Is portraiture and wedding photography the most common type?

Stick and Stone

H
Stick and Stone

  • 4
  • 0
  • 26
Leaf

D
Leaf

  • 5
  • 1
  • 73

Recent Classifieds

Forum statistics

Threads
200,598
Messages
2,810,773
Members
100,311
Latest member
Skalpho
Recent bookmarks
0

bluechromis

Subscriber
Joined
Sep 11, 2015
Messages
689
Format
35mm
As to whether wedding photographers are the most common kind of pro photographers, wedding photography in my area is in sharp decline. When my niece got married a few years ago I was shocked at prices the wedding photographers were asking. Don't get me wrong, the prices may have been fair given the effort needed to produce what is wanted these days which often includes videos, web sites etc. The end result though, is that pro wedding photos are getting to be in the province of the affluent. It didn't help that Vogue magazine encouraged its readers to avoid pros and just use their friends phone snaps for their wedding memories. Also there have been some horror stories of egregiously bad experiences with wedding photographers that have gone viral on the net. It's unfortunate that many responsible pros are tarred with the same brush as a small number of bad actors, buts that's how things spread around on the web. Wedding photographers in my area are on a path to become about as numerous as photojournalists and buffalos.
 

benjiboy

Subscriber
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
11,999
Location
U.K.
Format
35mm
I'm happy to be in a financial situation that I never have to shoot another wedding again, although I'm grateful it helped me put my two sons through university for two degrees each and if anyone ever asks me to shoot a wedding I recommend them to a friend who does weddings for a living.
I find in my experience that many people who ask amateur photographers to do their wedding have already had a quote from a professional and, are trying to do it on the cheap, and on many occasions the amateurs due to their inexperience and not knowing the traditional shots and set pieces that are mandatory at a wedding and not having the people skills to control the guests they shoot it as if it's a news event, and make a complete mess of it, however competent their photography may be.
.For the couple getting married this is one of the most important days of their lives, and the photographs of the event will be cherished by them, their family and their descendants, so I implore if you if aren't competent to do the job don't attempt it, because even though you may have told them "you are only an amateur and they don't expect much of me", however it will be a different story when they see the prints
These days when just about anyone who buys an entry level DSLR sees how easy the onboard technology makes it to take sharp colourful. pictures with their camera that they have "paid a lot of money for" ,they convince themselves that the technical ability is inherent in the camera not in them, and anyone with the magic camera can shoot weddings and undertake other professional work that is far beyond their training knowledge and ability, because they see it as way of creating an additional revenue stream to supplement their income, but all they do is give people who are professional photographers a bad name, and leave a lot of disappointed clients.
 
Last edited:

fdonadio

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2015
Messages
2,129
Location
Berlin, DE
Format
Multi Format
I find in my experience that people who ask amateur photographers to do their wedding have already had a quote from a professional and, are trying to do it on the cheap.

Here in Brazil, these amateurs often think they are pros and enter the market offering their services for much less than the established pros. Some pros try to get into the “race to the bottom” and, obviously, can’t do it for long and end up ruining their careers. It’s a bag of hurt, really.
 

Wanda Lucas

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Messages
2
Location
Australia
Format
Digital
I'm happy to be in a financial situation that I never have to shoot another wedding again[/QUOTE said:
It's great when you can afford to choose orders. I never have such a choice because photography is my main income. This means that I only take pictures and live from order to order. My friends advise me to their friends, so I gain a customer base along the chain. Of course, it would be nice to create your own website like this https://www.wanderlustportraits.com, but I can't pay for the domain every month yet. Therefore, I can only use poorly targeted advertising on Facebook and Instagram.
 

gone

Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
5,504
Location
gone
Format
Medium Format
I think I'd rather shoot a funeral than a wedding. At least then your subject wouldn't complain, and more importantly, they'd sit still!
 

Sirius Glass

Subscriber
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
50,623
Location
Southern California
Format
Multi Format
I think I'd rather shoot a funeral than a wedding. At least then your subject wouldn't complain, and more importantly, they'd sit still!

Lie still.
 

TheFlyingCamera

Membership Council
Advertiser
Joined
May 24, 2005
Messages
11,546
Location
Washington DC
Format
Multi Format
I've photographed one wedding and assisted a second. That's the end of that. Now, I will attend a wedding and take pictures, for my own personal mementos, and share them with the happy couple, but money will not be involved, ergo no obligations. I would be happy to do wedding PORTRAITS at a studio sitting, but hell no to event photography. And in all likelihood, I'll just do the portraits as my present to the couple, rather than for money, because again, no obligations.
 

foc

Subscriber
Joined
Jun 30, 2010
Messages
2,552
Location
Sligo, Ireland
Format
35mm
I suspect that different countries and cultures view wedding photography and the photographer differently.

I would like to ask why so many people here dislike taking wedding photos for money or not?
Is it the responsibility?
Managing crowds of people?
Getting people to do what you want?
What exactly?

My reason for asking is that I want to understand what it is that puts people off. (I don't mean to hijack the thread)
I shot weddings professionally for 35 years and enjoyed it, yet I knew a few professionals who hated it but they never could tell me exactly why.
 

MattKing

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Apr 24, 2005
Messages
54,313
Location
Delta, BC Canada
Format
Medium Format
I enjoyed it a lot when I did it - mostly in the 1970s, but continuing a bit into the 1980s.
But I wouldn't have lasted 35 years, and I wouldn't have enjoyed it if I didn't have a really good and really reliable professional film lab to rely upon.
Very few of my potential customers were capable of producing well composed and well lit photographs to the same standard as I was able to at the time. I had a good idea of how to both control and influence the progression of a wedding day in order to ensure that there were opportunities to take the photographs that people wanted*. And my work with my lab meant that my prints looked really nice. So I was able to provide my customers with a product that they appreciated, and were happy to pay for. All of which led to a high rate of satisfaction for me!
*In at least a couple of occasions, I ended up doing as much organizing of a wedding day as photographing it. There were some couples who needed some help organizing the day, and as it wasn't my first rodeo ....
 

fdonadio

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2015
Messages
2,129
Location
Berlin, DE
Format
Multi Format
Is it the responsibility?

For me, this is the dealbreaker. The responsibility is too high: having to deal with problematic brides and, even worse, their mothers.

And, more importantly, I am not really good at wedding photography. :smile:
 

abruzzi

Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2018
Messages
3,155
Location
New Mexico, USA
Format
Large Format
I would like to ask why so many people here dislike taking wedding photos for money or not?
Is it the responsibility?
Managing crowds of people?
Getting people to do what you want?
What exactly?

For ~10 years I worked as a freelance videographer. Most of my business was corporate (training videos) or non-profit (recording and editing symposia). Not exactly exciting or creative work, but it was a good living for a while. After 9/11 those markets really tightened up. Organizations were significantly changing their focus and spending. (It didn't seem the sort of thing that would be affected, but it did change at least for a while.) I was having difficulty getting work from the organizations I usually did work for. Someone suggested that I supplement the work doing weddings and quinceañeras. I tried and couldn't stand it. I folded my business and got a job instead of having to do that kind of work. As for why I didn't like it these are my top reasons:

  • I'm not a people person, and being a wedding videographer required an extroverted type interaction with the couple, guests, and all the participants. (you don't have to BE and extrovert, but you have to act like one.) Unfortunately, I'm an extreme introvert so this was the hardest thing to deal with.
  • Corporate clients hired me because I knew what they didn't (how to produce a video) so they trusted me and my expertise to deliver what they needed. Wedding clients second guessed and micromanaged everything I did.
  • Corporate clients know the word "change order" and know it comes with a price attached. Wedding clients were constantly trying to add work, change things after they had already been done, and expected everything to come at the original price.
  • Crowds - I hate crowds. This is really a restatement of the first point above. If it were a portrait job, just me and the subject in a photogenic location, if would be much more manageable.

Granted, its obvious that I am not tempermentally suited to dealing with of people and therefore weddings. I'm glad there are people that can deal with it.
 

TheFlyingCamera

Membership Council
Advertiser
Joined
May 24, 2005
Messages
11,546
Location
Washington DC
Format
Multi Format
In a word: clientzillas. Not just brides/ brides' moms, but occasionally brides' dads too. Everything from temper tantrums the day of the wedding, to expecting everything for free from the get-go, to trying to get everything for free (or even turning a profit off the photography) by suing/threatening to sue the photographer for 'losses/emotional damage' after the fact. Yeah, no thanks.
 

Pieter12

Member
Joined
Aug 20, 2017
Messages
7,881
Location
Magrathean's computer
Format
Super8
In a word: clientzillas. Not just brides/ brides' moms, but occasionally brides' dads too. Everything from temper tantrums the day of the wedding, to expecting everything for free from the get-go, to trying to get everything for free (or even turning a profit off the photography) by suing/threatening to sue the photographer for 'losses/emotional damage' after the fact. Yeah, no thanks.
That's what contracts and deposits or up-front payments are for. Never do spec work for a client: if you don't value your work, neither will the client. Long ago when I was working as a freelance designer, I learned if a client couldn't or wouldn't pay a deposit, they usually would end up trying to not pay at all.
 

TheFlyingCamera

Membership Council
Advertiser
Joined
May 24, 2005
Messages
11,546
Location
Washington DC
Format
Multi Format
That's what contracts and deposits or up-front payments are for. Never do spec work for a client: if you don't value your work, neither will the client. Long ago when I was working as a freelance designer, I learned if a client couldn't or wouldn't pay a deposit, they usually would end up trying to not pay at all.
Oh, I won't even have an in-person meeting if there is any hesitancy at all about a contract or deposit. Which is why I don't do much paid photography.
 

benjiboy

Subscriber
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
11,999
Location
U.K.
Format
35mm
In a word: clientzillas. Not just brides/ brides' moms, but occasionally brides' dads too. Everything from temper tantrums the day of the wedding, to expecting everything for free from the get-go, to trying to get everything for free (or even turning a profit off the photography) by suing/threatening to sue the photographer for 'losses/emotional damage' after the fact. Yeah, no thanks.
You forgot to mention the guests, who when you have arranged the groups or the bride and groom shots and other setpieces trying to elbow you out of the way.
I have also encountered cheapskate acquaintances who invite me and my wife to their, or their son's /daughters or other relatives' weddings, and call you shortly before the occasion and say " oh, and will you make sure you bring your camera with you".
 
Last edited:

foc

Subscriber
Joined
Jun 30, 2010
Messages
2,552
Location
Sligo, Ireland
Format
35mm
I wouldn't have enjoyed it if I didn't have a really good and really reliable professional film lab to rely upon.

I agree because you need to be able to produce consistently good results every time. Thankfully I did all my own film processing and printing on my minilab equipment.

For me, this is the dealbreaker. The responsibility is too high: having to deal with problematic brides and, even worse, their mothers.

And, more importantly, I am not really good at wedding photography. :smile:

Yes I can understand that. You need to be very confident that you do it right every time. But that all comes with practice.
You need to know your equipment like the back of your hand.
Handling people is a skill that can also be learned.

For ~10 years I worked as a freelance videographer. Most of my business was corporate (training videos) or non-profit (recording and editing symposia). Not exactly exciting or creative work, but it was a good living for a while. After 9/11 those markets really tightened up. Organizations were significantly changing their focus and spending. (It didn't seem the sort of thing that would be affected, but it did change at least for a while.) I was having difficulty getting work from the organizations I usually did work for. Someone suggested that I supplement the work doing weddings and quinceañeras. I tried and couldn't stand it. I folded my business and got a job instead of having to do that kind of work. As for why I didn't like it these are my top reasons:

  • I'm not a people person, and being a wedding videographer required an extroverted type interaction with the couple, guests, and all the participants. (you don't have to BE and extrovert, but you have to act like one.) Unfortunately, I'm an extreme introvert so this was the hardest thing to deal with.
  • Corporate clients hired me because I knew what they didn't (how to produce a video) so they trusted me and my expertise to deliver what they needed. Wedding clients second guessed and micromanaged everything I did.
  • Corporate clients know the word "change order" and know it comes with a price attached. Wedding clients were constantly trying to add work, change things after they had already been done, and expected everything to come at the original price.
  • Crowds - I hate crowds. This is really a restatement of the first point above. If it were a portrait job, just me and the subject in a photogenic location, if would be much more manageable.

Granted, its obvious that I am not tempermentally suited to dealing with of people and therefore weddings. I'm glad there are people that can deal with it.

I appreciate your comments and it does seem that a wedding photographer need to be an extrovert.
I am an introvert and was very shy as a young man. I joined amateur drama to help overcome the shyness and it did help with handling people at a wedding.
BUT remember the bride & groom are also nervous on the day so I can empathise with that. It can also be an unique selling point (USP).
Some wedding photographers are so extravert that the wedding is run like it is their show not the couples

In a word: clientzillas. Not just brides/ brides' moms, but occasionally brides' dads too. Everything from temper tantrums the day of the wedding, to expecting everything for free from the get-go, to trying to get everything for free (or even turning a profit off the photography) by suing/threatening to sue the photographer for 'losses/emotional damage' after the fact. Yeah, no thanks.

Thankfully I can count on one hand the number of bride/clientzillas I had in 35 years.
These people are selfish bullies and the simple way to deal with them is to say you have a policy of zero tolerance of bullying. If you lose the gig then so be it.
I would tactfully work this into our wedding enquiry chat before any booking was made. Basically, I told the client how I worked, my method etc., and did that suit them.

That's what contracts and deposits or up-front payments are for. Never do spec work for a client: if you don't value your work, neither will the client. Long ago when I was working as a freelance designer, I learned if a client couldn't or wouldn't pay a deposit, they usually would end up trying to not pay at all.

Yes you must act professionally at all times and the same when it comes to asking for payment. Never be shy to ask but do it politly. I totally agree with your comment
"I learned if a client couldn't or wouldn't pay a deposit, they usually would end up trying to not pay at all"

You forgot to mention the guests, who when you have arranged the groups or the bride and groom shots and other setpieces trying to elbow you out of the way.
I have also encountered cheapskate acquaintances who invite me and my wife to their, or their son's /daughters or other relatives' weddings, and call you shortly before the occasion and say " oh, and will you make sure you bring your camera with you".

The guests can be a big problem but only if you let them. To stop that happening I would ask them to wait a moment, I would get the shot, and then I would move out of their way and let them at it.

Again it is all to do with how you handle people. If you are perceived as a professional most people won't interrupt or bother you. I mean would you walk into your doctor's surgery and tell them how to do their job?

A quick story. During the group photo at one wedding back in the late 1980s, one of the guests shouts at me "Have you film in that camera" (it was a common quirp from guests who thought they were comedians). I knew this would persist if not nipped in the bud. So I asked him to come up and check for himself. Everyone else laughed and the red-faced would-be comedian never said another word.
 

benjiboy

Subscriber
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
11,999
Location
U.K.
Format
35mm
I once did a wedding when the vicar asked the teenage groom "do you take this woman to be your lawful wedded wife", to which he replied " yea man that's what I turned up for", the vicar stopped the service, and said to the groom "this is a very serious matter, you are making an oath to God in his house", then as soon as the ceremony was over the bride's mother ran up to her new son in law, and punched him in the face !.
 

NB23

Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2009
Messages
4,307
Format
35mm
Wedding photography is an extreme sport requiring you to be athletic. Or young.

I’ve seen it all. It shifted so much from the film days until today. Back then it was a trade such as Plumbing or electricity. And it suddenly became a mainstream bullshit job.
 

foc

Subscriber
Joined
Jun 30, 2010
Messages
2,552
Location
Sligo, Ireland
Format
35mm
I once did a wedding when the vicar asked the teenage groom "do you take this woman to be your lawful wedded wife", to which he replied " yea man that's what I turned up for", the vicar stopped the service, and said to the groom "this is a very serious matter, you are making an oath to God in his house", then as soon as the ceremony was over the bride's mother ran up to her new son in law, and punched him in the face !.

:laugh::laugh::laugh:
 

abruzzi

Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2018
Messages
3,155
Location
New Mexico, USA
Format
Large Format
I appreciate your comments and it does seem that a wedding photographer need to be an extrovert.
I am an introvert and was very shy as a young man. I joined amateur drama to help overcome the shyness and it did help with handling people at a wedding.
BUT remember the bride & groom are also nervous on the day so I can empathise with that. It can also be an unique selling point (USP).
Some wedding photographers are so extravert that the wedding is run like it is their show not the couples

I have a lot of respect for those that can do weddings, but there are a lot of people who are simply not temperamentally suited to the job, including me. I’ve done a lot of event videography, but usually it was symposia, where I was capturing speakers and panels on stage (think like TED talks). One was very fun because it was a symposium on the current state of life extension science, and it was in the University of Pennsylvania Anthropology museum surrounded with Egyptian tombs and mummies. Very apropos, but even though these were events, i.e. if you missed the shot, you weren’t going to get it again, they didn’t have the level of tension that weddings seem to arouse.
 
Photrio.com contains affiliate links to products. We may receive a commission for purchases made through these links.
To read our full affiliate disclosure statement please click Here.

PHOTRIO PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Ilford ADOX Freestyle Photographic Stearman Press Weldon Color Lab Blue Moon Camera & Machine
Top Bottom