Help me decide: Plaubel Makina 67 or Fuji 690

[Businessfotos]

Hello everyone, I'd like your help in deciding which camera I should invest in. Or talk me out of buying one at all ;-)

I am a long time fan of the Plaubel Makina 67 and am really pining for one. It has style, it has a great lens, it has a good amount of film estate. As on the other hand I already have the marvelous Fuji GS645 Pro as a travel companion I am a bit hesitate. Will I have the Plaubel with me when hiking or traveling? Will I use it for urban architecture shots? Will it improve my shots over the Fuji to justify the investment? I need to add that I also own a Hasselblad 503cx with 3 lenses.

Enter the Fuji Texas Leicas. I think they might be a bit too chunky for my liking. But they cost half the price of the Plaubel and have even more film estate. They seem solidly made and have quite a reputation for their lens. And there are no real alternatives around, besides the Mamiya 6 and 7 which are absurd pricey.

As I also fiddle around with some small 35mm rangefinders which I like to carry when I don't want to shoot with a brick and am having problems with I am also eyeing some further investment in that category, may it be another Canonet or perhaps the Leica CL for an upgrade. So the less-costly Fuji 690 would give me peace of mind to buy even more cameras.

Do I need the Plaubel? No. Neither do I need the Fuji or any other camera. Do I want to have the Plaubel despite? Yes. But it's quite hard to find and costs a lot.

Oh, and if you ask, what I intend to shoot with the Plaubel or the Fuji – may I send you to my blog where I show all my personal projects? It is blog.erdmenger.de. Thank you.

I am looking forward to hear from you, maybe someone here has a direct comparison between the two 120-cameras?
Regards, Till

 

[loccdor]

I can't speak to the Plaubel, but I had a Fuji GW690. It's great, while it's working, but their shutters need servicing after a certain time and I believe everyone who was doing that is now retired - someone can correct me if I'm wrong. When my shutter froze up, I sent it to a guy who never worked on one before, but was renown for working on a different model of camera. He said he would give it a try, it's now been over a year, he's made several attempts but has not been able to get it open.

But, if you get a working Fuji GW690 and it stays working: Excellent lens, extremely sharp, almost a little bit clinical (digital-era lens vibe) in its rendering. Great coatings. Very loud twang from the film counter when you press the shutter, not a quiet camera at all. Big. Great viewfinder/rangefinder, probably the most pleasing to work with, huge and bright, with parallax lines. Kind of annoying to use it in long exposures as you can't stop the exposure without advancing the film (causing streaking of light sources) or changing the shutter speed (causing vibration). The trick is to quickly put a hat over the lens before you wind on.

This is the shot mine died on, a 2 minute exposure, looks like it caused the gummy oil on the leaf shutter to migrate in such a way that it couldn't actuate. This shot was wide open around 5 am when there was very little light, yet you can see that there's plenty of detail.

 

[laser]

The Plaubel is compact and makes excellent images. However, it is obviously not robust. I needed to have the wiring for the meter repaired. Treat like a fragile instrument.

 

[Alex Varas]

I have had three Fuji GS690 one of them the wide version and I had in hands one Makina 67. Fujis are more robust cameras in my opinion and the ergonomics of the Makina is a bit odd in my hands.

Mamika 6x7 is a good option for traveling, mechanic camera and compact when folded. As you have the GS645 I would go for the Wide version of the Makina, more expensive but the lens is worthy.

My traveling camera is a Mamiya 6 with the 75mm, I’m fine with that personally, fits in my small Domke bag with another lens.

 

[Oldwino]

The Makinas are more robust than people seem to believe. One can handle the camera with a little care not to push on the bellows, or forget to set the focus to infinity when folding the camera. Just the same as not putting your finger through the shutter blades of your nikon, for instance. The meter wiring is the weak point, but that is repairable, and the meter is not absolutely necessary.
I traveled through cities and the backcountry with my 67 and never had an issue.

 

[radialMelt]

I have a Plaubel Makina 670 and while I love it, it has been a bit of a nuisance in terms of needing repairs... bellows, shutter, lazy tongs system... the stuff that is liable to be problematic with age. The 670s meter wiring harness is more robust than the 67s. Repair persons are a challenge as well. Only two people/shops work on them as far as I know. "wizcam" in Florida (recommended) and Nippon Photo Clinic in NY. I get the feeling Nippon Photo Clinic don't actually want to work on them, stating that work on the 670 starts at $1600USD. Outrageous. [EDIT: I see you're in Germany, perhaps the repair situation is better in Europe.]

With all the warts and challenges, the Plaubel Makina 67/670 is still the most portable 6x7 camera that I know of, perhaps challenged only by the Fuji GF670. I can fit it, a Leica M, and a spare lens + accessories, in a single 6L sling. Love it for travel. For this reason alone (not to mention the fantastic image quality the lens produces) I grin and bear the maintenance woes and hold on to it.

 

[Lachlan Young]

The Makina's lens is more characterful, the Fuji 690 is sharper.

 

[Prest_400]

I have been a GW690III user since 2014; Back then it was the most "bang for the buck" option in the modern 120 RF. I basically wanted a larger medium format negative that would be portable. They were underrated in the earlier 2010s but now are not as proportinally cheap anymore. Earlier on I missed one of those really good cheap deals on a Mamiya 7II, which I still see as the ultimate 6x7 RF but it is also a whole other price category.
GF670/Bessa III seemed an interesting option for travel, for some reason the Makina has not picked my attention as much but also wished I had one!

So far mine has behaved well, robust and reliable. No frills. I have heard about the repair situation overall and hope it just keeps going. OT but I dreamt the other day that I crushed while packing for a trip.
I might be able to answer better in a few months, ever since I got it I have wanted to take it to Asia using it on a trip and that plan is finally happening this year. It is a bit voluminous and ridiculous, a bit of a clown camera, but weighs 1.5KG and it's rather ergonomic (mkIII has a more contoured grip).

I do like 6x9 and the Fuji. It has been my sole "go to" medium format for all these years, not counting TLRs in need of CLA and Holgas. Crop down and you have the other aspect ratios, with the advantage of the horizontal ("panoramic"). To compliment it on the upcoming trip, I managed to get a Super Ikonta with a Tessar. But the haptics or optics aren't much comparable to the Fuji's. That's where your 645 is a nice option, and where Fuji had this half/full frame cameras complimenting each other.

Having the GS645 I would veer into that rather than 35mm. Such is my opinion due to the importance of film format commonality. But the 35mm vs 120 for travel photography is another topic.

However, at the current film prices and for the sake of more shots I would appreciate a GW680! I still think that in these years, as I do not shoot that much, the 2 shot/roll difference has not made up for the upfront cost of another tier camera like a Mamiya, Plaubel or GF670.

 

[xya]

I have had the Makina 67 for many, many years and it never failed, no problems at all and a superb lens in my opinion. The only problem for me was its weight, it's on the heavy side. I would not buy a Fuji again. I first had the GS 645, nice lens, but the camera failed many times. I finally sold it to my repair man. Then I bought a GA 645Wi, I still have it and I'm still very fond of it. Then came a GA 645Zi, which worked well, but I sold it in the end.

And the came the final blow: I bought a GF 670. I knew that this is a Cosina camera and it's the same as the Bessa III, more expensive. I should have bought the Bessa. When my GF failed, there was no repair from Fuji. When Cosina had stopped producing it, Voigtländer bought all the spare parts. And Voigtländer would not repair a Fuji. I read that Fuji even could not repair cameras under warranty. So inspite of my wonderful GA645Wi, I would never consider a Fuji again...

 

[itsdoable]

I have the Plaubel Makina 67 and the W670, as well as the FujiFilm GWS690ii. I don't have the GW690 and at one time was looking at the G690 with lenses, but never went there.

I also owned the Mamiya-7 with 3 lenses (which I regrettably sold).

Of these, I probably put the most film through the Mamiya.

I like the Plaubels more than the FujiFilm, they are more compact, have a nicer feel, and don't have that annoying "ping".

Lens wise, the Mamiya's were probably the best. In practice I'm the limiting factor in image quality.

 

[radialMelt]

I have the Plaubel Makina 67 and the W670, as well as the FujiFilm GWS690ii. I don't have the GW690 and at one time was looking at the G690 with lenses, but never went there.

I also owned the Mamiya-7 with 3 lenses (which I regrettably sold).

...

How does the size of the Mamiya body (without a lens attached) compare to the PM67 in its folded state? I am always dreaming of a Mamiya 7, but I do not want to buy/carry a larger bag!

 

[Lachlan Young]

How does the size of the Mamiya body (without a lens attached) compare to the PM67 in its folded state? I am always dreaming of a Mamiya 7, but I do not want to buy/carry a larger bag!

Mamiya 7 is bigger, with a much chunkier grip. For whatever metaphysical reason, whenever I've held a Mamiya 7, it's never made me want to buy one. I can see the focus wheel on the Plaubel having the same effect on people, though it doesn't bother me.

 

[Businessfotos]

Thanks you so much for all this detailed insight! I think I gravitate towards the Plaubel, if this wasn't obvious from the beginning ;-) Let's see. I spotted one the other day, CLA´d from a reseller but it was gone too quick … will search for more temptations ;-)

 

[itsdoable]

How does the size of the Mamiya body (without a lens attached) compare to the PM67 in its folded state? I am always dreaming of a Mamiya 7, but I do not want to buy/carry a larger bag!

I don't have the Mamiya-7 anymore, and don't have an archived comparison photo (I thought I did), but here they are with a Mamiya-6, the "7" is about 1cm wider, and does not collapse. The FujiFilm GW690 series is definitely big.

Here is the Makina and Mamiya (without lens) from above, the Mamiya depth is just minimally larger, but you have to close the secondary shutter to remove the lens, which you can accidentally trip to open, so it's preferable to leave a lens on.

Mamiya 7 is bigger, with a much chunkier grip. For whatever metaphysical reason, whenever I've held a Mamiya 7, it's never made me want to buy one. I can see the focus wheel on the Plaubel having the same effect on people, though it doesn't bother me.

I do find the grip on the Mamiya-7 to be very ergonomic - it's easy to walk around with the camera in one hand. I cannot say the same for the Makina, but it's design goal was different. Personally, I find the Mamiya more "Leica" like than the FujiFilm, it has AE and a spot meter, controls are easier to adjust, it's fast and quick to capture fleeting moments. It also has a better viewfinder.

Thanks you so much for all this detailed insight! I think I gravitate towards the Plaubel, if this wasn't obvious from the beginning ;-) Let's see. I spotted one the other day, CLA´d from a reseller but it was gone too quick … will search for more temptations ;-)

I think you will like the Makina, I bought mine way back when they were "just expensive", and I've never had the urge to sell it. You do have to take care of them more than the Mamiya or FujiFilm, but that goes with any folder. It has traveled a fair bit with me, especially when cycling, hiking or canoeing. On the other hand, the Mamiya-6/7 was great for things like weddings.

Most Makina-67s were manufactured by Mamiya, including the one above - the early Copal made ones often had issues.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Personally, I find the Mamiya more "Leica" like than the FujiFilm

The VF/ RF was completely changed on the III version of the Fuji - I think a lot of people assume that because it looks like a giant Leica it must react like one too, and then get annoyed when it is slower.

 

[radialMelt]

Here is the Makina and Mamiya (without lens) from above, the Mamiya depth is just minimally larger, but you have to close the secondary shutter to remove the lens, which you can accidentally trip to open, so it's preferable to leave a lens on.

View attachment 379080

Thanks a lot for this, and the info! Much appreciated. I actually leave the hood attached to my PM670 at all times, so the sizes are surprisingly quite comparable. That is, without a lens attached to the Mamiya. You make an excellent point about the secondary shutter though. Good to know!

 

[Businessfotos]

Hey, just wanted to tell you all that I got a (hopefully) nice deal on a Plaubel 67. Coming in from Vienna right now I am looking forward to get my hands on this adorable camera and test it out … will keep you updated when it arrived. Thanks again for all your input and the photos that helped me a lot!

 

[DREW WILEY]

I have both GW690iii and GW690ii Fuji. Yeah, a tad bulky; but these handhold for me really well when I need to work tripod-free, and I love the proportion of the longer rectangle. They're also simplified, so probably less to worry about maintenance wise. Weight-wise, these Fuji RF's are pretty light in their own right, at least compared to MF SLR's. The lack of interchangeable lenses is sometimes an annoyance, along with the lack of any true T setting; but there again, simplicity is sometimes an advantage.

 

[Arthurwg]

I suggest the Mamiya 7. Interchangeable lenses, easy to hand hold, repairable. Much more versatile than the Makina, much lighter than the Fuji.

 

[nathanbucs]

I got a Plaubel Makina recently but somehow despite its size I can’t get used to the ergonomics: focus wheel, iso settings, etc.

I might trade it soon for a Rolleiflex 2.8

 

[radialMelt]

I got a Plaubel Makina recently but somehow despite its size I can’t get used to the ergonomics: focus wheel, iso settings, etc.

I might trade it soon for a Rolleiflex 2.8

Have you ever used a TLR? The ergonomics are an entirely different beast again (not implying good or bad, don't get me wrong).

Funnily enough I was looking back on a few photos of mine taken with a Rolleiflex 3.5F (I also have a Plaubel Makina, the 670) and the image quality was fantastic. Kind of miss it to be honest...

 

[abruzzi]

Have you ever used a TLR? The ergonomics are an entirely different beast again (not implying good or bad, don't get me wrong).

everyone is different with what works for them, but yeah, I could never get along with TLRs. Granted, I was at the cheaper end of the spectrum than a Rollei--Yashicamat 124G--but it turned me off to them.

 

[DREW WILEY]

TLR's are a completely different experience than RF's. I never got along with them.

 

[Oldwino]

While I prefer shooting RF cameras vs TLRs, I generally like my Rolleicord pix better...

 

[Scott Micciche]

Just to add to the GW690 spring sound, it is not from the counter, but the cocking bar as it is thin, stamped steal and rings once triggered. I have had the camera apart for another issue and there is zero sound correlation between the counter and the shutter release. It is a great camera, nice lens, but the character from the nikkor 80mm f/2.8 in the Plaubel is worth seeking and spending the extra money.