If you could automate your film processing, would you?

[Andrew O'Neill]

the closest thing to automation i would do and have done
is put the film in containers and pour developer in there and leave the room for 1/2 hour ...
its nore really automation

I've been guilty of that.

 

[BHuij]

The skepticism is understandable. And I may well not hit the $300 price point that I'm aiming for. But this isn't just a random number I threw out there because it sounded good. We're fairly early in the design and engineering process, but so far we are very much on track to hit our price point.

$300 sounds insane if you start by looking at the price of a Jobo.

What I have done instead is approach this as an engineering problem with really well defined goals broken down into relatively simple steps: basically, get several volumes of liquid into and out of a moving tank at a consistent temperature in a way that is reliable and repeatable. I don't think it has to cost 4 figures to achieve this end goal.

By all means, keep the feedback coming!

 

[Craig75]

i'd prefer an alternative to nova print processor than a film processor.

 

[calebarchie]

i'd prefer an alternative to nova print processor than a film processor.

Soon...

 

[calebarchie]

Over the years, every kid and their dog has proposed this, good luck to you.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I horde all my exposed C-41 in the freezer until I have enough to justify buying a kit and then I develop it all in a matter of a few days. So once a year just about I develop all my C-41 that I accumulate. I get about 24 rolls out of a standard kit before weird things start to happen. At around 24 rolls I switch over to junk expired stuff and can get about another 10 rolls out of the kit.

I do something like that.

 

[Craig75]

Soon...

Nice. I love people who can see a problem and sit down and make a solution. Those Nova processors are very clever and elegant solution but not a £300-700 solution. I dont even need a heated one - just some slopey perspex, drains,floatey lids, and a print holders and I'd be happy. I could make one but I'm an idiot

top work Sir/Madam !

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

No. The volume of film I process doesn't justify automation. It's tempting though.

 

[Cholentpot]

I do something like that.

Hording or using the chems past?

 

[mshchem]

The skepticism is understandable. And I may well not hit the $300 price point that I'm aiming for. But this isn't just a random number I threw out there because it sounded good. We're fairly early in the design and engineering process, but so far we are very much on track to hit our price point.

$300 sounds insane if you start by looking at the price of a Jobo.

What I have done instead is approach this as an engineering problem with really well defined goals broken down into relatively simple steps: basically, get several volumes of liquid into and out of a moving tank at a consistent temperature in a way that is reliable and repeatable. I don't think it has to cost 4 figures to achieve this end goal.

By all means, keep the feedback coming!

I have a CPP2 and a Duolab, Kodak 11 and 16k drum processors, 30 or 40 different roll film tanks, 20 or more hard rubber tanks, big 8x10 SS tanks etc etc. SO YES I would probably have to have one of these things too. Best thing about Jobo is when processing film, I get my hands in the warm water, invariably nature calls. Gives me a couple minutes to, well you know. Fully automated, I could go take a nice warm bath Even at $500 this would be a hit. Paterson reels are easier than any other reel for me, except of course 35mm Hewes, I have both standard and "Paterson/Jobo" Hewes reels. I think standardizing on a Paterson core diameter is DEFINITELY the way to go. The more you can fit this into standard "architecture" the more people would accept it.

For sheet film I have Jobo Expert tanks 3005,06.10. But for 4x5 I'm just as likely to use 2509n reels and a 2500 series tank.

IF YOU WANT TO GET RICH, make a cheap STEREO IR night vision goggle setup. I use Jakks Pacific SPYNET toy IR googles strapped to my face with bungee cords to load everything now that I'm 60. Greatest thing since Donald Paterson invented the self loading reel! One camera and IR LEDs mean you can see, but NO depth perception, try lighting candles on a birthday cake with one eye closed, you'll see what I mean.

Don't get discouraged, film is here for a long time to come. The reason Jobo survives and thrives is you need to process your own film.
Best Wishes, Mike

 

[Ko.Fe.]

It made me think what bugs me must in developing. And it is agitation.
The rest needs no automation for me.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hording or using the chems past?

Yes

 

[Cholentpot]

Yes

What you have in freezer now? I think I have 2 rolls of Max 400, a roll of 160NC, a roll of 400VC, some Fuji 400 of some sort and a roll of Ektar 100 120 that'll be done any day. Got some way's to go before I get a kit.

 

[btaylor]

I don't mind the process of developing film manually, but I don't enjoy it either-- it's boring! Get it done automatically for a $300 investment with a small footprint? Yes! I'm in. As someone else mentioned I have seen a number of similar proposals over the years that have not come to fruition. Good luck to you. If you make it I'll buy it. I always wanted a Phototherm machine, but I do not do enough volume to justify one.

 

[c41]

Another +1 for C41 process, I’d definitely buy something like this for that purpose.

Black and white development i enjoy, twist twist pat pat, it’s therapeutic to me.

 

[slx]

+1 yes

 

[calebarchie]

Nice. I love people who can see a problem and sit down and make a solution. Those Nova processors are very clever and elegant solution but not a £300-700 solution. I dont even need a heated one - just some slopey perspex, drains,floatey lids, and a print holders and I'd be happy. I could make one but I'm an idiot

top work Sir/Madam !

Cheers! I had found a cheap used nova in the UK however the shipping was about 4x cost to AUS and it was risky so I got to work on this. Its a much more robust design, thicker materials, slotted and bolted construction, no fragile glass heating element with heat/cooling support. Knowing the raw material costs for these kind of units I'd say Nova is making a healthy profit....
I'm working on so many more projects ATM that I would like to reach people but amongst work, uni and life in general it is taking a long time to finish. I hope to build a new workshop where I can produce these units for others although it is merely a hobby for me.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I posted this over on Reddit as well, but wanted to inquire here as well. The Reddit analog sub is a good place to get feedback from people who are shooting a lot of 35mm C-41, but I suspect APUG has a more mature user base, and probably a much higher percentage of photogs developing their own films at home rather than outsourcing to a lab. Without further ado, here goes:

My brother and I are considering Kickstarting a unit similar to a Jobo, which does rotary processing for films from 35mm (or smaller) up to 8x10. The idea is that you can customize your steps by order of chemicals, time, and temperature. You load your film into the developing tank, fill up the chemical reservoirs in whatever order you want them to go, and then press go. Come back in 25 minutes or whatever and your film is ready to hang up to dry. Could be used for B&W, C-41, E-6, or even RA4 prints if you wanted.

Personally I've been using rotary processing for my own 4x5 work (and a hand tank for roll films), and I'm very happy with the results. But since the process is manual, I get tired of standing around waiting for 12 minutes of dev time (or what have you) and then switching out the chemicals. It would be nice to be able to set it and forget it so I could use that time for something else (like darkroom printing) while the film goes on its own in the background. In my head I imagine being able to process an entire vacation worth of 4x5 sheets in the background while I work on darkroom printing, with a minimum of interruptions - just trading out the film for an undeveloped sheet about every half hour.

We're aiming for the lowest possible price point to make this accessible to casual hobbyists, which I think is where we find our niche in the market - automatic film processing units exist already (i.e. Jobo), but they ain't cheap and usually they're quite large. So far, we're on track to be under the $300 mark, and the unit should fit on top of your average bathroom sink. I'm just wanting to do a little market research to gauge interest in the idea before we spend any more money on prototyping. We're in the early stages of design and prototyping, with very promising results so far (and a lot of work yet to do) Feedback would be welcome from my fellow film shooters.

To the mods, hopefully this post doesn't violate the rules of the forum. The film community is one I love to be a part of, and I'm just wanting to get some feedback on our idea. If we do decide to take this to market, I hope to help spread the news about the Kickstarter here as well. Thanks all!

TL;DR: My brother and I are designing a "set it and forget it" film processing unit for all formats up to 8x10, it should be under $300. Is this interesting to anyone besides me?

 

[RalphLambrecht]

very interested but make sure that it takes standard film dev tanks such as Jobo. Otherwise, you'll have trouble with people willing to try.

 

[Mick Fagan]

I have shed loads of Jobo reels, tanks and just stuff. If I couldn't use Jobo reels I probably wouldn't contemplate your unit.

Jobo reels are about the easiest 135 format reels I have ever used, period. It would need to take my 2509 4x5" reels as well.

My CPE2 is around 30 years old now, bought new, but it is getting rickety. I have a complete spare, but it doesn't have the lift.

Sounds very interesting.

Mick.

 

[Wallendo]

I would probably buy it for $500 or less, but I find it hard to envision how a completely automated machine can be manufactured for such a low price.

One key feature that I would want is easy cleaning. Automated processing loses a lot of its luster when it take an hour to clean afterwards.

 

[piffey]

I'd be in for $300, hands down. I don't always get the time to process so end up stacking 30-40 rolls of film at a time then spending days getting all caught up when I finally have a breather in my work schedule (if there is time and there is light I'd just rather shoot instead of process). I shot some 4x5 that sat in the box for 1.5 years before I had the time to work with it. It's hard to dedicate 20 minutes to 6 4x5 frames or 8 rolls of film (in the big Patterson), especially when I'm on call for work and have to drop everything at a moment's notice. Something automated that I could fire up, leave it be, then come back at any time would be perfect. If it did the final rinse with photo-flo and all I could load it up, run to the store and come back to hang that would be a delight.

Edit: I've also never understood why we don't have a small, compact equivalent of the drug store processing machines at this point. Pull out leader of film, load into the rollers and let it slide through chemicals and out the other side.

 

[Kawaiithulhu]

Try to not forget that the $300 has to account for tooling costs, floating the spare parts inventory, warranty replacements, repair service, customer service and tech support, marketing, and God forbid you should actually want to be paid for all the R&D and ramp-up effort in addition to ongoing salaries.
Good times! Best of luck, I enjoy seeing a good engineering challenge met and exceeded!

 

[Eric Rose]

If I could get someone else to process my film to my specifications that would be just fine by me. Unfortunately the way I process my film does not lend itself to automation. Processing film is the least interesting/enjoyable step in analog photography for me at least.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I find it meditative...crank up the Blues.