph that looks like a photograph" just means 'a photograph that isn't trying to emulate a Salon painting'.

Exactly my point. Seeing things in a somewhat manichean manner, straight photography vs pictorialism, was a bit narrow-minded. Surrealist-inspired French photography, Bauhaus-inspired German photography, formalist-inspired Russian photography were already taking the medium places that had nothing to do with either pictorialism or what f/64 were doing. In that larger context "a photograph that looks like a photograph" is meaningless.

 

[Craig]

Ansel was referring to (and rebelling against) Pictorialist imaging...photos, heavily allegorical, soft focus, heavily retouched (Mortensen), or using artistic printing techniques like Bromoil, Gum Prints, etc. (think Robert Demachy, early Steichen, etc.).

What about Autochromes? They are often soft in focus simply due to subject movement required by the long exposure times and the nature of the medium.

 

[AnselMortensen]

What about Autochromes? They are often soft in focus simply due to subject movement required by the long exposure times and the nature of the medium.

I can't answer for Ansel or f64...but it might be determined by subject matter or treatment.

 

[MattKing]

Garry Winogrand said it well:
"I take photographs in order to find out what something will look like photographed".
And Diane Arbus said so many relevant things about this, including: “A photograph is a secret about a secret. The more it tells you the less you know.”

 

[AnselMortensen]

Exactly my point. Seeing things in a somewhat manichean manner, straight photography vs pictorialism, was a bit narrow-minded. Surrealist-inspired French photography, Bauhaus-inspired German photography, formalist-inspired Russian photography were already taking the medium places that had nothing to do with either pictorialism or what f/64 were doing. In that larger context "a photograph that looks like a photograph" is meaningless.

Ansel and f64 were pretty much US-centric.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Edward Weston was a rabid exponent of f/64, despite his own pedigree in pictorialist style and formative personal development under Mexican influences. Not one of them really practiced what they preached, at least for very long. Calling them US-centric doesn't make a lot of sense when AA's greatest advocate, Stiegliz, was also the US front door to European modernist painters as well as to public acceptance of Pictorialism itself; he himself was somewhere in the middle, just like EW for a long time. AA socialized with a very eclectic circle of artists; the notion his own esthetic lineage was derived from "Romanticist" landscape painters like Bierstadt is nonsense.

All these labels and superficial stereotypes wear awfully thin after awhile.

 

[Arthurwg]

I much prefer Steichen to Stieglitz.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Bingo. Steichen. Highest price ever paid for a photo so far was for an verrrrry pictorialistic-style Steichen. Yet he later became a very conspicuously "black is black, white is white", "sharp is sharp" silver gelatin printer. If anything, Steichen was versatile, and proved that one can indeed between of jack of all trades, yet at master of several of them too. And yes, he too put together some very influential shows of other photographers.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Bingo. Steichen. Highest price ever paid for a photo so far was for an verrrrry pictorialistic-style Steichen. Yet he later became a very conspicuously "black is black, white is white", "sharp is sharp" silver gelatin printer. If anything, Steichen was versatile, and proved that one can indeed between of jack of all trades, yet at master of several of them too. And yes, he too put together some very influential shows of other photographers.

I love that picture. I think it's the high hat that does it.

The Flatiron Building Canvas Print / Canvas Art by Edward Steichen

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fineartamerica.com

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Here's my take on the Flatiron building. What style would you call it?

 

[DREW WILEY]

The hat was probably used to develop the film in.

 

[Sirius Glass]

35 years ago, on a lark instigated by my sister after I broke up with my girlfriend, I placed a personal ad in New York Magazine in the dating section. There was no social media online back them. This was a way for people to meet. So I got about 200 letters at least half with pictures which made it somewhat easier to decide who you might want to call and date. The twentieth girl I dated eventually became my current wife of thirty years. Go figure.

She had enclosed a photo of herself that had been cut vertically through the picture so only she remained in it. There obviously was some person who was standing next to her in the part of the picture cut out. I assumed it was an ex-boyfriend. But I was attracted to her and didn't want to get too inquisitive. So I kept my mouth shut. Later on I found out it was her girlfriend in the picture. My wife told me she didn't want me to mistake her girlfriend for her. So now I'm thinking. Was that a straight photo? Dishonest? Altered? Improved? Clarified?

A cropped photography which did not change the meaning of how she looked at the time. But since you now have questions, divorce her and make a clean start.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

Here's my take on the Flatiron building. What style would you call it?

Scabrous?

 

[Sirius Glass]

Here's my take on the Flatiron building. What style would you call it?

A snapshot without style.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

A snapshot without style.

It's not a snapshot if it's in black and white.

 

[Pieter12]

It's not a snapshot if it's in black and white.

Of course. Only hipsters shoot black and white.

 

[madNbad]

Here's my take on the Flatiron building. What style would you call it?

Looks like “Pizza Rat” found a source for whole pies!

 

[Vaughn]

Ansel and Imogan blessing Jerry. What was straight photography again?

Photo by Ted Organ (Orland) used for educational purposes:

TED (Orland) TALK • Carmel Visual Arts

TED Orland TALK register below On Monday, May 16, 2016 at 6:30pm, Carmel Visual Arts will host Photographer Ted Orland who will be offering a lecture which will be illustrated with examples from his own artwork and seasoned with snapshots capturing the flavor of the local scene. Ted will recount...

www.carmelvisualarts.com

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

It's not a snapshot if it's in black and white.

Of course. Only hipsters shoot black and white.

Two fans of mine. Thank you.