Ilford Ilfobrom Rayon (what the whaa?)

[horacekenneth]

I came upon some Ilford Ilfobrom Rayon (Grades 2 & 3) here in Baltimore. The texture is insane! It feels like linoleum or maybe even more like one of those grip cloths you use to open jars. It looks great 18 inches away but put your face up to it and it looks like halftone dots. I can imagine not liking it for most applications but I was rather pleasantly stunned with how unique the texture is and it turned out great for the subject.

No idea how old it is, appears to be rather old but printed great. Very slight brown tone to the highlights and shadows. One odd thing was how long of an exposure and development it took. Exposure was quite a bit longer than I was expecting and no image appeared until 4 minutes in freshly mixed Dektol and the image didn't stop noticeably developing until after 5 minutes. Is that normal for older papers or something to do with Ilfobrom papers?

Has anyone used this paper before and for what? When did Ilford make it?

 

[Simon R Galley]

I guess it may be 50's or early 60's... I thought I had heard of everything....not this one!

If I recall Rayon was a trade name or somesuch from Imperial Chemical Industries ( the mighty ICI in the UK ) who owned ILFORD at that time and subsequently sold us to Ciba-Geigy of Switzerland.

I have to say you were lucky to get anything to come up....
Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

 

[David Allen]

I remember using some Ilfobrom with the Rayon surface. It would have been in the late sixties (I learned to print in 1968) and I am sure it was when Ilford products had the Sunburst logo (when was that introduced Simon?). Strange surfaces were all the rage in the camera clubs at the time and my memory of the Rayon surface was that it was like a 45 single (by the way, on the London circuit/salons THE number one surface was Agfa Velox? - which had a texture of velvet that you could 'brush' with your hand).

I am also pretty sure that T. Herbert Jones HonFRPS and his wife Lucy Jones FRPS used Rayon for some of the prints that I saw at their home in Catford.

Bests,

David.
www.dsallen.de

 

[Ian Grant]

My experience of old papers is that Ilfobrom, Kodak Bromide and similar bromide papers work remarkably well even when 50 to 60 years old, they lose a lot of speed and about a grade in contrast. I still have a box or two of Ilfobrom from the 60's, I tested it a couple of years ago.

I never saw the Rayon finish but there was something similar in Ilford's early RC papers, I really didn't like the sir face it disappeared quite quickly.

Ian

 

[pdeeh]

I made some contacts yesterday on 50+ year-old grade 2 Velox - needed a drop of benzotriazole and the dmax isn't what it might be, but otherwise fine.
Also made some contacts using nearly 70 year old lantern plates, Admiralty issue but I suppose made by Ilford, and they were less successful - very foggy highlights
The contacts were made from negatives I shot a couple of weeks ago on 70+ year-old nitrate film - tolerable for a bit of fun, but rather mottled. Fog levels remarkably low once I dumped ¼g of KBr in my D23 ...

(yes, I've read the HSE, Kodak and various other advisory documents about nitrate film, so I know what I'm dealing with)

 

[Gerald C Koch]

Rough textured papers are useful when you want to de-emphasize detail in the print. At one time a manufacturer like Kodak supplied papers in a dozen or more surfaces. Some were very coarse and had names like tweed, tapestry or canvas. Older editions of the Kodak Darkroom Data Guide contained actual samples of these papers. Sadly must surfaces are no longer made. They could be very effective artistically for certain subjects.

 

[paul_c5x4]

In praise of vintage Ilford papers

I have a few sheets of Ilfospeed sitting in the freezer labelled as a "silk" surface - Looking closely at it, it has a fine woven pattern to the surface. It liths beautifully and responds well to toning (sample below). Only last week, I picked up an assortment of 60s vintage paper and have already tried the Ilford Multigrade (version I in a yellow pack) which still works. Looking forward to trying another pack of Ilfospeed Silk which is slightly newer.

 

[GregW]

I've got a box of tweed surface kodak paper from the early 60s that has a wonderful look. Would love to try some of that velvet textured stuff mentioned early in the thread.
g

 

[Nige]

If I recall Rayon was a trade name or somesuch from Imperial Chemical Industries ( the mighty ICI in the UK ) who owned ILFORD at that time and subsequently sold us to Ciba-Geigy of Switzerland.

I didn't know that. I worked for an ICI owned Co. and even did a stint at Slough for a year!

I have a half pkt of Ilfobrom in the cupboard, been meaning to throw it out but maybe I will give it a run thru some devleoper!

 

[Gerald C Koch]

It's not quite the same thing but you can get some of the feel of these rough surface papers. Make a mask from photographing actual fabric and then sandwich the mask with a negative of your choice. You will see the texture in the print and from a distance it will give some of the effect. Your mask negative should be quite thin. I would also suggest using a matte paper to avoid reflections.

 

[MartinP]

Another reason for using textured finish papers for commercial-event prints etc. was to make copying (by re-photographing the print) more difficult and preserve the income stream of the photographer. I recall using an Agfa paper that had tiny "dots" on the surface, similar to a table-tennis bat covering except much smaller. When lit on a copy-stand the image would be covered in tiny highlights.

 

[Molli]

I have plenty of Ilfobrom paper, including a 3.5"x5" packet of the Rayon surface. The only negatives I printed to it were some, ahem, "tasteful" nudes of a lady and her puppy. The photos are suspected to have been taken in the 50s at a place called Fox Studios in Melbourne, Australia. Apparently the studio and models were rented out by the hour which I'm sure was only half as seedy as it sounds!
No appreciably long printing or developing times with this or any other Ilfobrom papers.
I also have Argenta Linen papers dating back to who knows when. It feels like sandpaper until you get it into the developer where it becomes a soggy cloth tube that one is tempted to put in the washing machine for a good, archival wash! Both Argenta's Linen and Metallic papers seem to take a seventy second exposure regardless of the print size or enlarger height which is really weird but makes consistency a breeze!

 

[cmacd123]

I recall seeing some prints on a paper that looked like very shinny cloth. this was back when I was in High School in the 1960 era. I do vaguely recall the fellow who was making them had the paper is a yellow Illford box, so it was earlier than the Starburst logo.

(I still miss the starburst Logo, I think it was even used as the dots between the numbers on roll film backing paper.) It always seems like it is just MISSING on the modern packages.

(And who remembers the aluminium 35mm film cassettes)