Hasselblad 501CM or Bronica ETRSi?

[viktormadarasz]

Hi,

I know this is going to be a silly question and as the answers will be very subjective, but is there any objective opinion and/or facts which could help me decide which camera i should go for?

The Hasselblad is priced around 1300-1500€ in ebay while the Bronica tops up around 400-600€ on the same marketplace...

I heard that the lens quality and usability is superior on the hasselblad but is it really true?

Optional: If available to use in the near future Digital Back on any of those cameras it could be a major factor (well not as long as I cant put my hands on a Digital back which is cheaper than 2000-2500€ LoL)

Thanks in advance,

Viktor

 

[Paul Green]

Sorry to assume but do you mean SQAI? as that is the 6x6 model.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hasselblad is always the answer. As the Packard advertisements said' "Ask the man that owns one."

Steve

 

[viktormadarasz]

Paul,

I was actually thinking about the 6x9 ETRSi....I know its not exactly the same like Hasselblad one...

 

[viktormadarasz]

Glass,

Do you have the 501cm? or another model?

 

[vpwphoto]

I have used both.. The Bronica stuff is very fragile. The Hasselblad is the stuff of Legend. There are a half dozen of them still on the moon. They only took back the 70mm film backs with them, moon rocks were more valuable than lenses and cameras. If money is the issue I am sure the Bronica will serve you well. I am hard on equipment and I know I would have destroyed a Bronica a couple times over by now. (I am commercial shooting pro).
I honestly think the lenses are relatively similar.. Zeiss is great has a certain character, but I am sure the Bronica lenses have some charms too.

 

[vpwphoto]

I bet my Leaf Aptus back (for Haselblad 500 cameras) is only worth $3000-$4000 USD now.

 

[brucemuir]

Hasselblad affords you the use of Zeiss optics.

Case closed

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hasselblad affords you the use of Zeiss optics.

Case closed

 

[Sirius Glass]

Glass,

Do you have the 501cm? or another model?

503CX and 903 SWC

 

[lxdude]

Paul,

I was actually thinking about the 6x9 ETRSi....I know its not exactly the same like Hasselblad one...

It will take two ETR-Si's to get 6x9...

 

[vpwphoto]

Optional: If available to use in the near future Digital Back on any of those cameras it could be a major factor (well not as long as I cant put my hands on a Digital back which is cheaper than 2000-2500€ LoL)

Viktor

The early Imacon Backs are now in that price range...

 

[Tony-S]

Hasselblad affords you the use of Zeiss optics.

Case closed

So, how about my Rolleiflex SLX with its Zeiss 80mm f/2.8 Planar?

 

[Dan Daniel]

The Bronica is a good system. If the choice is buy an ETRSi or wait a long time before the Hasselblad is going to happen, buy the Bronica. Hasselblad is better built all around, etc. The differences in the lenses are real but minor. The only camera worth anything to me is one I am using, not dreaming about.

 

[TareqPhoto]

Hasselblad 501cm no doubt.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Modern Bronicas were popular with wedding shooters particularly for their ergonomics, if that's a factor for you. An SQ with the winder grip and a prism is surprisingly lightweight and feels a lot like an oversized 35mm SLR--more so than a Pentax 67, which looks more like a 35mm SLR. I haven't tried an ETRS, but my impression is that was one of the attractions of the system.

You can't argue with the Zeiss optics on quality in general, but when you think about the question of budget, you have to ask whether you can do better given the way you shoot with, hypothetically, a 3-lens Hassy system or a 6-lens Bronica system for similar cost. Maybe that Zeiss ultrawide or long tele is better than the equivalent Zenzanon, but you can't make a photograph with a lens that isn't in the bag.

 

[brian steinberger]

Posts like this come up all the time. I'm even guilty of starting a few. The bottom line is what your ego and your wallet will allow. Sure everyone would take the Hasselblad stuff if they could afford it. But if you buy the Bronica stuff will you find yourself saying "man I wish I bought a Blad instead"? I've used both Bronica and Hasselblad stuff in the past. Both are great. Sure Hasseblad stuff is better built, but the Bronica stuff will serve you just fine if you take care of it. Differences in lenses are minor, but I would certainly give the edge to the Zeiss glass.

If you're just entering medium format I'd go for the Bronica. Save the extra cash to buy more film and paper to gain experience. And if later down the road you want to take the leap, sell the Bronica and buy a Hassy.

 

[aoresteen]

The ETR will require a prism (unless you don't shoot any vertical pictures). The Hasselblad doesn't need one as the negative is square. What size prints will you make? I use both Hasselblads and a Mamiya 6451000s. The Bronica lenses are very good as well. Try both out and buy the one YOU like best.

 

[PentaxBronica]

First off, the ETRSi is a 6x4.5 camera rather than 6x6. I think it's probably the largest camera I'd want to lug around on foot for long.

I bought one last month, I haven't used a Hasselblad but I'd say the Bronica is a lot of camera for the money. Because Bronica kept the lens/back/viewfinder mounts for many years there are plenty of accessories on the used market. Mine had the common problem with a crack in the viewfinder mount area but that was easily repaired with some carefully applied superglue and didn't make much difference to the camera anyway. Obviously worth checking before you buy. The rest of it feels sturdy enough to me, aside from a couple of places where the leatherette covering has lifted slightly (again, easily sorted).

If you do decide to buy one then spend the extra for the "i" version rather than the ETR or ETRS. They're all great, but the "i" has mirror lockup and TTL flash. You can fit any lens/viewfinder/back from any ETR/S/i to this body.

The AE prism is worth having, and I'd recommend the speed grip as without that the camera is a bit awkward to use. Conversely, the waist level finder works better for me without the grip!

A couple of things to look for: If you get the Polaroid back you may want the tripod spacer to go with it. My Redsnapper ball head is fine without the spacer but it does mean you can't really use a table or similar to rest the camera on.

There's also a special focusing screen to go with the 35mm backs, this has etched lines marking the edges of the 35mm frame. It suits both the normal and panoramic backs.

 

[viktormadarasz]

Thanks,

Well the questions is coming from the effort to try to make the best and most value/money ratio when I invest into the equipment. The price between these two (Bronica and Hasselblad) is not that giant difference, so if one can afford 500 than with some months of waiting finally he could do 1000 or 1500 thats how i see it.

So its really about making a good choice for a long term.I like to keep my things im not really that selling type, I would love to make a good choice prior on image and build quality and I wish the camera will serve me for a long long time.

As I saw from the answers Hasselblad goes beyond Bronica in build quality, although it still has to be a very good one as a first timers choice, its quiet recommended by many of You.

Sorry about my confusion by the exact format size of the Bronica

--------

Can You guys point me with the right direction about the nearly affordable 3000-4000$ price range of Hasselblad compatible used digital backs?I would love to get some more about it..I think that could really decide this battle for me between these to cameras ( in delight of being able to make future improvements with a digital back)

Thanks for All,

Viktor

 

[PentaxBronica]

I'm not sure about the Hasselblad digibacks but I can probably decide for you now - there aren't any for the Bronica. I did have a quick rummage on Google before buying mine but they just don't seem to exist. This may be why the Bronica gear is very sanely priced now, although some prices can be silly (£50+ for a Polaroid back when I paid £10 for one in excellent condition apart from a few scuffs?)

Not that it bothers me. When I get around to trying colour print film I'll just ask the lab for the negatives + CD option, with B&W I'll process it at home then scan the prints if I want to post images online.

 

[film_man]

I had a ETRS and I have a 501CM. I also had a SQB, which is the Bronica 6x6 camera.

For starters, the main question is do you want 645 or 6x6? This is not a trivial issue, it is a very different look the square vs the rectangular. There is also the practical issue of getting 15 shots per roll vs 12.

I'll start with the 501CM. It is a wonderful camera, I find it comfortable to hold, very nice to operate and the results are superb. Prints and scans come out really nice. The camera is relatively heavy, if you never used medium format gear before and if you add a prism it can be a bit of a shock at first.

Regardind prices, don't just think about the body and standard lens, have a look at the other lenses and accessories. I got a Hasselblad 90 degree prism for a bit more than what I sold my ETRS kit. A 50/75/150 ETRSi kit with the newest lenses plus prism plus grip and a few backs will cost you less than £1000. A 501CM kit with 50/80/150 plus prism and backs will cost you £2000-3500 depending how old/new lenses you buy.

The ETRS is lighter and fitted with a 90 degree prism and a speed grip it handles very much like a 35mm/digital SLR. It is fast to operate and easy. The minus points are that comapred to a Hasselblad it feels like a number of bits together. What I mean is that a medium format camera is indeed a number of bits togehter, back, body, lens, finder but when you hold the 501CM it feels like a solid block. The ETRS is like bits put together with bit rattling here or there, the prism jiggling a bit if pushed, the knobs and dials all a bit loose. There is a reason why it is cheaper, well this is it. This also goes for the SQB I had. The design of the ETRS/SQB is also a bit less thought out, things stick out and protrude here and there, the Hasselblad has everything flushed and slick.

Image quality wise, well the Hasselblad is sharper but the Bronica is sharp enough. The main difference I see is that the Hasselblad prints I have are with more contrast and better overall colour but if I was stuck with Bronica I wouldn't be unhappy.

So, basically, the differences are that moneywise, everything with Hasselblad on it is anything from 2-5x more expensive, you get better colour and contrast with the 501CM and you also get a heavier camera. And there is the obvious format difference. And if you want digital, as already said, there are a number of options for the 501CM but none for the Bronica.

 

[CGW]

You really do need to decide which format works best for you. After that, some realistic thinking about what you can afford is necessary. Frankly, don't fall into thinking that nothing is worthwhile unless you shoot Hasselblad--they're good but not that good to skip anything else. I'd also take issue with the view that Bronica products--whether 645 or 6x6--are subpar, fragile, plasticky crap; if so, they've miraculously delivered great results for me.Just make sure you get the newest and/or lowest mileage used gear you can find. Whatever the brand or price, heavily-used gear can be at or near the end of its service life and require repairs that quickly kill any illusion of a bargain. Get the best you can afford and start shooting.That's what matters most.

 

[ruilourosa]

If you want the best in MF you should go to hasselblad or rollei

i have: 500, 501, plus: 50, 60, 80, 100, 150

all good zeiss, but took some years to make this collection, now i feel the urge to buy the super wide, but is a bit expensive...


maybe a toyota could be as good as a mercedes, but man...

 

[wiltw]

Retrofitting a digital back is mechanically easier and less expensive with Hasselblad, than with Bronica (which would use a special adapter to mount a Hasselblad compatible digital back onto the Bronica). But keep in mind that there is absolutely no connection between the body and the back, so that shooting with a digital back and a film-oriented body will not be as well coordinated as using a MF body which was designed to work with a digital back (even a removable one). And digital backs are horrendously expensive to buy. I would love to have a digital back for my Bronica (even with the extra expense of the adapter) but they are almost as bad as the deficit in the state budget.