How a possible book deal can lead to frustration

[arigram]

First of all, I have to apologise for starting this thread in the "Ethics and Philosophy" category, a place too heavy for this personal whine, but I found the Lounge a bit too far off on the other side.
Secondly, I do have to apologise for the mere existence of this post, which might well be no more than an immature whine (as I mentioned before), or a childish cry for attention.

I am 33 years old and I am pretty much a failure in life. I have no purpose of existence and I am an immature self centered pessimistic coward with nothing to be proud of and too many things to be ashamed of. I have been trying to find a place in life, but not trying very hard and backing off with the smallest obstacle.

So, I thought I could make something with photography. I found out that I am neither a good professional, or a good artist, so its hard to fit in a place that only has seats for the former. I am too pretentious and elitist to be shooting weddings and hotels but not talented and self appreciative enough to compete in the local tiny art world. So, I pretty much abandoned photography because I don't want just to do a job to fill my stomach, I want to make something of myself. And the vast majority of commercials jobs in Greece are cheap and soul consuming.
So, while I am trying to figure out things, I get this offer.
My father (a long time owner of a newspaper and journalist) talked with the owner of a press agency and so I was offered a book deal.
Nobody has seen my photographs, even my father has seen only very few of them, so I was not offered this opportunity for my talents and worth, but because of my daddy's connections. Something that doesn't sit well with my ego.
The other concern of mine is that I know the Greek people and they wouldn't buy a book of mine. I don't do nationalist/localist photography (bad postcard quality shots of pretty local landscape, old ladies, villages and themes like that) but that's the only thing people here can understand and appreciate ("oh look at this pretty beach") as they only see the subject matter not the photograph.
A book is something very important to an artist. It has the value of ten private shows and is something that unlike the exhibitions, will stay in somebody's bookcase or even at a public library. Your art will remain to be seen, theoretically forever. One can forget a badly prepared exhibition of beginner's work, but not a book.
I am at a point in my life where I am trying to figure out what I should do. I look at my photography and I am far from being appreciative of it. I don't consider my photographic work as anything special, let alone good. If I have a handful of cute shots I see them more as fucking-lucky accidents than results of my skills and talents. The photographs I have taken, especially the prepared ones, like the studio work, is nowhere near what I have in my mind. I am trying to decide if they just don't represent me or I am plainly not very good at all. I don't feel I have taken the photographs that I would have liked to take. My technique is very sloppy, my subject matter uninteresting and my aesthetics are stereotypical. I look at the work of others, even new photographers and see in them so much more potential and talent and material that could make far more worthy publications.
I have so far refrained from competitions, exhibitions and posts to magazines for I don't see any artistic worth in my work.

So, I am kinda lost.
I am looking at my work and scanning some of it and planning to upgrade my website. One problem is that my photography is all over the place and I don't have a series that I consider finished. Then I have decided to ask one or two photographs whose opinions I trust and admire to decide if I am going further with the book or not and to help me make the choices. I am very broke and would have very much welcomed some money, but on the other hand, I feel too ashamed to call myself an artist and compare myself to other photographers. I really don't want to come out with a stupid book.

Why have I written this here?
I guess mostly to vent. I am not really asking for petting and sweet words of compassion, nor do I want you to "help out" in any way. This is honestly not a cry for attention and flattery; I have really thought hard of posting this here.
But I am lost and confused. I battle deep depression for more than twenty years and my compass is broken. This is not the first "cry for help" I have written in APUG; there have been several, that got me nowhere and which I see as childish. But I really have nowhere else to turn to.
Do you have any thoughts to help me find some balance and get my bearings working again? Do you think I should go ahead with this book even if I am uncertain of its worth?

 

[SuzanneR]

Yes.

But I think you'll need to find an editor or colleague who can help you organize and shape the work into a cohesive body.

 

[Steve Smith]

Nobody has seen my photographs, even my father has seen only very few of them, so I was not offered this opportunity for my talents and worth, but because of my daddy's connections. Something that doesn't sit well with my ego.

There is an old saying that good fortune is when preparation meets opportunity. For whatever reasons, you now have the opportunity to do this book. I'm sure you have done the preparation, therefore I would consider that fortune is coming your way at the moment.

I can only answer from my perspective but If I had this opportunity, I would do it.

Or I would at least look at it carefully to see if it is viable.

I would personally not be too bothered worrying about how many books would sell as in the future it would be nice to be able to say 'I produced a book a while ago, here it is'. It's the same with music. many musicians produce CDs. Not to make money as you usually only ever break even with these ventures, but to have a record of what you were doing at a given time.


Steve.


Steve.

 

[Seabird]

Do you think I should go ahead with this book even if I am uncertain of its worth?

Most definitely proceed with the book!

After all, who is ever sure of the worth of their work / contributions / life ?

Work as had as you can to make the book as good as you can with whatever resources you presently have available to you. I'm sure you'll learn lots, and consequently the second book will be even better - but the first will be an important marker for where you were...

All the best (from another immature self centered pessimistic coward with nothing to be proud of and too many things to be ashamed of).

Carey Bird
http://members.iinet.net.au/~cbird/index.html

 

[Michael W]

It sounds to me like you shouldn't do the book, at least not now. If you are not happy with your work then you should think about it & try to figure out why it's not what you want, & what you can do to change that. It depends how long you've been serious about photography; if it's only been a few years you might need to give it some more time. Otherwise there's something you need to change in your approach.

Whatever, I wouldn't go down the path of trying to make a commercial book for the local market. By the sounds of it you'll hate yourself & the work probably won't be very good anyway if your heart's not in it. Could you take the offer for a book & turn it into a group project? e.g. it's called 'New Greek Photography' & features work by half a dozen or so people who are doing interesting work. You can include yourself but don't have the pressure of carrying the whole book. Something like that might have commercial potential outside Greece, I'm sure a lot of people around the world would be interested to see a fresh vision from that country.

 

[Andrew Horodysky]

My opinion is to move forward with the book project. The process, alone, will be a good disciplinary practice.

Find a good editor (if possible, through your father's contact) or even curator, that will help you put your work in a cohesive body. This doesn't have to be a big book. Just getting published in print, in itself, is a grand accomplishment, and something of which to be proud. It will most definitely lead to other projects in the future. I feel that for you, it will be a big confidence booster, and lead to ideas for new subjects and stories.

Best of luck.

 

[Paul Jenkin]

First things first, I've seen some of your work and I like it. Okay, it's not to everyone's taste but what is? Does that matter?

You already know that your target market isn't your local one as your images definitely don't fit your interpretation of their taste. In my opinion, that is a cause for celebration rather than despair. I'm convinced that there are millions more people on our little blue planet who would prefer to see your photos than another reworking of the white roofs on Santorini or another quaint fishing scene from Kefalonia (as beautiful as those places undoubtedly are).

If you want to publish a book, then publish one. Check out www.blurb.com as you can make your own book to a very high quality and then sell it via their website if you wish. I know it's not the same as having a publisher doing all the spade-work for you but if the objective is to create a book, see what it looks like and how it makes you feel, it must be one of the lowest risk options available.

How about putting on an exhibition at a local venue? That way, you control content, quality and you get to invite who you want + their friends / family / neighbours and get some 'real' feedback.

You sound really pissed off and, trust me, I do know how that feels. Again, in my opinion, the 'cure' doesn't come by way of waving a magic wand - as such things don't exist. The fact that you don't believe that using your father's influence is such a 'cure' suggests that you have seen things clearly in your own terms.

For me, this is more about taking small, positive steps towards an objective. Decide what you really want and then create a road-map of how to get there with lots of stops and milestones on the way. Include details of any obstacles or potential diversions along the way and how to accommodate or overcome them. Then get on with it.

Celebrate your successes, learn from your mistakes. Don't be afraid to shoot for the stars but always make sure your feet are anchored on terra firma.

Best wishes. Paul.

 

[Barry S]

Probably best to wait for a big storm and throw yourself off a cliff into the sea. :rolleyes: OR maybe...thank your favorite deity for an opportunity that may not come around again, take Suzanne's advice to work with the best editor you can find, and work your ass off getting the project together. If you need to shoot more to fill out the project, do it. Waiting for inspiration is pointless, let the opportunity drive your work.

 

[Saganich]

Self-contempt is a difficult road. Your being too harsh with yourself. The main point is that your not doing it alone. Don't think too far ahead jump in and make it your unconditional commitment. A place in life is an unconditional commitment.

 

[Valerie]

Aristotelis, are you crazy????? Most of us would kill for the chance to produce a book. Now the opportunity lands in your lap and you actually consider turning it down??? Its not about commercial success... its about all those other experiences you will have along the road. You have a great deal of passion and talent, so funnel all that into this book. It can be a great way for you to find focus and to direct your energies. Stop thinking and do.

 

[Shangheye]

Who the hell said that opportunity or ability had anything to do with success?...Take a chill-pill Ari, You are not the first or the last person to get a chance because of who you know...in fact I think you are in the majority. Alas...for most who are the best, it takes their death to make them interesting, or some other tragedy.

The one thing I have learned in the last couple of years is that it is who you know, not what you know... a sad testament I know, but it is the truth. It has happened to me, and I don't regret it one bit, and I am not ashamed either, if supporting me was a car wreck in the waiting, I am sure I would not have been supported.

So setting aside how you got the offer, (and it really does not matter what your photos look like....), the real question is whether you think you are proud enough (or maybe too proud?) to see your work in print. Whether people buy it or not is secondary...once published...always published..and you will find out if you are any good then (but only for the market you publish in).

I have one piece of advice (as opposed to dragging you over the hot coals as above), and that is that you should get someone else to edit your work...and not just a friend..preferably someone who knows what they are doing and can be harsh. My publisher did that, and as hard as it was (3 months in fact of hardship as I saw images I loved being canned), it was the right thing. The book worked and sold (440 copies out of a limited edition of 500). But here is the thing...It wasn't the book I wanted in the end, but it was the RIGHT book to sell.

In summary, don't confuse a book with your art...one is for selling, and the other is worth so much more to you as physical evidence of your desire to express yourself. And by the way you are good athat (but I am not here to stroke your ego).

Do the book for the only reason that there is...life is full of crossroads, but when someone comes along and offers you a lift....hop on....you can always get off.

K

 

[MikeSeb]

Look at this as your opportunity to take an offer you (say you) got because of whom your "Daddy knows", and bust your ass to prove that, after all, you got it on the merit of your work.

 

[jmain]

You're going to have to live with "THE BOOK" for the rest of your life. Would you rather live with it as something done or undone??

 

[removed account4]

hi aristotelis -

a book does not need to be hundreds of pages,
it can be however long you want it to be ...

it doesn't matter about how you were presented this situation.
in life, things happen, and you follow where opportunities lead.

find a good editor and distill your work and build upon your foundation.
there is nothing like a hot foot to make you dance.

enjoy the ride!
john

 

[Jedidiah Smith]

Aristotelis,
My friend, you are in need of something; a soul-searching, deep soul you have. That is why you battle so in this natural world of artificial placation. My reply will be of great depth; I am a doctor, and accustomed to discussions such as this. If you find the conversation stimulating, please PM or email me, and we will talk further.

First of all, you should do the book project. No, let me rephrase that: you must complete the book. Not due to what the book will inherently be of itself in the end, but for the process that life is holding out for you to go through at this time. You have a good eye, and enough talent for the present. Your talent will grow, and your eye become more discerning as the project unfolds. Forget about the "worth of your photography" in someone else's eyes for the duration of the project, and let what is within you flow outward to create, to form, to complete. You will be a better man for it.

I would like to draw your attention to something a great man once wrote. I cannot take credit for sharing these words; only for truly understanding them.

"Every man has an internal potential which is right, good, big, which is too often dormant.
He has at the same time, plastered on the outside, an active substitute that is usually wrong, bad, and petty. The external active, too often, does petty things in petty ways."
Now this is key, "Anything that is natural, which flows from within outward, is right, good, and BIG. It is the educated artificial which plasters itself on the outside that is unnatural."
Think about how you have responded thus far to life's circumstances, your education, your feelings of self worth. Then read the next (lengthy, but worth-it) part:

"Man is a contradictory, ignorant mass of exploding transitory theories.
He acknowledges a Wisdom that runs the universe.
He denies any Wisdom that creates, regulates, governs, directs human beings.
Within us, it is said “The Kingdom of God is within you.”
It is!
Innate Intelligence is the Great I am that I am.
Innate is the internal source of all and everything.
One ounce of loyalty is worth a pound of cleverness.
One spark of Innate is greater than all the education, books, libraries of man.
Yet, conceited man reverses that process.
He places what he thinks he knows over and above everything else.
He places everything that is, the law itself, below and under what he thinks he knows."

Now, with this in mind, begin to write the prologue for your book. And then, proceed to edit it weekly until the end, always refining and possessing who and what you are. As you write this, you will begin to see how your photography will fill in the gaps of the book, the areas where words cannot and will never describe what your photographic art can convey to the reader.
I wish you the absolute satisfaction and growth from a job well done.
Sincerely,
Dr. JT Smith

 

[MattKing]

Aristotelis:

How you got the opportunity won't affect how good the book is - only you (and a good editor) will.

If it comes out well, you will be happy, and you will have learned a lot.

If it doesn't come out as well as you might hope, it will still be something of you that you will be able to be proud of, and you will have learned a lot.

And the work with a good editor cannot help but be positive.

Carpe Diem.

All the best.

Matt

 

[DLawson]

You're going to have to live with "THE BOOK" for the rest of your life. Would you rather live with it as something done or undone??

I'm 47, and see myself similarly to the description in the opening post. I'm only really good at one or two things. The '90s let that overlap with job demand, and that is rapidly dwindling toward the horizon.

I have a huge pile of "should have turned left there instead of right" to look back on. A possible book deal is probably bigger than anything in there.

Regret sucks. Make the best book you can. If it fails, at least it was made.


And remember to post a release announcement here.

 

[jordanstarr]

About 7 months ago I approached a publisher who liked my work and is thinking about publishing it. I hate most of what I've done to date and I'm 25 years old with a lot of photography ahead. I was thinking to myself that I would produce something pathetic and in 10 years, look back and regret it. So, I thought long and hard about a project I wanted to undertake and decided on one. I'm 5 months into a 10 month project and not only is it a comprehensive series, but it's actually something that I'm somewhat proud of. I've looked at your photos and you're right -it's all over the place. It's not a bad thing though and your photos are good. But maybe you just need to focus on a project for a year and have one thing you can focus on, think about, analyze and prepare for.

...that's if you can put this opportunity on hold.

 

[mithraea1]

Dude,

If you haven't seen Edit:Transform by Zack Arias maybe you should watch it. It's about 15 mins long, and he talks about the self doubt that he faces as a photographer: http://blip.tv/file/1785698

You ask for thoughts to help you find balance, get your bearings working again.

My thoughts are -

You are not a good professional. As a professional you will focus on your work, and see it through - to completion. If you don't have a series that you consider finished: go and finish one. Then another, and another. If it's challenging; relish it. A professional doesn't have the choice of not finishing a job. You will find a way of doing it, and doing it well. You can become a professional, but - as with so many things - it will require effort.

If you feel your 'cute shots' are lucky accidents, then work on your technical ability. Work on it so that you get more and more 'cute shots'.

As you build your professionalism and your technical skills, you will start to find your style. You will be able to envisage a shot, and know what you need to do to achieve it.

You want to make something of yourself, but won't shoot weddings. If you were the top wedding photographer (for example) in Europe, the one by which others were judged, would you have made something of yourself?

Don't limit yourself. You are limiting yourself by refusing to shoot subjects because you are too pretentious or elitist. If you want to make something of yourself you have to start somewhere. And then move forward. Build on it. Don't dwell on failure. Being 'pretty much a failure in life' is looking backwards. Look ahead, to the rest of your life.

The value of failure is in learning what to do differently next time, to make it a success. No one is an instant success. Every success is based on hard work, and luck (which is often the result of hard work), and refusing to take 'no' for an answer.

Should you go ahead with the book? It will give you an opportunity to work hard on one thing, and build on your professionalism. It is a project which you will have to finish, which you can use to practice your skills, and a chance to stop limiting yourself.

And if - somehow - in the end you measure it a 'failure', learn from it. What can you improve for your next book? If it is a success - learn from that. What can you do to make the next book even more successful?

Now go and get started.

 

[Erik Petersson]

What everyone else said - just do it, and you will grow with the task. I am doing pretty complicated things in my day job. When I started I really suck, but I stuck to it and threw myself on tasks that I was terrified of, because it was what I had been dreaming about, and now I am getting good.

Moreover, the work you have posted in the gallery here is pretty good, as far as I can see. I believe that the book will be much better, because I think that you will work pretty hard to make it so.

 

[Shaggysk8]

Photography aside dude, I don't know anyone that feels they have achieved something in life, we are always chasing something else and I for one think thats a good thing, I can't really understand depression but my partner has it and I live with it. A lot of what you say I have heard and no matter what people say it will never change the way you feel.

I can offer no real advice, but I think just take a step back if you can, maybe even just a rest and come back to thinking about it. Someone you trust to judge your work will always be a good idea. I know that I do a lot and people always tell me I am great at this or that, but it never makes a difference to how I feel about my work, I have come to learn to live with what I come up with and try and turn my flaws in to a positive.

Good Luck dude, and what ever you decide will be right.

Paul

 

[Paul Cocklin]

There's an old Chinese parable that has always stuck with me. I don't know if it's appropriate to your situation or not, and it's rather long, but (I think) well worth the reading.

Long ago in a small village lived a stone cutter. While working in his open air shop one day he looked down the road and saw the governor of the province being carried in his chair through the village. The stone cutter, along with everyone else the governor passed, bowed low in a sign of deep respect.

While bowing, the stone cutter thought to himself, 'how powerful the governor must be, to have entire villages bow before him; I wish I was a governor.' And poof! He's a governor, and being carried through a village not unlike his own, and people are bowing before him now.

But before long he starts to feel quite faint, and sweating profusely, says to himself; 'how powerful the sun is, that can make the mighty governor feel ill. I wish I was the sun!', and poof! he's the sun. He shines down with all his might and the villagers all curse him because he's causing a drought and the fields are drying up, the crops dying, and then far below him he sees something blocking his rays, and he realizes that it's clouds in his way.

And he thinks, 'how powerful those clouds must be, that can block out the sun which can dominate a governor. I wish I was the clouds.' And Poof! He's the clouds. And now he's raining down, and the farmers are cursing him because the river has flooded and the crops are dying from too much water now...and he feels himself being pushed aside. He thinks to himself, what could be more powerful that the clouds, that can block out the sun which reigns supreme over the governor?' And he realizes it's the wind.

He says to himself, The wind, that must be the most powerful force, I wish I was the wind.' And Poof! He's the wind. And he blows and blows and the farmers are cursing him now because all their soil is blowing away, but then he comes up against something that is beyond his power to move. And he says to himself, what could be more powerful than the wind, that can move the clouds which can block out the sun that vanquishes a governor?' And he realizes it's a mighty mountain.

Surely, he says, the mountain must be the most powerful force ever to grace the universe. I wish I was the mountain.' And Poof! He's the mountain. But no sooner has he become the mountain but he feels something far below, something changing him. And he says to the world, 'I cannot believe it. What could be more powerful than the mighty mountain, which can stop the wind that moves the clouds that blocks the sun which can dominate the governor?'

And far below him he looks down and sees the form of a stone cutter, hewing the mountain.

Make of it what you will, but to me it perfectly sums up much of life's tribulations.

Do the book, and look forward to doing a better book in the future.

 

[Domenico Foschi]

Dude,

If you haven't seen Edit:Transform by Zack Arias maybe you should watch it. It's about 15 mins long, and he talks about the self doubt that he faces as a photographer: http://blip.tv/file/1785698

You ask for thoughts to help you find balance, get your bearings working again.

My thoughts are -

You are not a good professional. As a professional you will focus on your work, and see it through - to completion. If you don't have a series that you consider finished: go and finish one. Then another, and another. If it's challenging; relish it. A professional doesn't have the choice of not finishing a job. You will find a way of doing it, and doing it well. You can become a professional, but - as with so many things - it will require effort.

If you feel your 'cute shots' are lucky accidents, then work on your technical ability. Work on it so that you get more and more 'cute shots'.

As you build your professionalism and your technical skills, you will start to find your style. You will be able to envisage a shot, and know what you need to do to achieve it.

You want to make something of yourself, but won't shoot weddings. If you were the top wedding photographer (for example) in Europe, the one by which others were judged, would you have made something of yourself?

Don't limit yourself. You are limiting yourself by refusing to shoot subjects because you are too pretentious or elitist. If you want to make something of yourself you have to start somewhere. And then move forward. Build on it. Don't dwell on failure. Being 'pretty much a failure in life' is looking backwards. Look ahead, to the rest of your life.

The value of failure is in learning what to do differently next time, to make it a success. No one is an instant success. Every success is based on hard work, and luck (which is often the result of hard work), and refusing to take 'no' for an answer.

Should you go ahead with the book? It will give you an opportunity to work hard on one thing, and build on your professionalism. It is a project which you will have to finish, which you can use to practice your skills, and a chance to stop limiting yourself.

And if - somehow - in the end you measure it a 'failure', learn from it. What can you improve for your next book? If it is a success - learn from that. What can you do to make the next book even more successful?

Now go and get started.

I would take mithraea1's suggestion seriously.

The real issue here is not the book, but you and the level of commitment you have toward your photography.

If you keep dwelling in the self reproach and toxic self criticism, it will be pretty much impossible to get out of that black hole and finally divert your energies in your creativity.

Ari, feel free to contact me if you want.

 

[Steve Roberts]

Ari,
Most of your reservations of self-doubt, incomplete projects, etc. are issues with which we all have to contend from time to time, not just in photography but in everything we do. I've been "about to" sort out the dent in the door of the car for some five years now, all set to replace the kitchen window for three years, ready to start a night-time photography project for two years - I could go on and on. It's easy to think of all these perceived failings but to forget our successes. Look at some of your work and reflect on the fact that (probably) 99.9% of photography is granny on the park bench or kiddies' parties and the mere fact that you stop and think about your output, as you have done, puts you in an elite category.
As for the book, it's an old English saying that "it's not what you know, it's who you know". Never mind how the opportunity has arisen, grab it with both hands and do it. I've been trying to interest a book publisher for some months now (not on a strictly photographic subject) and would give my eye teeth for someone to "put a word in" for me. It's the way of the world, so don't turn down any "leg-up" that's offered!
Good luck!
Steve

 

[Philippe-Georges]

A book isn't everything, no book is less...

Till now, for 20 years, I committed (yes, sometimes it feels like a crime) the photography for about 40 books, of all kinds and subjects, for 5 different publishers.
I try to make a living of it. About 99% of the pictures I make are intended to be published (books, brochures, annual reports, folders, magazines, calendars, websites...). And I still feel like standing there with empty hands (and a likely head).

Every day, I think about throwing the towel in to the ring and leaving the scene. But every day I feel that I have to go on and on...

One of the publishers once told me that the life span of a book in the book shops, is in the best case about 6 to 9 months, then the book 'dies'.
80% to 90% of the edition has to be sold in that short 'life span', if not, the book is a failure and has to be dumped (ramsj). Non of my books has ever been dumped, I may call my self a rather lucky guy, really do believe me, luck has a lot to do with it (besides the making of good pictures of course).
Publishing is, if you want it or not, business as usual. A lot of money is involved in 'manufacturing' a book. And who wants to pay for it? The one who can get some profit out of it! And that is in the least place the photographer, he is usually considered as the 'main cost'. Actually, he is not, but as he is standing out there alone, he's the easiest cost to be cut away, more or less.

But, I do understand the urge to publish, a book is something one can get hooked on. It is like a proof of accomplishment, the point of professional or artistic maturity.
Till the day the book lays there, in front of you, published... Then comes the shock, the shame, the sorrow and the frustration strikes (again)!
"...What a monster this book is, what have I done!..."
Then, you can't sleep for a few day's...
After a week or so, you seek for a revanche, a new and better book with better pictures, better print work, better texts, better editing and a better publisher!
But, remember, it will never be good enough, never!

Dear Aristotelis, if this is what you want, then go for it.
If not, then go out, have a long and healing walk along the sea shore of that wonderful island of yours, you lucky b****t, and carry on with the little things of daily life and live, LIVE....

Good luck,

Philippe