If there were no film...

[perkeleellinen]

Without film, photography would be limited to family snaps and shots for ebay. The darkroom is a crucial part of creative photography and cannot be replaced by the computer - a business machine as far as I'm concerned. I'd replace photography with drawing.

 

[PKM-25]

I have used digital for over 20 years and film going on 40, while I see a place for both and enjoy both mediums equally, I do not enjoy the digital attitude towards film, which would get far far worse if film was totally gone. That being said, I would sell everything, get out of the craft and the business and go and get a science degree and do something entirely different for the rest of my life....if film were to go completely, which it won't...

 

[Roger Cole]

So, if I use my DSLR to produce an image of my kids that I put on Facebook, it's a photograph, because it's "commercial", and it's the artifact that counts. But if I use the same process to produce an image that is sold in an art gallery, it's not a photograph, because it's "art", and it's the process that counts? Seriously?

Whoever labeled Man Ray's photograms "cameraless photography" must not have gotten the memo.

No, it's an "image."

I added the bit about commercial on the spur of the moment.

Hybrid throws a monkey wrench and makes something neither fish nor fowl, neither electronic image or photograph I suppose.

I'd just prefer clearer terms. I don't have it all worked out, but I know that digital isn't really what I think of when I think of "photography" though, to be fair, "photography" means something like "painting with light" and in that case it does apply.

 

[removed account4]

Whoever labeled Man Ray's photograms "cameraless photography" must not have gotten the memo.

what do you mean by this ?
man ray never made photograms, maholy-nagy did ... man ray made rayographs ..

are you suggesting his ( or maholy nagy's ) photographic images shouldn't be called cameraless photographs, or photographs?

 

[DesertNate]

Are you kidding me, Original Poster?
If both Kodak and Fuji stopped making photographic film, there would be a lot of money for companies like Ilford, Efke, etc. to produce film at higher prices.

 

[moose10101]

what do you mean by this ?
man ray never made photograms, maholy-nagy did ... man ray made rayographs ..

And I guess Ansel made "Adamsographs"?

http://www.iphf.org/Hall_Of_Fame/Inducties_Bios/Man_Ray_Bio.html

Also in 1921, man Ray moved to Paris and made the first of what he called “Rayographs.” Also known as photograms, these images were produced by placing objects directly onto photographic paper and then exposing them to light.

are you suggesting his ( or maholy nagy's ) photographic images shouldn't be called cameraless photographs, or photographs?

Of course not; please read the post I responded to (and disagreed with), which argued that artistic digital images shouldn't be called photographs because they don't use the original photographic process (camera, film, darkroom). My point is that you can't exclude one without also excluding the other. I exclude neither.

 

[removed account4]

And I guess Ansel made "Adamsographs"?

http://www.iphf.org/Hall_Of_Fame/Inducties_Bios/Man_Ray_Bio.html

Also in 1921, man Ray moved to Paris and made the first of what he called “Rayographs.” Also known as photograms, these images were produced by placing objects directly onto photographic paper and then exposing them to light.



Of course not; please read the post I responded to (and disagreed with), which argued that artistic digital images shouldn't be called photographs because they don't use the original photographic process (camera, film, darkroom). My point is that you can't exclude one without also excluding the other. I exclude neither.

thanks for the reference ...
manray never called his images photograms but now, everyone else seems to ....

if adams actually called his work adamsographs, then yes, you should call them the same way he referred to them.
as you just posted, manray actually called his cameraless work rayographs, maholy nagy called his own cameraless work photograms, and nowadays ....
maybe because maholy nagy's images were more widely known, and he taught at art schools or
because of his connection with water gropius or the big names in art and art history ... his terminology stuck.

i did see your post and i do agree with most of what you said
... no, you can't exclude any of it ( not lumi paints, or suntan prints, or long exposed chemicalfree images either)

 

[E. von Hoegh]

I'd go to plates for the view cameras. I'll be tinkering with collodion soon anyway.

 

[pbromaghin]

I'd be done. I hate the digital process. I've been making my living staring at a monitor and wrapping my fingers around a mouse for 30 years and rarely touch a computer during evenings or weekends. If film went I'd dig in the garden or go to the gym.

 

[hdeyong]

I spent 30 years with film, then because we travelled through airports a lot, and at that time, they were happily destroying my film, I switched to the electro-camera-of-the-month club.
Phooey.
About 4 months ago, I started collecting a good bunch of film gear again, joined APUG, and am planning a dark room. Sitting in front of a computer fiddling around with software probably is photography, but not for me. For me, it's 'image capture', which a lot of people are going to say is what film does, but maybe it's the very spirit of the process that separates them. For me, anyway.
I kept my digital stuff for vacation snaps and eBay ads, which as far as I'm concerned is all it's good for.
There is no connection to the process for me like there is when developing and printing film. It all just feels remote. You move your mouse, click it, and the electronic image on the monitor changes. Don't like it? Just click again, and again.....
I think, having used both, (and this'll really get people going), photography is like music. You have to practice and learn and work hard to create a good silver print, and you have to do the same to play the guitar well. It doesn't take much to put a CD in the player and turn it on, set the bass and treble, and away you go, which equates to digital.

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

I'd be done. I hate the digital process. I've been making my living staring at a monitor and wrapping my fingers around a mouse for 30 years and rarely touch a computer during evenings or weekends. If film went I'd dig in the garden or go to the gym.

That's my case too. I don't mind other people doing digital photography, it's just that I cannot bring myself to love digital photography/imaging. It's just not in me. Bores me to tears.
And, I spend 40 hours pretty much in front of a computer screen anyway. It's difficult enough to even watch TV once I'm not at work - why should I want to go home and continue staring at a freaking screen? No thanks.

 

[ChristopherCoy]

And, I spend 40 hours pretty much in front of a computer screen anyway.

Welcome to my world. As a 911/Police dispatcher, for 40 hours a week I sit in front of SIX monitors, THREE computers, THREE keyboards, and FOUR mice.

 

[blansky]

I'm sort of surprised how much the "busman's holiday" is a factor in people liking/disliking digital.

To me the computer is just a means to an end, but I do understand the overdosing aspect.

Personally I hated darkroom work. Locked in the dark for hours on end......But then, I kinda like my wife.

I was never happier when I finally sold the trays, enlargers etc etc and could work in the light, watch TV, look at porn, surf the web, write rude comments, look at porn, talk on the phone etc.

To say nothing about the ease of retouching.

 

[E. von Hoegh]

What did the glazier do when he ran out of glass? He drank from the bottle.

 

[Vaughn]

If all film disappeared from commercial production I would make my own. I would also spend time going through 35 years worth of negatives that I have ignored because I tend to be more interested in the latest negatives.

 

[E. von Hoegh]

Are you kidding me, Original Poster?
If both Kodak and Fuji stopped making photographic film, there would be a lot of money for companies like Ilford, Efke, etc. to produce film at higher prices.

I believe Ilford, Efke, etc. are the "others" the OP mentioned.

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

I'm sort of surprised how much the "busman's holiday" is a factor in people liking/disliking digital.

To me the computer is just a means to an end, but I do understand the overdosing aspect.

Personally I hated darkroom work. Locked in the dark for hours on end......But then, I kinda like my wife.

I was never happier when I finally sold the trays, enlargers etc etc and could work in the light, watch TV, look at porn, surf the web, write rude comments, look at porn, talk on the phone etc.

To say nothing about the ease of retouching.

I like your wife too (I'm sure), but not like you do (I think). So I'll keep the trays, please...

I understand your photography is of the professional kind, so I can understand the relief from having to go into the darkroom, as opposed to me being an amateur, only going into the darkroom when I choose to, because I want to. Huge difference.

 

[batwister]

I'd give it up and go back to painting/drawing.

It is possible to draw and make photographs. Not at the same time of course...

 

[Diapositivo]

I certainly wouldn't (I use both technologies).

Incidentally, I don't think that B&W film and chemical production will ever end, so my personal question is what would I do if colour film ceased to exist.

I think is that, although I never practice black & white, if colour film disappeared I think I would finally begin dedicating my photographic time to B&W also. This is something that I should do in any case, sooner or later. And the same goes for my own printing, and for medium format. I would begin exploring all those regions of photography where I never ventured.

 

[Marvin]

No I would not quit photography if film went away but I don't think it will. I use film and digital, two Nikon DSLRs, 4 Nikon film SLRs including an F5 and several older Minolta SLRs. I also use medium format Bronica and LF Toyo 4x5 so I like film, but overall my love of photography wouldn't let me stop. I have been asked to photograph the Vacation Bible School at my church and that will be all digital but if I head to the coast to photograph lighthouses I would take both film and digital. I don't think you have to choose sides just enjoy!
Marvin

 

[Roger Cole]

I'm sort of surprised how much the "busman's holiday" is a factor in people liking/disliking digital.

To me the computer is just a means to an end, but I do understand the overdosing aspect.

Personally I hated darkroom work. Locked in the dark for hours on end......But then, I kinda like my wife.

I was never happier when I finally sold the trays, enlargers etc etc and could work in the light, watch TV, look at porn, surf the web, write rude comments, look at porn, talk on the phone etc.

To say nothing about the ease of retouching.

I like my wife too. She's a poet and needs alone time to write, and she encourages me to take alone time in the darkroom. We often (well, ok, not that often because our weekends have been too full of other things and I work nights during the week anyway, but sometimes) have evenings when she sits down to write, I go down into the darkroom, and we meet again perhaps a couple of hours later for a drink and a movie.

Personally I LOVE the atmosphere of the darkroom. It's quiet, dimly lit, I almost always play some jazz while printing (usually streaming WWOZ from New Orleans) - I find it meditative and relaxing. The very last thing I want is more media distraction and over-stimulation from task at hand courtesy of the ADD generation. "Never his mind on where he IS, humm? What he is DOING! Hmm? - Yoda."

Of course people are different and that's wonderful!

 

[Poisson Du Jour]

I would not continue photography in the absence of film. Many who know me are well aware of my stand on this.
I have absolutely no belief in "digital photography", neither as an 'art' or as a 'science' propagated by digital fanbois.

 

[michaelbsc]

I would make it.

EDIT: Actually, I would probably make glass plates rather than film. Like this: http://albumen.conservation-us.org/library/c19/petschler.html


Steve.

I've been saving glass for a while.

 

[welly]

I think, having used both, (and this'll really get people going), photography is like music. You have to practice and learn and work hard to create a good silver print, and you have to do the same to play the guitar well. It doesn't take much to put a CD in the player and turn it on, set the bass and treble, and away you go, which equates to digital.

With all due respect, this is absolute rubbish. Playing a CD is nothing whatsoever like taking a photograph with a digital camera. At the end of the day, the only real difference between digital photography and analogue/film photography is the medium on which the "negative" is stored.

Silver prints can as much be the end product of a digital negative as a film negative can be digitally printed. A digital negative can be produced using a view camera as much as a film negative can be produced using a point and shoot camera! Digital photography is no less a process than film photography. It's just different. And I say this as someone who's only digital camera is the one on my mobile phone.

Yes, you did get people (or me, at least) going!

 

[Poisson Du Jour]

With all due respect, this is absolute rubbish. Playing a CD is nothing whatsoever like taking a photograph with a digital camera. At the end of the day, the only real difference between digital photography and analogue/film photography is the medium on which the "negative" is stored.

Silver prints can as much be the end product of a digital negative as a film negative can be digitally printed. A digital negative can be produced using a view camera as much as a film negative can be produced using a point and shoot camera! Digital photography is no less a process than film photography. It's just different. And I say this as someone who's only digital camera is the one on my mobile phone.

Yes, you did get people (or me, at least) going!

Another film vs digital debate... here on APUG!?