HP5 in D-76 = Thin Negs?? What am I doing wrong?

[voceumana]

Hi, Daniel.

I started off getting very serious about understanding more about the technical side of photograph through the Ansel Adams books, but his approach, as he presents it, does require you to read it all and understand it all before you can understand any of it. Not everyone will respond well to his explanation methods. I've presented some classes for my company's products at various times, and any good teacher will tell you that different people respond to different teaching approaches.

There's nothing negative about Ansel Adams if you didn't respond to his approach--it's just that you need a different approach and you're finding it.

Fortunately, Fred Picker did an excellent synopsis in the Zone VI Workbook, and I heartily recommend it for anyone starting to understand this stuff. It's all 100% Ansel Adams compliant, but boiled down to the essentials.

I also picked up one of Henry Hornstein's books, and his books are also excellent book.

I was going to go into a spiel about the qualities of the Film Developing Cookbook, but the books speaks for itself better. Go to www.amazon.com, search on it, and click on "search inside this book". You'll get the first 5 or 6 pages, and even get the chart of developers that tells you what developers are typical of the various classes. If you don't find what you see there useful and interesting, don't buy the book now. Sooner or later, though, I think you'll want it.

By the way, this book would have told you that you didn't have enough developer (where this thread started), so it would have saved you a developing session and a sleepless night!

Definitely take a look at the book on Amazon.

Best regards,
Charlie

 

[Jim Noel]

My students use 800 ml of D-76 undiluted for 10 sheets of 4x5 HP5+, and other films, in an Expert drum with consistently good results.
The last change in speed recommendations from Jobo was to use "4" for all drums. Does this faster speed make a difference? I haven't tested so do not know. I do know that 800ml straight D-76, 10 sheets of film, rotation speed "4" works beautifully.

 

[voceumana]

According to Kodak, 800 mL should be OK for 10 sheets of 4x5 film with undiluted D-76. Here's the math:

2 sheets of 8x10 at 1:1 equates to 4 sheets undiluted.

4 sheets of 8x10 = 16 sheets of 4x5

1000 ml per 16 sheets, or 1000/16, or 62.5 ml/1 sheet, x 10 sheets = 625 ml for 10 sheets of 4x5.

 

[Larry L]

I got into 4 X 5 a couple months ago and started with a box of HP5. My very first shots were developed in a 5 X 7 tray and D76 straight and were great. Boy was I on a roll - then tried D76 1:1 in a tank. Disaster, but I was shooting at 1/4 to 1/2 life size, etc. and blamed the bad results on that. A friend at work; that was a lab tech in his former job, said D76 1:1 with HP5 is not a good combo. I now use D76 straight and go 10% over Ilford's times and am getting much better range. I'm development in a 5 X 7 tray and also a 12 sheet Doran tank. Also, agree with earlier posts that the ISO is closer to 200 versus 400. Have also tested some very out of date (7 yrs. but frozen) TMax 100 with better results than HP5. Ilford's 100 Delta also looks closer to it's rated ASA and does great in D76 straight. Will be testing Kodak Tri-X 320 Professional next. Let me know if this helps as I'm still learning and get a lot of help from reading these posts.

 

[stormbytes]

I got into 4 X 5 a couple months ago and started with a box of HP5. My very first shots were developed in a 5 X 7 tray and D76 straight and were great. Boy was I on a roll - then tried D76 1:1 in a tank. Disaster, but I was shooting at 1/4 to 1/2 life size, etc. and blamed the bad results on that. A friend at work; that was a lab tech in his former job, said D76 1:1 with HP5 is not a good combo. I now use D76 straight and go 10% over Ilford's times and am getting much better range. I'm development in a 5 X 7 tray and also a 12 sheet Doran tank. Also, agree with earlier posts that the ISO is closer to 200 versus 400. Have also tested some very out of date (7 yrs. but frozen) TMax 100 with better results than HP5. Ilford's 100 Delta also looks closer to it's rated ASA and does great in D76 straight. Will be testing Kodak Tri-X 320 Professional next. Let me know if this helps as I'm still learning and get a lot of help from reading these posts.

Larry,

In a conversation I once had with Michael Smith, I distinctly recall him saying that film speed was nothing but a "number". Since then, and following extensive testing of 2-3 different films, I couldn't agree more!

The basis for your own personal film speed is very simple. Expose your film what what YOU determine to be your "shadows" (I don't even like that word as I find it confusing - it should be "dark areas of importance") and develop for highlights - meaning, those very-bright-but-still-textured areas of your scene that should still contain detail.

The manufacturer's ISO speed rating is a good "starting point" - but not much more then that. If you expose HP5 at ISO 400 and after processing that film in your developer of choice, feel that your "shadows" contain adequate detail, then ISO 400 it is. If however, like many, you test repeatedly and find that ISO 200-250 yields shadows that are more along the lines of what you're looking for, then THAT is the speed of your film.

In black & white portraiture, I found the eyes to be the focal point of my exposure setting. Too dark, and they lack luster and life. Too light, and they lack punch. I've found that with using my equipment for capture and processing, depending on conditions, HP5 is best rated at ISO 200 for portraiture - again, exposing for the eyes. Your mileage may varry, and more so, you may find other areas to contain your most critical "shadows".

I should also point out that all of this is very relative to the paper being used. My results have been obtained by contact-printing HP5 negatives, at various ISO ratings, on Oriental Seagual FB/VC Glossy. I've found that exposing my film and developing it in this way, yeilds the best straight-print. I'd suggest you try out a few of this combinations and see what works best for you. Most of this isn't really a science.

Happy testing.

Daniel

 

[JJK]

This might help

I just learned that Sekonic measures for 14 percent gray instead of 18 percent so if you are using a Sekonic light meter you want to open up 2/3 of a stop. HP5 is a 400 film so shoot at 250. Recommended time for D-76 1:1 is 11 minutes. So you need to up your time but it all depends on how you are agitating. If you are using a gobo, are you at constant agitation? and how fast are you agitating? everything must be taken into account.
If your neg is thin than you are not processing long enough or you are under exposed.
I just found this cool site so sorry about the late posting!

 

[Ulrich Drolshagen]

I just learned that Sekonic measures for 14 percent gray instead of 18 percent

This is interesting! Where did you get this information from? I could not find it in the handbook.
Compared to my Gossen Lunasix 3 the readout is identical. I own a brand new L-398A with the new amorph silicon cell. May be this one is different from the old one with seleium cell.

Ulrich