How Much Tween 20?

[Andrew O'Neill]

I've got some 20% Tween 20 and I thought I'd give it a try to see if it makes any difference. How many drops should I use for an 8x10 print? Three? Four?

 

[Kerik]

What process and what paper? I never found much use for it myself. Some papers don't like it at all. I find adding a few drops of Everclear is more beneficial to smooth coatings and minimizing brush marks than all the other magic potions I've tried, and I think I've tried them all.

 

[Don12x20]

I've got some 20% Tween 20 and I thought I'd give it a try to see if it makes any difference. How many drops should I use for an 8x10 print? Three? Four?

You don't say what paper you are using, and you don't say whether brush (magic brush?) or rod coated.

I've used a drop for 7x17 and 12x20 prints on Platine using magic brush (3 or 4 inch) -- I've seen a substantial improvement in coating. However, it will sink in a lot faster than before. I've tried everclear and haven't seen a difference.

For 8x10 - if I were you, I'd get a pipette and figure out a fraction of a drop -- about half would be appropriate for 8x10. measure how many drops in 1 ml and determine how many ml in a drop, now divide. (pipeting with pipette pumps is the ONLY way to do ULF negatives)

I've seen improvement using Tween for Lana Aquarelle and Fabriano Aristico. Not needed for a lot of papers.

Your mileage may vary --- try it and see.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Rising Stonehendge and Lana Aquarelle. Both puddle-pushed coated. Making Kallitypes.
I tried 4 drops on Aquarelle last night and it looked okay. I'll try it without tween to compare. Will try Stonehenge tonight. I've been using Stonehenge for the past two years with no Tween and quite pleased. Just thought I'd see if Tween makes any difference...Aquarelle is a nice paper, (more substantial and less tooth) but I think I prefer Stonehenge's "whiteness".

I did appreciate how the sensitizer seemed to glide on with the addition of Tween.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Don, wouldn't it be easier to just dilute the Tween say with 1 drop to 1 drop (and more if needed) of distilled water?
Another thing I found out was that Tween needs to be mixed into the sensitizer thoroughly before coating the paper.

 

[photomc]

Like Kerik said, it depends on the paper. I use it for some papers and not for others 1 drop for 8x10 for palladium prints. BUT - also use 1 drop of Everclear (190 prf - which is not available everywhere) and must say for smoothing out my coating it made a big difference. I use both with Fabriano Artistico Extra White (that is pre treated ahead of time with Oxalic acid).

When using tween be sure to notice if it starts to grow anything - which it will sooner or later. Think the last bottle lasted me about 4-5 years before it became some strange blob. As with most of what we do with alt process find what works for you - what works for some does not seem to work for others (and darn if I know how or why?)

 

[Kerik]

Mike, you are so right. It's very paper dependent and papers change all too often. BTW, you can use 151 Everclear if 190 is not available in your area. Just use a little more... I typically use 2 to 4 drops of 190 in an 8x10 print. But, realize that the Everclear drops are much smaller than the Pd or ferric drops due to the much lower surface tension of the liquid (which is also why the everclear helps smooth the coating, in my experience).

 

[Don12x20]

Don, wouldn't it be easier to just dilute the Tween say with 1 drop to 1 drop (and more if needed) of distilled water?
Another thing I found out was that Tween needs to be mixed into the sensitizer thoroughly before coating the paper.

You do what you need to do.
With small print sizes like 4x5 and 8x10, drops are easier. It just adds a wee bit to the drying time

The Tween I've got doesn't seem to stay separated. A quick swirl in the shot glass coupled with magic brush does the trick

you'll notice two effects -- first, it will coat a lot faster. You'll brush a lot less. This is especially true with Platine. Second, after development, you'll see more even tones.

 

[Don12x20]

When using tween be sure to notice if it starts to grow anything - which it will sooner or later. Think the last bottle lasted me about 4-5 years before it became some strange blob.

An advantage for everclear....

 

[photomc]

The Tween I've got doesn't seem to stay separated. A quick swirl in the shot glass coupled with magic brush does the trick

you'll notice two effects -- first, it will coat a lot faster. You'll brush a lot less. This is especially true with Platine. Second, after development, you'll see more even tones.

Don, Exactly what I have found, from quick swirl to nice even coating.

BTW Kerik learned the Everclear trick from you by way of Matt, so Thanks! to you and Matt. One of the best tips for coating I have learned. The other was 'there are no magic bullets' what works for one paper may not work on another and most important for alt printers is "papers change" so buy as much of a lot as you can, it may not be the same next time.