Ilford Purchased by Pemberstone Ventures Ltd

[pdeeh]

We're all doomed

 

[pbromaghin]

As a retired Chartered Accountant with some experience in business, I'm far from optimistic.

Consider that the directors/shareholders are all over 50 (public info on UK Government Company Register), so not too young to retire. They, with their landlords, come up with a scheme to build a smaller modern factory to secure the future of the business, with the remainder of the surplus land developed for housing,

The Local Authority rejects the plan (nimby-ism?). Along comes a far-sighted VC company, who know the Locsl Authority will not hold out for ever and can afford to waitm with an offer for Harman....can you blame the shareholders for selling out, realising their investment and effort and shedding the stress.

Do we really believe that the VC company want (in their eyes) a funny little factory for an obsolete old process, when their sights are on a development of a few hundred houses in an affluent and expanding area of the country,

It's been fun while it lasted, but if, like me, you like and use Harman products, I suggest it's time to stock the freezer.

Sorry, but there's a big hole in your logic. If they want the land and have time to wait, why not just buy the land and buy Harman out of their lease or wait for it to expire? You are proposing an awfully expensive and roundabout way to the same goal.

But look at the other businesses they own. It's a pretty offbeat mix, to say the least. Nearly all small players in niche markets, every bit as weird as a funny little film factory, plus commercial real estate development and management/leasing. They have the experience to run something like Ilford, plus the legal muscle and real estate sophistication to partner up to get the site redevelopment approved by higher governmental authority (probably receiving some share of the profits). They don't seem like the kind of people who would buy Ilford unless they were pretty sure the new factory could be made to happen. I can see no value in Ilford as anything other than an ongoing enterprise.

 

[blockend]

can you blame the shareholders for selling out, realising their investment and effort and shedding the stress.

Absolutely not, I'd do the same myself. The miracle is that film is still being made at all. That said, it is salutary to look back sixty years and see Ilford producing 800 ASA HPS to see the stasis in film production and research. There has been no new development in film as for a very long time and without new products to keep consumers interested, the medium is fighting a rearguard action. Black and white film is, at best, 1970s research based on 1930s technology so the long term prospects are uncertain, none of which is relevant to current photographers who want to fill their cameras with what's available.

I certainly hope Ilford keep making photographic film and paper at a price that allows enthusiasts to keep purchasing it in the volumes they require. Beyond that aspiration, we dare not hope.

 

[Ken Nadvornick]

...they [Harman] were always committed to analogue photography, and in selling the business, I would think that in doing so, would want to ensure there was a commitment from the new owners to carry on their work.

Do we really believe that the VC company want (in their eyes) a funny little factory for an obsolete old process, when their sights are on a development of a few hundred houses in an affluent and expanding area of the country...

Bookends...

 

[Lachlan Young]

Sorry, but there's a big hole in your logic. If they want the land and have time to wait, why not just buy the land and buy Harman out of their lease or wait for it to expire? You are proposing an awfully expensive and roundabout way to the same goal.

But look at the other businesses they own. It's a pretty offbeat mix, to say the least. Nearly all small players in niche markets, every bit as weird as a funny little film factory, plus commercial real estate development and management/leasing. They have the experience to run something like Ilford, plus the legal muscle and real estate sophistication to partner up to get the site redevelopment approved by higher governmental authority (probably receiving some share of the profits). They don't seem like the kind of people who would buy Ilford unless they were pretty sure the new factory could be made to happen. I can see no value in Ilford as anything other than an ongoing enterprise.

Another little detail that has been overlooked in 24 pages of obfuscation is that the factory sits in the middle of George Osborne's (Chancellor of the Exchequer) constituency & is probably one of the biggest single site manufacturing employers there.

 

[RobC]

Another little detail that has been overlooked in 24 pages of obfuscation is that the factory sits in the middle of George Osborne's (Chancellor of the Exchequer) constituency & is probably one of the biggest single site manufacturing employers there.

It once had nearly 2000 people on site. Now only 200 and 400 when the management buy out took place. i.e. its dropped by 50% since 2005.

 

[MartinP]

Black and white film is, at best, 1970s research based on 1930s technology so the long term prospects are uncertain, none of which is relevant to current photographers who want to fill their cameras with what's available.

During that time, Harman have come up with several iterations of their 'old' staples, a couple of versions of their 'new' Delta films, several new products for their own brands and a whole collection of designed and coated-to-order products for external resellers. And then that is not even mentioning all the new papers they are coming up with!! They are a research-led company. Very admirable in my opinion.

 

[AgX]

Black and white film is, at best, 1970s research based on 1930s technology so the long term prospects are uncertain, none of which is relevant to current photographers who want to fill their cameras with what's available.

You are completely wrong.

 

[Richard S. (rich815)]

Sorry, but there's a big hole in your logic. If they want the land and have time to wait, why not just buy the land and buy Harman out of their lease or wait for it to expire? You are proposing an awfully expensive and roundabout way to the same goal.

By doing it now when it appears it cannot be done they get it cheap and then let their lawyers work their magic and get the council's decision reversed.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Apologies for joining the discussion so late, yesterday was a little hectic...

I just wanted to post a something on here as I know Simon is a regular contributor and many will be expecting a response. Firstly I have to tell you that Simon exited the business when it was sold. Simon may well continue to be an APUG contributor in a personal capacity however I don't know that for sure.

Many of you have already read the press release about the sale of the business. I don't really have anything more to add on that front, other that to say it's definitely business as usual. This is an exciting time for all involved in the business, I've worked for Harman / Ilford for 28 years and this is yet another chapter in our story !

Harman will continue to support APUG and my Technical services team (David, Sue and Myself) will monitor and contribute to APUG. I have set up a "Harman Tech Service" APUG member which we will share between us.

Our primary technical support will continue to be via the "Contact Us" section of the Ilford Photo website.

Neil


Neil Hibbs
Manager Technical Services - Harman Technology Ltd

Welcome to APUG
Thank you for the update and clarification. We will miss Simon as our Ilford point of contact.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Just for kicks I sent Ken Rockwell a message saying he missed the news of the day. Here's his response. And why I am concerned for the future of Ilford.



I know he is loved and appreciated here. So it won't hurt to let him know it is indeed "photo news." 17 pages in under 24 hours begs to differ. I considered an e-mail bomb but they track that stuff too easily now.

I have always considered Ken Rockwell to be one of the great suppositories of information.

 

[BrianShaw]

Why has nobody yet said, "I saw that coming"? Kudos to them for avoiding leaks or rumors!

 

[Sirius Glass]

My pessimism is based on seeing good engineering companies being torn apart by selling off the profitable parts and leaving a rotting corps, not based on photographic companies.

 

[Sean]

Hi All, please continue discussions here: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Thanks,
Sean

 

[aoresteen]

Ilford - Simon AWOL?

Anyone know how Simon is doing? He hasn't been here since Sep. I hope he didn't leave Ilford due to their buyout in Sep.

http://www.bjp-online.com/2015/09/harman-ilford-film-purchased-pemberstone/

 

[RobC]

he left / retired call it what you will.

 

[bvy]

You think he'd still drop in to say "hi." We did think of him as more than just "the Iford guy." I did anyway.

 

[Stephen Prunier]

You think he'd still drop in to say "hi." We did think of him as more than just "the Iford guy." I did anyway.

I did too. He was always helpful. Didn't feel like he was talking piece for Ilford either. Now?

 

[aoresteen]

Well, I hope he pops in once & awhile. He does know film & paper very well and just not Ilford's stuff.

 

[mr rusty]

I expect it is difficult for him. If he surfaces everyone will want to interrogate him about the "behind the scenes" story.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Simon might not want to pop in because he would get inundated with Ilford questions that he cannot answer. Better for him to walk away for a while.

 

[bdial]

Maybe he rejoined with a fake noob ID

If so, welcome back Simon.

 

[railwayman3]

It may very well be that, under the terms of the sale, there is a confidentiality clause which prevents Simon commenting on any matters relating to Ilford/Harmon or their products and activities after his leaving the company. This would be standard procedure in any business sale or takeover.

 

[Ricardo Miranda]

Anyone know how Simon is doing? He hasn't been here since Sep. I hope he didn't leave Ilford due to their buyout in Sep.

http://www.bjp-online.com/2015/09/harman-ilford-film-purchased-pemberstone/

Hi

I know it is buried on page 14 of a huge thread, but this is the news that Simon had left Harman/Ilford: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

 

[drkhalsa]

It may very well be that, under the terms of the sale, there is a confidentiality clause which prevents Simon commenting on any matters relating to Ilford/Harmon or their products and activities after his leaving the company. This would be standard procedure in any business sale or takeover.

+1 I think this would be the reason.

As others, I would enjoy hearing from Simon.