• Welcome to Photrio!
    Registration is fast and free. Join today to unlock search, see fewer ads, and access all forum features.
    Click here to sign up

HC-110, Dil B vs......?

RattyMouse

Member
Allowing Ads
Joined
Oct 18, 2011
Messages
6,045
Location
Ann Arbor, Mi
Format
Multi Format
I normally use HC110 at 1:47 (Dilution E I think). This is much more dilute than the ever popular dilution B. Of course, using the more dilute dilution means you develop for a longer time.

My question is: Are there any other advantages to using Dilution B (the more stronger dilution) over dilution E besides shorter development time (and the temperature control that comes with shorter times)? Is the grain better perhaps with shorter times? Anything else?

Using dilution E dramatically lowers my developer costs so I've been using it happily for quite some time. But I never asked this question before so I'm not sure if I am missing anything using the weaker dilutions.

Thanks!!
 
darkosaric said:
Dilution B is a must when developing some old films - having shorter developing time will give you lower base fog. For normal use - whatever works for you, I love HC110 and Rodinal for having lower costs and good shelf life.
Click to expand...

Interesting. I'll be developing film that has traveled with me through 3 or 4 x ray machines in airports. Might shorter times be useful here?
 
HC-110 is some how not so economical compare to Rodinal.
 
darkosaric said:
Dilution B is a must when developing some old films - having shorter developing time will give you lower base fog.
Click to expand...

Good to know. I've got some (very) old films to shoot, oldest might be 1940s or so, I was specifically going to buy some HC (well, Ilfotec-HC but as far as I know it's the same) because I've heard it's good for low fog, I'll stick them in for a short-time dilution too, thanks.
 
baachitraka said:
HC-110 is some how not so economical compare to Rodinal.
Click to expand...

I see that HC110 price seems to have gone up. It used to be the cheapest developer of all back in 2008 or so when I last checked. Now it appears that Rodinal is cheaper.

Current Freestyle prices, and assuming $13/lb for sulfite:

Developer price ml price/ml typical use, ml typical cost per use
HC110 $36.00 1000 0.036 10 $0.36
Rodinal $13.00 500 0.026 10 $0.26
Xtol 1:1 $10.40 5000 0.00208 250 $0.52
DD-X $20.00 1000 0.02 100 $2.00
Ilfotec HC $52.00 1000 0.052 10 $0.52
D-23 1:1 $1.30 1000 0.001296163 250 $0.32
D-23 replenish $1.30 1000 0.001296163 20 $0.10
 

In Europe:

DD-X: 25,35€ --> 34$ --> 2,43$ per film.
APH09: 5€ (currently out of stock) --> 6,8$ --> 0,05$ per film.

With one liter of DD-X I can develop 14 films (1+4), with half liter of APH09 (1+100) I can develop 140 films.
I use 7dcl of working solution for 2 films.
 
Michael R 1974 said:
Why compare two completely different developers? And why compare an arbitrary dilution (Rodinal 1+100) and capacity to Ilford's recommended dilution for DD-X?
Click to expand...

It is not arbitrary dilution - on APH bottle it is written that you can use from 1+10 to 1+400, so 1+100 is in the middle, and I am using it in 99% of time.

I am not saying developer X is better than developer Y - I used those 2 developers as the most extremes in price.


But you should ask also BetterSense user - he started this list
 
I am happy to settle with DD-23, though the fear expressed here in apug on Double-bath haunt me occasionally.
 
baachitraka said:
I am happy to settle with DD-23, though the fear expressed here in apug on Double-bath haunt me occasionally.
Click to expand...

Whatever works for you is great
I know that there is no magic bullet, I am happy with Rodinal. But I like to experiment, it is fun. That is why, even after 10 years - I still from time to time change films, developers, cameras. Couple of months ago I tried DD-X, next is Moersch Tanol/Finol/Tanol Speed.
 
Several years ago, I was developing 4x5 sheet film in BTZS tubes. I experimented with varying contrast by keeping development time constant, but changing HC-110 Dilution. I wanted to be able to develop several sheets of film simultaneously, and to still be able to control contrast on an image by image basis. It works, but it turned out to be more trouble than just doing it the traditional way with varying times.
I have since moved away from BTZS tubes and develop my film in a Jobo processor.
 
I've used dilution B for decades then I played with stand development 1:100 (from concentrate). It was quite a revelation. I use this dilution with stand development for an hour with Arista Edu ASA 100 and 400 for high contrast scenes work very well. I agitate for the first minute. During stand development, the developer in the highlight areas exhaust first while the shadow areas keep developing. My negatives do get grainier from sitting in the soup so long, but the tonality is beautiful. I like the idea of working for a minute than walk away for an hour. I use a water bath to keep the temp constant.
 

Great googlymoogly. I can understand that it adds up if you shoot a lot and want to use DD-X. But the rest of these are so close I can't see how they could matter. If a difference of the ten cents a roll between $0.26 and $0.36 is really significant to you then I sympathize, I truly do, but I would respectfully suggest that your time would be better spent finding a better job or cutting expenses somewhere else.

Really, ten cents?
 

You almost certainly could. T-Max developer also suggests 1+4 but people use up to 1+9. I tend to use 1+5 but only because that gives me results I like with Kodak's times for 1+4. With extended times up to 1+7 works great. Some people like 1+9 though I personally didn't care for the midtones, though it is still workable.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
One of the advantages of HC-110 is that it was designed to give similar (although not identical) results at different dilutions.

If you are looking for economy, replenishment is your friend. X-Tol replenished costs about $0.14/roll.

I'm using HC-110 replenished, and it is very cheap, but the HC-110 replenisher is no more.

I would normally expect to develop about 160 rolls of film out of a 1 liter bottle of HC-110 if I was using it one shot and 1+47 (dil E, essentially the same as 1+49). I can afford $0.22/roll.
 
Roger Cole said:
Great googlymoogly.
Click to expand...

...I injured the fur trapper.

I can understand that it adds up if you shoot a lot and want to use DD-X. But the rest of these are so close I can't see how they could matter.
Click to expand...

I agree---compared to the costs of film, developer is cheap. I guess it makes sense to keep an eye on your "cost of operations" in a general way, but is anyone really more limited by the cost of developer than by the cost of film, fixer, paper, or time? Heck, if you use DIH2O, the cost of *water* is higher than the cost of a lot of these developers.

Personally, I've never noticed a functional difference between HC-110 dilutions, apart from developing times. In theory there must be one, but I think you need to have other variables under pretty tight control for it to become important. (I thought the point about fog made sense, but as I think about it, I'm not so sure. Age-related fog is from actual activated silver grains, isn't it? It seems like those grains will develop with the rest of the film, irrespective of developer working speed---especially in the shadows where it's most important. But honestly, I don't understand how the antifoggants work---How Do It Know?)

-NT
 
Roger Cole said:
I would respectfully suggest that your time would be better spent finding a better job or cutting expenses somewhere else.
Really, ten cents?
Click to expand...

When I was doing my Engineering degree, I did some work experience soldering some tiny tiny stuff, resistors 0.04"x0.02" in size, and price to match.
Even at my pretty low rate, I worked out that if I dropped one on the floor, I had to spend less than 2.3 seconds finding it or it would be cheaper to grab a new one (and yes, I did that calculation on comapny time).

Somehow this thread has become about economy, so consider this: if 10c is the difference in price per roll, and you shoot 1 roll per week, at the end of the year you'll have enough money to buy about 1 more roll of film.
 

But you will have no money left to develop it!! :devil:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Menu
Log in
Register