HP5+ or Fomapan 400

[koraks]

The finest grain I've gotten so far from Foma400 is in 510 Pyro. It had a slight edge on Pyrocat HD in my (informal) testing.

BTW interesting stuff on the extended red sensitivity; I may give it a try with some scrap rolls.

 

[Agulliver]

Here are a few samples as described above...I really find that Fomapan 400 works better in lower light than in sunlight, to me the shots in bright conditions outdoors are ill-defined and grainy. This is in 135...in 120 Fomapan 400 is lovely.

 

[Ariston]

Hey guys, regarding bulk loading, do you store the spool and loader in the freezer between loading rolls?

 

[Anon Ymous]

No, I don't. If you finally realise that the film will expire, then it would be far more practical to bulk load whatever quantity you have and put the loaded film in the freezer.

 

[koraks]

Me neither. I usually use up a roll within about 9 months anyway, or maybe a year. That's quickly enough to my taste. And I don't have the discipline to plan ahead, let the roll acclimatize a few hours before loading etc; I like having the option to be impulsive.

 

[Agulliver]

I keep my bulk loaders in a drawer under my bed, reasonably consistent temperature....but I never cool or freeze them. I'm highly likely to use all rolls before they expire, and in any case it's B&W film so it's good for a few years beyond the expiry date. As mentioned above, if you do feel the bulk roll is uncomfortably close to expiring or has expired you can roll some cassettes and fridge or freeze those.

 

[faberryman]

I want to start bulk loading my film so I can control the number of frames, and to save money. I am deciding between HP5+ and Fomapan. I have used the HP5+ a good bit and am satisfied with it, but I see that Fomapan is much cheaper. I have never used Fomapan and am wondering if it is worthwhile. Is HP5 really $20 better than Fomapan?

Why don't you try a few rolls and see what you think. Everyone has their preferences.

 

[MattKing]

If you keep the black and white bulk roll away from unreasonably warm and humid environments, it will last well.
A cool room is great.
If you are using colour film, cool is even more important.

 

[albireo]

I only use Fomapan 400 (and 200, and 100) in medium format, so my impressions are limited to MF.

For me, the comparison is between Fomapan 400 and Kodak TriX. I tend to prefer Foma 400 to TriX, depending on the look I'm after. Fomapan 400 is a wonderful film in the right developer (I use Fomadon LQN and expose at 320 EI). I love its rendition in the reds, and I find its shadows go black in a more legible (less expressionistic perhaps) way than with the Kodak TriX.

HP5? I tried it, but consider it inferior to the above two, because it's, for me, unremarkable. A lackluster film in medium format, IME - though I'm sure things might be different in 35mm.

Bottom line: buy a couple of rolls of both, try both, see what sticks.

 

[NB23]

Quite frankly, I deeply dislike BW films that are too sensitive to red. Makes people look sick, makes scenes look unrealistic with a sickening overall paleness that I can’t stand.
However, with a 092 filter there is the added effect that I can play with, for a frank, honest ubique look.

HP5 is such an excellent film. It has to be the most flexible film on the market. Use it at 640-800 and its contrast snaps, as opposed to tri-x’ seemingly native iso 250-320.
It pushes and pulls so well. And its sepsitivity to colors is juuust right. Portrairs are fabulous with this fim, thanks to its savantly cirrected spectral sensitiviry.

If I had to choose one film stock for a trip around the world, I’d consider HP5 or tmax400.

I’d favor tmax400 for its insanely good looking spectral sensitivity and fine grain.

I’d favor HP5 for its extreme flexibility and pushability. It simply works everywhere, bulletproof.

I’d favor tri-x for its folkloric value.

 

[removedacct3]

... Portrairs are fabulous with this fim, thanks to its savantly cirrected spectral sensitiviry. ...

Is that with or without your beloved 092 filter?

 

[albireo]

It pushes and pulls so well. And its sepsitivity to colors is juuust right. Portrairs are fabulous with this fim, thanks to its savantly cirrected spectral sensitiviry..

Apologies but the above sounds like poorly worded marketing mumbo-jumbo to me. There is no such thing as 'just right' sensitivity to colours, IMHO. It's about what looks right to you, and what you look for in your photography. The only way for OP to find out what they like is to test both products.

As a slightly separate note, you seem to have contributed quite an abundant number of post to this thread already.

How about being happy with this, instead of revisiting your points in a new post following a post whose content you quite clearly disagree with?

 

[NB23]

Apologies but the above sounds like poorly worded marketing mumbo-jumbo to me. There is no such thing as 'just right' sensitivity to colours, IMHO. It's about what looks right to you, and what you look for in your photography. The only way for OP to find out what they like is to test both products.

As a slightly separate note, you seem to have contributed quite an abundant number of post to this thread already.

How about being happy with this, instead of revisiting your points in a new post following a post whose content you quite clearly disagree with?

And who the F are you, anyway?

Yes, the right sensitivity to colors is very important, in BW films. You just don’t have the skills to see the difference and that might explain your obtuseness about it.

 

[NB23]

Is that with or without your beloved 092 filter?

No film with extra red sensitivity is good for portraits, except for black people/skin.

 

[warden]

No film with extra red sensitivity is good for portraits, except for black people/skin.

This is OT, but after totally botching some pictures of friends where one of them has very dark skin I wondered if it was just my ineptitude at metering for conditions or if film choice hampered me as well. I don't remember the film I used but maybe I'll start another thread to discuss.

As for red sensitivity I did notice Ferrania's P30 renders the American flag with no difference between the blue and red tones.

 

[albireo]

And who the F are you, anyway?

Yes, the right sensitivity to colors is very important, in BW films. You just don’t have the skills to see the difference and that might explain your obtuseness about it.

You have serious issues. I would seek professional help. Your abusive post has been reported.

 

[Ariston]

You have serious issues. I would seek professional help. Your abusive post has been reported.

Albireo, you are out of line. You were trying to instigate a rise by calling someone's opinion poorly worded marketing mumbo jumbo. I have let the administrators know to be sure to read your posts, as well.

I created this thread. I wish I had the ability to lock it down.

 

[Pioneer]

And who the F are you, anyway?

Yes, the right sensitivity to colors is very important, in BW films. You just don’t have the skills to see the difference and that might explain your obtuseness about it.

Someone whose opinion you obviously value above all else.

 

[KN4SMF]

Please don't shut down the thread. I'm interested in others' postings about infrared usage of the foma/Arista 400.

 

[Ariston]

Please don't shut down the thread. I'm interested in others' postings about infrared usage of the foma/Arista 400.

I actually received my Ultrafine today and am going to try and load it into the loader tonight. Is there anything I should be aware of, or is the process pretty straightforward?

 

[MattKing]

I actually received my Ultrafine today and am going to try and load it into the loader tonight. Is there anything I should be aware of, or is the process pretty straightforward?

Don't open the package until you are in total darkness!
Some films have an outer package as well as an inner can or other package, with a light-tight bag inside that.
Some films just have an outer package with a light-tight bag inside that.
Before heading into the dark, examine your loader carefully, paying particular attention to which way the film comes off the long roll - clockwise or counter-clockwise - before heading for the film gate. You want to make sure that when you open the inner bag, you sense which way the film comes off the roll, and make sure that you put it in the way that the loader requires.
There will most likely be a bit of tape on the end of the roll which you will have to release in order to feed the end where it is to go.
Also examine how the centre core that should be part of the roll fits into the loader. If there is a core still there from the last film, be sure to remove it.
It isn't very difficult to do this, but it helps to have a picture in your mind of how things should go. It might help to turn off the light and then familiarize yourself how the various parts of the loader feel and move when you can't see them.
I would recommend doing this in something like a large darkroom tray sitting on the top of your counter.

 

[Ariston]

Don't open the package until you are in total darkness!
Some films have an outer package as well as an inner can or other package, with a light-tight bag inside that.
Some films just have an outer package with a light-tight bag inside that.
Before heading into the dark, examine your loader carefully, paying particular attention to which way the film comes off the long roll - clockwise or counter-clockwise - before heading for the film gate. You want to make sure that when you open the inner bag, you sense which way the film comes off the roll, and make sure that you put it in the way that the loader requires.
There will most likely be a bit of tape on the end of the roll which you will have to release in order to feed the end where it is to go.
Also examine how the centre core that should be part of the roll fits into the loader. If there is a core still there from the last film, be sure to remove it.
It isn't very difficult to do this, but it helps to have a picture in your mind of how things should go. It might help to turn off the light and then familiarize yourself how the various parts of the loader feel and move when you can't see them.
I would recommend doing this in something like a large darkroom tray sitting on the top of your counter.

Thanks again, Matt. I guess you are kind of my mentor - you have been helping me out a lot lately with my new endeavors. If you had not mentioned that the film might be taped down, I think that would have thrown me off. I have it loaded now.

I am a little irritated that the box did not have an expiration date on it. Does anyone know if that Is normal? It is Ultrafine 400 Xtreme.

 

[MattKing]

Glad it worked for you.
As far as expiration date, I would ask the vendor.
One thing I do with bulk film is to put masking tape on the loader to indicate when I loaded it.
I also tape a portion of the box on the loader, to show what is inside.
And finally, I like to keep a rough track of how much of the roll I've used - tougher to do if you load different lengths at different times.
It occurs to me that I should weigh the loader when empty, and then weigh it when full, and track how the weight changes as the roll is used up.

 

[Agulliver]

+1 on all the advice re bulk loaders. I especially echo the advice to put a piece of masking tape or sticky label on the loader with some info written on it....type of film loaded, length of the roll, date loaded, expiry date (if known)...I also write numbers "2 4 6 8 10 12 14 18" and cross them out when load 35mm cassettes so I have a rough idea how many I've made and how much film is left.

If you ever get to having more than one loader, or even if you just don't use it for a few months, having that info on it somewhere is invaluable. Also if you ever get to having two loaders each with different film....label your cassettes!

 

[lantau]

I'm having HP5+ in my bulk loader. I agree that it is a technically more capable film. It is interesting that you can develop it in Spur HRX super fine grain developer at Box speed vs E.I. 200 for Tri-X. IIRC I noticed that for other Ilford films, also. Their flagship films seem to be a little faster at box speed than Kodaks.

That being said, like many above, I live Foma films. I'm not as systematic as many others here, simply following datasheet instructions and shooting all kind of different films all the time. But I did print Fomapan 400 (35mm) onto Foma paper last year and didn't really notice much grain in those shots that were well metered (E.I. probably 320, developed in Fomadon LQN). However in a few shots against the light I did underexpose the people I did photograph and the result was muddy and not very nice.

Digital copies from the negatives were quite grainy, of course. Fomapan 400 is really worth testing a few rolls, especially when wet printing, but I wouldn't recommend getting a bulk roll right away. Otherwise I had some decent results with one or two rolls of APX 400 new, and this can be bought in bulk rolls from Foto Impex and it is pretty inexpensive.