I am happy with my 135 kit, now I need to complete my 120 kit

[narsuitus]

I have tried to find this but I cannot seem to create the correct string of words in search to find the difference between a C220 and a 330.

Search for "Mamiya C"

http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Mamiya_C

 

[derelict]

First, take a look at your favorite car and family photos. Would they work better in square or rectangular format (sure, you can crop a rectangle to a square and vice versa, but why if you don't have to).

An ETRS with a grip and prism handles much like a 35mm (though obviously larger and heavier). Without the prism and grip, it's surprisingly compact. A C330 is much heavier, even more so with a prism. A Rollei or Yashica TLR eliminates (for practical purposes) interchangeable lenses and prisms.

For car shows, I suspect you need a wide angle. Any show I've been to has been too crowded to use a normal lens (the further away you are the more likely to have someone walk in front of you). A waist level finder (or 90 deg finder) is nice as I find myself often trying to get the camera lower when photographing a car.

All fantastic points. Most of my photos are either 6x9, standard 135, or 4:3 (digital). I have never shot square photos before so I'm not sure. 645 would probably suit me better.

 

[frank]

There are plenty of Bronica and Mamiya 645 SLR's to choose from. They seem to fit your desired criteria the best.

 

[Kirks518]

Is the Russian MF stuff really Zeiss quality? I ask as I have read the opposite.

Thanks for the information about the weight of the RB 67. I am not interested in something that heavy. While the C330 is no light weight, it balances pretty well due to the layout. Is the Mamiya 645 really that much lighter?

The Kowa 66 intrigues me as well. People seem to like them, when they work.

I just weighed my M645 1000S, with the 80mm f/1.9 (heavier then the normal lens) and metered prism. That all weighs in at 4.3 lbs, about half of the RB.

 

[derelict]

I can handle that amount. I'm going to search for a good 645 Mamiya or Bronica set up. I will get more use out of that than a square foot what I shoot most. Doesn't mean I won't eventually get a TLR but that's later.

Appreciate all the feedback.

 

[Alan Gales]

I can handle that amount. I'm going to search for a good 645 Mamiya or Bronica set up. I will get more use out of that than a square foot what I shoot most. Doesn't mean I won't eventually get a TLR but that's later.

Appreciate all the feedback.

You might look at the Pentax 645 system too. I've owned a Bronica ETRsi and all three of the Pentax 645 cameras. Both the Pentax 645n and 645nll are much better than the original 645. If you like autofocus, auto film advance and matrix metering they are great. I now own a Mamiya C220 f and I used to own an RZ67. I'm sure the Mamiya 645 system is really nice too. If you like everything manual with no meter then the Bronica is a good choice.

You really can't go wrong with any of the three brands. Just decide which you like.

 

[Antonio Marques]

There's a metering prism with auto exposure for the Bronica.
But my ETRSi doesn't like to be handheld. At least to me, no MF SLR does. A TLR or folder are much easier to keep steady; I have no experience with RF, I suppose they either should handle well or be an oxymoron.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I am happy with what I have for 35mm (Pentax P30T, MX, and Petri 35). I have been using a Zeiss Ercona 1 folder (105/ 3.5 6x9) and while I like it for walking around town (quite light meter reading and guessing distance is not too difficult) I am looking for something that is still portable but has interchangeable lenses for family and car show shooting situations, which is where a majority of my shooting happens. The folder is a perfect walk around town camera as it is light and portable but lacks in a few areas for me. I am looking for something more. My stipulation is that I am not looking for a tripod only machine and that I would like a waist level viewer. Open to TLR or the more typical 120 body. Must be able to handhold without too much difficulty.

I am used to the 135 and 6x9 aspect ratio but open to 6x6 or 645. I am looking to spend somewhere around $250 for a camera with general purpose lens and a 120 back (if required, which TLRs do not). I have played with a C330 and really liked it but also interested in other suggestions.

You'd like a Mamiya6 but you won't get it on your budget.

 

[derelict]

Although I love Pentax, the 645 I do not. It's an awkward thing for me to hold and the lack of a waist level finder takes it off the list for me.

I'm looking at either a Mamiya 645 or a Bronica. I know a little more about the Mamiya than the Bronica. Both are well liked with an edge going to the M.

 

[MattKing]

In my experience, whenever I put my waist level finder on my Mamiya 645 Pro, I inevitably encounter a subject that demands being photographed in portrait orientation. And that means either weird contortions, or putting the prism finder back on.

I like having that extra finder as an option, but it gets very little use.

 

[Paul Howell]

In my experience, whenever I put my waist level finder on my Mamiya 645 Pro, I inevitably encounter a subject that demands being photographed in portrait orientation. And that means either weird contortions, or putting the prism finder back on.

I like having that extra finder as an option, but it gets very little use.

+1, in the early 70s my parents bought me a Konica Omgeaflex, 6X7 not really a TLR, it was twin lens with a direct view of the upper lens, there was no good way to turn it for a landscape orientation. I traded it in for Mamiya C33 then later a Kowa SL 66. As I usually print 810 and 11X14 it is really a 645 but I don't need to deal with the orientation, crop which every way I want.

 

[derelict]

Going 6x6 would eliminate the whole portrait or landscape issue

For me, most of my shots are either at car shows or of family. I live in the suburbs so there is not a ton of street shooting happening. Having a WLF will help me get a lower vantage point. Something like a hub high (lug nuts) shoot with me having to get on hands and knees to squint through a view finder.

I just did some checking and I can get noon functioning prism fingers for about $100. Since I carry a Sekonic around anyway, if I needed the different finder, I could always swap. I'm looking for a 645 kit, probably going with Mamiya over Bronica though. Just send to be more prevalent from what I've found.

 

[MattKing]

Square is good for car shows (Mamiya C330 and Ektachrome):

 

[derelict]

Square is good for car shows (Mamiya C330 and Ektachrome):

View attachment 161178

Not bad. Ford Squire? But, what if you wanted a 3/4 shot, how easy is that to compose on a 6x6? Serious question.

 

[MattKing]

Not bad. Ford Squire? But, what if you wanted a 3/4 shot, how easy is that to compose on a 6x6? Serious question.

Not exactly sure what you mean about a "3/4 shot", but this (cropped) shot was on the same roll:

One thing to take into account: I used to shoot weddings with this camera, and with the exception of the proofs, all the prints were rectangular.

With experience, it is easy to compose in rectangular even when the screen shows square.

I do prefer a screen with at least some grid lines though.

 

[TooManyShots]

The RB and RZ are heavy system. Sure, you can walk around with it and doing street photography. I had the RZ for a brief period but didn't get much use.....because it is very uncomfortable to walk around with it....without a carrying bag. You can not hold it with one hand...and the system is front heavy. Is like holding a cinder block, literally. Yeah, the negatives are gorgeous but...because of the size and weight, you won't want to shoot with it much. Currently, I am using a Hasselblad 553elx with a Carl Zeiss 80mm. Mint condition and got it a nice deal $200 from another long time forum member. With the Hasselblad, with size and weight, is like carrying a 35mm SLR. I can easily hold it with one hand and to check for the composition.

 

[Alan Gales]

The RB and RZ are heavy system. Sure, you can walk around with it and doing street photography. I had the RZ for a brief period but didn't get much use.....because it is very uncomfortable to walk around with it....without a carrying bag. You can not hold it with one hand...and the system is front heavy. Is like holding a cinder block, literally. Yeah, the negatives are gorgeous but...because of the size and weight, you won't want to shoot with it much. Currently, I am using a Hasselblad 553elx with a Carl Zeiss 80mm. Mint condition and got it a nice deal $200 from another long time forum member. With the Hasselblad, with size and weight, is like carrying a 35mm SLR. I can easily hold it with one hand and to check for the composition.

The RZ is my favorite medium format camera when on a tripod. Off the tripod I completely agree with you. I had a Hasselblad for a while with just the 80mm lens. Additional lenses were expensive so I sold it and recently bought a Mamiya C220 F.

 

[TooManyShots]

I had used the C330 for a brief period too. Is smaller and well build. Exceptionally bright viewfinder...better than all of the fixed lens TLRs. I sold my collection in order to get the RZ.. Heheheh.... I thought with a larger format, I would get better sharper and smooth grain negatives. Yeah, I got that from the RZ but it turns out it wasn't fun carrying it around. Just me but I prefer to be stealthy when I am out shooting. With the RZ, you become the center of attentions....

 

[Ko.Fe.]

6x6 never worked for me. I've had Mamiya C33 with two lenses. Meh, for walking and close focusing. Mamiya 645 fits $250 bill with second lens and it is way better to TLR for portraits and walk, focus, frame with. Just not sexy.
If 6x6 TLR, I'll just skip interchangeable lenses and get Rolleicord. It is show stopper at cars shows and works for family portraits as well. And lens has something no Japaneese will do.

 

[derelict]

Just stumbled upon this. Why I am going 645 in one picture. I have decided it will be a Mamiya as well. I might eventually end up with a TLR but the SLR is a bit more flexible at the moment.

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

Is the Russian MF stuff really Zeiss quality? I ask as I have read the opposite.

Thanks for the information about the weight of the RB 67. I am not interested in something that heavy. While the C330 is no light weight, it balances pretty well due to the layout. Is the Mamiya 645 really that much lighter?

The Kowa 66 intrigues me as well. People seem to like them, when they work.

The optics are just as good as the German stuff. It was the bodies that lacked the build quality. But you get around that by buying one that has been overhauled by one of the specialists, Arax or Hartblei. That adds a couple bucks to the price, but well worth it. They're still mechanically less refined than a Hasselblad, but when you're paying pocket change, that is much less a concern. And besides, it's the glass that makes the picture, not the body.

 

[BrianShaw]

I don't know why very few recommendations for later Rolleicords. Its light, its cheap, focus screen strike a balance between brightness and sharpness, its accessories are plenty and what not...

I generally stay out of these kind of threads because other people's indecision drives me crazy!

When I wanted to get into MF years ago I opted for a Rolleicord Vb. I was more than willing to give up the interchangeable lens requirement. The Vb served me well for about 30 years. Me, it and a monopod traveled the world. 30 years later I "upgraded" to a Hasselblad and a few lenses, but I'm still thinking I did my best work with the Rolleicord.

 

[baachitraka]

Apart from Rolleicord, I have acquired a Pentacon Six TL with 3 lenses(180mm Sonnar included ;-)). But then I never carry more than one lens.

 

[derelict]

I looked at the Rolleicord but have decided that I do not want to go 6x6 right now. Maybe later but at the moment, a dedicated 645 would be a good companion to my 6x9 folder. I like that aspect ratio more than the square.

 

[BrianShaw]

You can actually have both - Rollecord Va or Vb with the 16-exposure kit. A sweet compromise... Unless TLR is now out of the question.

For me the 6x9 to 645 (half frame) seems like just the same in a smaller package. I have a 645 that is portrait orientation - good for portraits but otherwise too constraining. And a 645 in landscape has no significant advantage over a good 35mm. My MF pref has always been square for the ease of cropping either orientation.