Ilford Purchased by Pemberstone Ventures Ltd

[Roger Cole]

Hopefully this is good news?

Article on Ilford's page, from their Facebook page:

Ilford Purchased by Pemberstone Ventures Ltd

 

[Kiev88user]

Sounds hopeful - as a confirmed Ilford Delta user across a range of MF and 35mm cameras, an affordable range of B&W film is essential. My DLSR is increasingly taking a back-seat these days! Great to see a new generation taking an interest too.

Steve

 

[Ken Nadvornick]

Who owned Harman before this transaction? Did they own themselves? And if so, why sell if everything was going well?

In the USA this sort of news, followed by earnest public proclamations of continued stability and rosy futures for everyone involved, is usually terrifying for everyone involved. It's like the owners of a 0-10 professional athletic team earnestly assuring the head coach that his job is safe...

Are things different in the UK?

Ken

 

[Xmas]

Worse...

 

[destroya]

having worked with (not at) VC firms and knowing many VC's personally, in my mind this is bad news. they will do all they can to maximize profits, streamline operations and then try and take them public to cash out. Time for me to stock up on the ilford products I use

 

[pbromaghin]

It depends if these new guys have found an undervalued business that they believe can be lead to increase profitability from ongoing operations by injecting much-needed capital, or if they are just a bunch of vampiritic, empty-suit, spreadsheet jockeys, wanting to suck the carcass dry, like we see in Rochester.

 

[MartinP]

I haven't bought any Harman products since . . . ohhhh . . . last Saturday (at the time of posting it is now Monday). Now I'm wondering if I should have chosen another supplier, in order to better support future supplies, but who? Foma is the only other company making a decent range of paper, and overall Harman are better.

Hopefully, the companies bought out, milked dry and sold for scrap are only the few we hear about and most "investment" funds are saintly. However, I will wait for product-range "rationalisation", price increases and changes on the board of directors with trepidation.

 

[Roger Cole]

Who owned Harman before this transaction? Did they own themselves? And if so, why sell if everything was going well?

In the USA this sort of news, followed by earnest public proclamations of continued stability and rosy futures for everyone involved, is usually terrifying for everyone involved. It's like the owners of a 0-10 professional athletic team earnestly assuring the head coach that his job is safe...

Are things different in the UK?

Ken

My worries too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk and 100% recycled electrons - because I care.

 

[Bob Carnie]

It will be interesting to here Simon's thoughts on this.

 

[removed account4]

It will be interesting to here Simon's thoughts on this.

+1


according the the message on the iilford/harman
it suggested the folks at pemberstone will help with
advertising to the next generation of photographers.

 

[MattKing]

It will be interesting to here Simon's thoughts on this.

As he is probably one of the "sellers" he may not be able to comment.

 

[R.Gould]

As far as the UK goes VC companies are more often than not bad news, I would be concerned about the future of Ilford Products, Harman was the management buy out the last time that Ilford went bust, and they sold their manufacturing facility at Moberly to fund it, and leased it back, anyone know how long the lease has to run?, and this tends to make me wonder what will happen when the lease is up, Maybe time to think of other suppliers, such as Adox, or, maybe, Foma, I transfered to Foma years ago, around the time Ilford looked like going last time, and haven't come back to Ilford film, although I use mainly Kentmere paper,

 

[Roger Cole]

There is currently no subtitute for Ilford. Yes, Foma and Adox make good papers and Foma makes workable film (I've never used Adox film) but Ilford is THE name nowadays in black and white analog. I could live without any other company a lot easier than I could live without Ilford. In fact I could live without ALL of them and use only Ilford easier than I could live without Ilford.

 

[MartinP]

With the phrases 'looking to the next generation of photographers', 'next five years' and so on it seems that growth in sales is expected in the short term. If that is not achieved consistently, or not sufficiently so, then 2020 might be critical for Harman.

Edit: Regarding the land lease for the Mobberley site, it must be fairly long as Harman are building new facilities on it at the moment, aren't they?

Also, most of the 'new generation' of film users that I have met appear to have no interest in darkroom printing, so I wonder if Harman will go in to the scanner business instead of paper production? A bit like Kodak and their little printers....

 

[pdeeh]

in my mind this is bad news. they will do all they can to maximize profits, streamline operations and then try and take them public to cash out.

this.

I'm not normally a doom'n'gloom merchant, but I think the purchase by a VC outfit of Harman is (potentially) horrible news.

Time will tell of course

 

[Ai Print]

Wow, quite the shocker today, I'm cautiously optimistic though. I just don't let this kind of news change my buying or usage patterns and if anything I just stock up, use Ilford and Kodak about equally.

“Film has become an interesting medium for young photographers to work with again.We are seeing this very clearly. Our new owners will assist us to connect more effectively to this younger generation in the future, and we will prioritise this as our main goal over the next five years.”

This is very encouraging to me since I find the attitudes of young people and film, especially the darkroom, to be exponentially better overall than previous generations who seem to not actually get what it will take to carry film into the future and near constantly whine about what they have lost more than anything.

As with Kodak, Ilford I know you are reading this, you have my unwavering support and I will continue to help bring awareness to your brand and do anything I can to help keep the bright future of black and white film well into the future in talented hands.

Good luck in your new partnership!

 

[Bob Carnie]

Harmon has a solid footing in the inkjet market, and I am sure it is appealing to the new owners.

With the phrases 'looking to the next generation of photographers', 'next five years' and so on it seems that growth in sales is expected in the short term. If that is not achieved consistently, or not sufficiently so, then 2020 might be critical for Harman.

Edit: Regarding the land lease for the Mobberley site, it must be fairly long as Harman are building new facilities on it at the moment, aren't they?

Also, most of the 'new generation' of film users that I have met appear to have no interest in darkroom printing, so I wonder if Harman will go in to the scanner business instead of paper production? A bit like Kodak and their little printers....

 

[Roger Cole]

What Ai said. Ilford, as I said before, is the single best company in the world in black and white photography IMHO. I will keep supporting Ilford as long as Ilford keeps supporting me.

 

[MartinP]

Regarding the expected site expansion at Mobberley... I read on another forum that planning permission was refused by the local regulators. That may be one input in to the decision of the board to sell now.

 

[R.Gould]

There is currently no subtitute for Ilford. Yes, Foma and Adox make good papers and Foma makes workable film (I've never used Adox film) but Ilford is THE name nowadays in black and white analog. I could live without any other company a lot easier than I could live without Ilford. In fact I could live without ALL of them and use only Ilford easier than I could live without Ilford.

Hate to disagree, but I have used very little Ilford film or paper ever, I used Kodak when they produced it, along with Kentmere before the Harman buy out, when they decimated the kentmere range, I used Kodak film for most of my photography, mainly TriX, and for the last 10 years Foma film, and some Foma paper, but I would hate to see Ilford go, but personally, as long as Foma, Adox,(For their re made agfa paper,) are still around, the only thing I use from Harman is the Kentmere VC Select paper, it is the best RC paper I have ever used for toning, and if tat were to dissappear then that would affect my Greatly, as would the loss of the Fotospeed RCVC paper, which is coated for Fotospeed by Harman

 

[MartinP]

Harmon has a solid footing in the inkjet market, and I am sure it is appealing to the new owners.

Good point! The Harman and Harman-Hahnemule papers have an admirable reputation.

For non-professional users there could even be a market for a Harman scanner, despite my earlier joke. Currently there is only Reflecta making 35mm / 120 scanners? Or maybe they are just a reseller of anonymous Chinese products?

 

[RobC]

WARNING - what follows is 100% pure speculation from very limited knowledge

its been on the cards for over a year...

http://www.knutsfordguardian.co.uk/...ord_s_site_in_Mobberley_submitted_to_council/

That was rejected BUT the site is ripe for redevelopment and whilst Ilford would appear to hold the lease which I thought was something like 20 or 25 years, the owner of the site may well have something to say about it.
From what I've gleaned over a period of time and I haven't been following it closely, Ilford planned to redevelop its own production facility at the site.

What the status is now I don't know.

Venture capital companies are about making money and this one has investments in property and industrial sites. Their interest is likely to be in the redevlopment of the whole site and not Ilford but they'll probably be required to take Ilford along for the ride. They would probably have been happy if Ilford didn't exist as they would make faster money on a housing development.

But if ilford are secure then who cares. If Ilford aren't secure then screw em. I suspect Ilford couldn't afford the redevelopment so have sold out. So the real question is, how long have Ilford secured their own survival for if thats what they have tried to do. Will we ever know? I doubt it as there will be a company line to be trodden so as always with these things we'll just have to accept what we're told and suck it up. When the Ilford lease runs out anything could happen since it won't be Ilford calling the shots unless this venture capital company has purchased the site and iIlford have it written into their "partenership" contract with them that they get their redevelopment and land for keeps. But having announced that they have been bought would seem to indicate they have sold control. So I would be worried for the long term and possibly short term too.

p.s.
Ilford seem to have following screening application for redevelopment which is still live, these seem to precede full planning application. Maybe some decisions have been made but not yet published or someone knows something we don't which seems likely.

http://planning.cheshireeast.gov.uk/applicationDetails.aspx?pr=15/1728S

p.p.s. I see the case officer is Nick Turpin. I wonder if he is related to Dick.

 

[MDR]

I don't give a fig about the press release it is usually just a Punch of B.S. to appease the costumers and up the companies worth. But we should wait a few month to see how the new Ilford is run and behaves, before running around like chicken Little or better Nostradamus the Prophet of doom. Maybe the VC owner is film fan and wants to save the british film production heritage or maybe he is one of those disgusting real estate developers who destroy everything in their path to make a buck.

But honestly while Ilford, Kodak, Foma, Adox, Filmotec, are still making film and analogue products we should support them it is after all in our own interest.

 

[wildbill]

if film/paper prices stay the same or decrease, great. If they go up, that won't be good for anyone but pemberstone. I'd really like to continue buying ilford's stuff.

 

[Xmas]

But honestly while Ilford, Kodak, Foma, Adox, Filmotec, are still making film and analogue products we should support them it is after all in our own interest.

VCs don't give even figs...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cHcunREYzNY