For some perspective, there were 55 murders in San Francisco in 2022. I don't know how many of them were perpetrated by gang members lying in wait outside hospital ERs.
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Is San Francisco really that bad?
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Yes, once near the Opera House, then in North Beach, and a third time near Union Square. I hear that the Bohemian Club is a safe location.
I had to move from a nice little SW Florida retirement community that was discovered by a people group who wasted little time in turning it into their personal vending machine, toilet, and shooting gallery. The transition from nice to nasty happened almost overnight.
You can hardly talk to anyone who can't tell a story of a community that used to be good and isn't anymore. Something needs to change.
Coffee at the Beach Monkey Organic Cafe sounds real nice. I heard the food is to die for.
You can hardly talk to anyone who can't tell a story of a community that used to be good and isn't anymore. Something needs to change.
Coffee at the Beach Monkey Organic Cafe sounds real nice. I heard the food is to die for.
Wow, much lower than I expected. We had nearly ten times that amount here in 2022, a decrease of 8% from 2021.
There were twice that many across the Bay in Oakland for the same time period (and with half the population of SF).
Philly has about twice the population of SF, I believe.
Philly has about twice the population of SF, I believe.
You are confusing Oakland with San Francisco. This thread is called "Is San Francisco really that bad?", not "I am about to die in Oakland".
Jokes aside. Anecdotes are interesting but not useful. Replace Oakland with any city of comparable size and your story will still be true several times per year. What is useful is data. Homicide rate per 100K in particular is very reliable because, unlike other types of crime, the reporting is consistent: a dead person generates a lot of paperwork.
I won't provide links because people tend to believe their own research (easy to google!). I will just say 3 things:
- When searching for homicide rate, look for combined reports, not just FBI reports (those do not include all metros)
- You will see that SF/Oakland are rarely in top 10, with Atlanta, Washington DC, St. Louis, Detroit, Indianapolis and others reliably scoring higher.
- Generally, USA has a very high homicide rate when compared to other developed nations.
MattKing
Moderator
And four times the headaches.
SF and Oakland are two very different places. Richard Man seems unclear on that. No-one has asked the question in this thread is Oakland really that bad?
We are talking about San Francisco.
My nephew's daughter got a job in the tech industry last year after college and lives in SF. You guys are making me nervous for her.
Here in Albuquerque we had 122 murders in 2022. It's everywhere.
When I still lived in California people were taken aback when I told them I was from Richmond. "Man, that's a tough town." In SF, like here in Albuquerque, I always used a hand held camera and kept my eyes and ears open.
I have now trimmed down the gear for the trip to the 509 CX with the 30mm Fisheye and the 903 SWC. One at a time or maybe both at once but that would have one of them in the backpack at a time.
Is she nervous? Or does she love living there?
We booked this six months ago.
The 8 most dangerous cities in Ca list does not even include San Francisco!
Top 15 Most Dangerous Cities in California | PropertyClub
The most dangerous cities in California are Emeryville, Commerce, Oakland, San Bernardino, and Stockton. These urban areas grapple with various forms of criminal activity, ranging from property theft to aggravated assault. Let's delve into the sobering statistics and underlying factors that contribu
propertyclub.nyc
For the entire US, San Francisco is not even in the top 60!
Most Dangerous Cities in the US 2025
The most dangerous cities in the US by 2025 are Memphis, Detroit, Little Rock, Pueblo, Baltimore, Cleveland, Kansas City, Peoria, St. Louis and Beaumont.
www.populationu.com
For the entire US, specifically Murder, San Francisco is not in the top 20
American Cities with the Most Murders 2022
Some of these towns may not be so far from home...
valuetainment.com
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- jtk
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The 8 most dangerous cities in Ca list does not even include San Francisco!
Top 15 Most Dangerous Cities in California | PropertyClub
The most dangerous cities in California are Emeryville, Commerce, Oakland, San Bernardino, and Stockton. These urban areas grapple with various forms of criminal activity, ranging from property theft to aggravated assault. Let's delve into the sobering statistics and underlying factors that contribu
For the entire US, San Francisco is not even in the top 60!
Most Dangerous Cities in the US 2025
The most dangerous cities in the US by 2025 are Memphis, Detroit, Little Rock, Pueblo, Baltimore, Cleveland, Kansas City, Peoria, St. Louis and Beaumont.www.populationu.com
For the entire US, specifically Murder, San Francisco is not in the top 20
In comparison, as mentioned in post 212, Albequerque had 122 in 2022, yet even Albequerque is not in the Top 20!American Cities with the Most Murders 2022
Some of these towns may not be so far from home...
One of Albuquerque's virtues is that most of the murders are restricted to certain cultural groups.
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- jtk
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It's like saying that New York and Brooklyn are two different places. Technically true, but in practice it is one giant metro area where people commute in both directions. Places like Piedmont which is a large part of Oakland that eclipses 95% of SF in terms of wealth, safety and in other ways (quality of schools or civic services) is head and shoulders above all of SF.
Here's another anecdote: I know lots of Oaklanders and San Franciscans, and the former tend to have a more favorable view of their city and show less cynicism about the future. It is even noticeable in their respective Yelp/Reddit communities. Check it out.
I warned you about not citing the FBI in #207. They do not include San Francisco, Oakland, and Los Angeles in their reporting. But looking at the SFPD dashboard, the homicide rate was about 14.5 in 2022 (56 homicides per 815K people). High, but not crazy high. It would have landed within top 25 in the country.
[EDIT] Wrong math: 56 homicides per 815K = 7, thank you @wiltw
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Oakland has deteriorated in quality far less than the deterioration of San Francisco, and that probably accounts for their 'more favorable' view...less of the 'my home town has gone into the toilet' in a comparative way. I never felt uneasy about going to the theatre district in SF in my younger days; cannot say the same today, as it is hard to walk any distance without encountering people of questionable nature asleep on almost every block.
Oakland, California, is among the U.S. cities with the highest homicide rates...102 murders reported in 2020, or 23.3 for every 100K — compared to the national homicide rate of 6.5 murders per 100K. SF, in 2022, murder rate was under 7 for every 100K population...Oakland numbers of homocides vary per year, but range from 72-175 between 1992-2021.. 44 per 100K in 1992. 23 per 100K in 2020
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Uh, and who is going to Oakland? It is not on my horizon.
Just the confusion caused by statistics that refer to the San Francisco metropolitan area, which includes 3.3 Million vs. the 830K who live in SF alone; Oakland adds 433K to the confusion, with its half the population and twice the number of homocides per year.
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- Steven Lee
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- Reason: wrong math!
I have a good friend and photographer who lives in Oakland and I visit occasionally -- we'll do some printing together. There is Oakland and then there is Oakland. And for some there is no there there, sort of like Fresno, I guess.
I did not YET see your message about FBI lists..I replied to post 201, and your comment was 207!.
Here is a different list, and SF is not in top 20
Cities with the Most Murders in the United States
Discover population, economy, health, and more with the most comprehensive global statistics at your fingertips.
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