Help me find a solid TLR

VisualDarkness · Jan 15, 2015

I want to get a TLR but at the moment I don't know which one.

I got a thing for a bit odd, somewhat clumsy and solid metal cameras like my Voigtländer Prominent, Ultramatic and Bergheil so you maybe got a feel for what I enjoy. I was eyeing an Ansco Automatic Reflex in a nice condition that was sold here in Sweden and went cheap but I let my brothers' girlfriend get it instead as she wanted her first medium format camera. It was a nice fit as she really likes it and is shooting her first roll now! I really envy you in the US that can find these beauties quite cheap.

I'm tempted at getting a similar Ansco myself but they are really expensive on Ebay considering that they all are in US and together with an expensive USD means on really expensive import for me.

I stupidly jumped a cheapish Mamiya C330 in nice working condition based on that I think they are a bit ugly, but later regret that move.
I've also checked out Voigtländer Superb but while they are available here they seem really expensive in a fully working condition and I've read that many repairmen won't touch them (like some of my other Voigtländers). Rolleiflexes are around but seem to be even more expensive in good working conditions.

So to sum it up some wishes:
- Nice metallic look and feel
- Lens F3.5 or faster. Rendering don't have to be "clinical", I got a Heliar for sharpness on my Bergheil. Wider angle is a plus.
- Oddity is a plus, most my cameras are quirky to say the least.
- Price bellow 150 would nice, if under 100 I might get a professional CLA for it.

Do you got any nice suggestions of cameras I might have overlooked?

piu58 · Jan 16, 2015

May be you find a decent Rolleicord of the V series for that price. Your budget should allow a CLA in the near future, independend from the model you buy.

removedacct1 · Jan 16, 2015

The Minolta Autocord is hard to beat for build quality and sharp optics, and because its not "one of the cool cameras" right now, it can be had for a good price. I paid $250 for one recently. The Autocord has some excellent features and is a pleasure to use --> https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8668/16250592412_0b7db4afbf_c.jpg

VisualDarkness · Jan 16, 2015

APUGuser19 said:
Find a Yashica mat 124G in good shape.

piu58 said:
May be you find a decent Rolleicord of the V series for that price. Your budget should allow a CLA in the near future, independend from the model you buy.

I've checked both but they feel a bit unexciting in my eyes for some reason, though I'll keep them in mind. I'm usually pretty lucky with buying old cameras in working condition but I know about the CLA part for sure, got a Voigtländer Prominent that needs one for sure.

paulbarden said:
The Minolta Autocord is hard to beat for build quality and sharp optics, and because its not "one of the cool cameras" right now, it can be had for a good price. I paid $250 for one recently. The Autocord has some excellent features and is a pleasure to use --> https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8668/16250592412_0b7db4afbf_c.jpg

I haven't looked at the Autocord earlier, but it seems nice. I've lately come to realize that I'm one of the wannabe oldies called "hipsters" by todays youth (note that I'm only 25), so "not one of the cool cameras right now" automatically makes it cooler in my eyes. I'm probably just hit my head too hard into something when I was younger.

MattKing · Jan 16, 2015

You may find that a Mamiya C33 would be more appealing to you (aesthetically) than the more modern C330.

Roger Cole · Jan 16, 2015

APUGuser19 said:
Find a Yashica mat 124G in good shape.

Or the 124 (non-G.) Not as many of them made but they do come up. I have one. The differences are mainly cosmetic, the G being all black while the 124 has much more chrome, and reportedly internal with possibly stronger gears in the winding mechanism of the 124. The "G" stood for gold plated flash contacts, not so important if you don't use flash (and I don't know if it's important even if you do.) They do make a noticeably different sound when winding. I like mine and it might be more appealing given these preferences. Here's a photo of mine:

YashicaMat 124 by Roger Cole, on Flickr

Patrick Robert James · Jan 16, 2015

Get a Zeiss Ikoflex. Try to find one with a Tessar if you want sharp. You said you want funky. Trying to figure out how to load an Ikoflex for the first time is definitely funky. I would say it is probably one of the most underrated cameras probably just because of the loading.

Lycka till!

jimjm · Jan 16, 2015

I've got a Rolleicord III and V and they're both great cameras. I think the build quality is just as good as my Rolleiflex 3.5, but some of the features are simpler and they're a bit lighter. While a 2.8 lens is not available with the 'Cord, the 3.5 Schneider lenses are outstanding. Shooting any TLR on the street will attract some attention. I get comments from everyone from old men to youg girls about what a cool camera it is.

Comparatively speaking, they can be had for less than the Rolleiflex due to the mis-perception that they're not as good. Main handling difference is that the winding and focusing knobs are on the same side of the camera, whereas the 'Flex has a winding crank on one side and focusing knob on the other. Other than the obvious concerns like lens condition, shutter accuracy and film advance, try to find one with a clean focusing screen and mirror as this will have a big impact on your shooting experience. Replacement focusing screens and mirrors can be found fairly easily, and they are simple to install or clean yourself.

I had a Mamiya C33 and C220 and ended up selling them as they were too heavy for my taste. Interchangeable lenses is the big plus with these, but I never used them as I much preferred the Rolleis.

goros · Jan 16, 2015

Have you looked at the Flexaret?

http://www.ebay.es/itm/Flexaret-V-a...346?pt=US_Vintage_Cameras&hash=item19fa370d8a

Cupog is a Czech shop, specialized in Flexarets. They were made by Meopta and are wonderful cameras. If you choose one, look for models V, VI and VII.

baachitraka · Jan 16, 2015

Why not a good, clean and working Rolleicord V, which has film advance and focus knobs on right-hand side.

anfenglin · Jan 16, 2015

Or even a Rolleicord III, the Xenar on mine is super sharp and the camera is great to use. I recently got a new screen from Ricke Oleson which makes it even better. My Rolleicord III cost the total of 60 Euros.

baachitraka · Jan 16, 2015

I don't underestimate Compur-Rapid but I prefer Synchro-Compur shutter.

Siompa · Jan 16, 2015

I got a rolleicord iv for 50 €ish (500 sek) + shipping in good condition. I've also seen a lot of different tlrs on tradera ( Swedish eBay) so you should be able to find something pretty cheap
Lycka till!

Meyer Trioplan · Jan 16, 2015

I like my Yashica 12, common enough to be found without too much issue, but just rare and quirky enough that most have never really heard much of it. Solid late 1960's construction and a very good f/3.5 lens in a dependable performer.

http://quirkyguywithacamera.blogspot.com/2014/09/return-to-film-perfect-12.html

nsurit · Jan 16, 2015

Hmm, what about a Super Ricohflex?

Jim Jones · Jan 16, 2015

APUGuser19 said:
Back to the Yashica, I consider it to be Yashica's one-hit wonder. I can think of other camera companies that had their famous model, when none of their other cameras were anything remarkable. But the 124 or G, or whatever was worthy of most honorable mention in the hall of fame of cameras. Think of a Vought F4U Corsair. What other airplane did Chance-Vought make that was anything remarkable? And the Corsair was designed for one thing, and was rejected, and found use with the Marines instead. And turned out to be the longest production run of any plane, and a ferocious and overwhelming adversary.
Yahsicamats generally turned out to be a nobleman among Japanese-made cameras.

The Yashica 124 is often promoted as the top of the Yashica TLR line, but older (and cheaper!) Yashicas with the Yashinon lens produce equally good images. They lack a few features that are mere conveniences. The main shortcoming of a Yashica D, 635, LM, or a few other models is their age. They may need servicing sooner than the newer 124.

flavio81 · Jan 16, 2015

nsurit said:
Hmm, what about a Super Ricohflex?

+1
That's the very definition of "SOLID" TLR, they are very tough, and the triplet lenses are OK once you stop down a bit.

Me, i'd recommend:

If you want a light camera, the Rolleicord with the Xenar/Tessar lenses

If you want a beautiful, extremely well made camera, any Rolleiflex

If you want a budget, good camera, any Yashica with Yashinon lens, like the Yashica 635, Yashicamat LM, etc.

If you want maximum versatility, the Mamiya C series (Mamiyaflex C2, Mamiya C3, C33, C330, C22, C220)

I'm partial to versatility, thus I kept the Mamiyas.

TheFlyingCamera · Jan 16, 2015

Funny how people are saying the Minolta Autocord is not "in" right now. I can remember not too terribly long ago when the Autocords were selling for $100 USD because they truly were out of fashion. I think they have acquired a bit of a cult following and now are selling for peak prices. If you want cheap and funky, try a Chinese TLR like a Pearl River or Seagull. The lenses are good, the construction, well... a bit hit or miss, but they should come in well under your budget unless you get a very recent production Seagull.

Dan Fromm · Jan 16, 2015

Hmm. VisualDarkness, I have an Ansco Automatic Reflex and have done my best to learn what's known about them. Mine doesn't work properly and the consensus is that they're fragile.

I've had one Flexaret, supposedly fully overhauled. It died very rapidly. But it didn't come from Geza Dunay, who trades on eBay as Cupog.

Paul in Arizona · Jan 16, 2015

I suppose the real question is if you want a somewhat exotic curio to fondle or a reliable camera to use.

Last summer I picked up a Rolleicord III in primo condition for $160. Thats the price of the yashicas or minoltas mentioned and much sturdier.

xya · Jan 16, 2015

if you want something really exotic, get yourself a weltaflex. should be within your budget, picture quality is fine, it's reliable, but sounds a bit cheap because the body is made of pressed steel. nevertheless a decent tlr.

VisualDarkness · Jan 16, 2015

Some really questions and suggestions posted! As you can see I've no way maked up my mind yet so any feedback is good.
I'll sheck every post more thoroughly later tonight or tomorrow. as I had a double exam today and my brain is a mush mush.

02Pilot · Jan 16, 2015

During the heyday of TLRs there were a lot of manufacturers producing them, some more successfully (both in terms of quality and sales) than others. The bargains are in the oddballs. For example, my first TLR was a Ciro-Flex Model D - simple and somewhat inelegant, but perfectly functional and capable of producing nice images with a coated Wollensak triplet. I recently bought a Mamiyaflex Automat A (early model with Olympus lenses) in semi-working condition for cheap; it's not one of the later interchangeable lens models and the counter wasn't working properly, so it was valued low. I passed on a similarly-priced Welta Superflex (called the Flektar in Europe) simply because I didn't need another camera so similar in capability to my Ciro-Flex. There were a bunch of European, Japanese, and American models of various quality and specification - if you want a low entry price, look to the lesser known ones.

smolk · Jan 16, 2015

Might also consider the MPP Microflex. Its weakness (and probably poor reputation) is that you need to learn how to load film (basically, when you take one out, immediately reload before closing the back). If you don't, film transport will go awry and it is of course possible that a previous user used too much force because of this. Its lens is a Taylor Taylor &Hobson 4 element Tessar-type, smooth, great rendering, great bokeh. The screen, as with all old TLRs, will be dark, but you can replace that. It's also very light. Crank-winding with automatic cocking of the shutter.
And if you're into odd, also consider the Semflex. Many models to choose from. I do no have any so can't tell, but the lenses they used should be up to scratch.
I have the Microflex and love it as much as my Rolleiflex 2.8C.

removedacct1 · Jan 16, 2015

If its quirky you want, consider the Lubitel from Russia. Although its basically a plastic device, it IS a twin lens reflex, but a very stripped down, utilitarian camera. Shooting wide open it has very unique "lens character"! This camera can be had for about $40 USD.
For example:

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