Harman Photo cryptic announcement/teaser

Dustin McAmera · Oct 27, 2023

I went to the 'Search classes' page and searched for 'photographic film' Under Class 1 it gave me this list. I think Harman's IP agent (or whatever) has listed all of those that might apply. If they hadn't included cine film in the list, and later decided they wanted to make it, they'd have to do a new application, and pay everybody again.

Unexposed photographic film
Photographic film [unexposed]
Sensitized photographic film
Unexposed photographic films
Photographic films [unexposed]
Photographic chemicals for processing photographic films
Sensitised photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the production of microfilms
Photographic media [films, unexposed]
Photographic chemicals for developing photographic films
Sensitized photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the production of microfilms
Unexposed colour photographic films
Unexposed cinematographic film
Sensitised photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the development of microfilms
Sensitized photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the development of microfilms
Unexposed photographic film for the production of printed circuit boards
Photographic film, not exposed
Strips of sensitised photographic film [unexposed]
Unexposed camera film
Sensitised photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the duplication of microfilms
Sensitized photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the duplication of microfilms
Unexposed sensitized photographic films
Transparent film in roll form [photographic, unexposed]
Transparent film in sheet form [photographic, unexposed]
Unexposed cinematographic films
Photographic emulsions
Emulsions (Photographic -)
Unexposed film
Films (Sensitized, unexposed -) for use in photography
Unexposed X-ray film
Photographic paper
Transparent films [photographic, unexposed] for overhead projectors
Chemical preparations and materials for film, photography and printing
Media for recording visual images [sensitised films]
Unexposed photographic paper
Photographic chemicals for processing photographic plates
Unexposed sensitized lithographic film

AnselMortensen · Oct 27, 2023

Well, that narrows THAT down....

Roger Cole · Oct 27, 2023

Don_ih said:
Even if simple to manufacture, it would likely be impossible to sell even a single manufacturing run of it. And can't forget about the chemical cocktails required that they'd have to find someone to package.

I'm reasonably sure it won't be Ciba/Ilfochrome but - the chemistry is nothing special. Regular B&W paper developer and fixer can be used for those, and many people did. Only the bleach is proprietary (and in large quantities apparently rather environmentally nasty judging by the problems commercial labs that used a lot of it had) but I don't think it was all that complex for them to manufacture.

koraks · Oct 27, 2023

Roger Cole said:
Only the bleach is proprietary (and in large quantities apparently rather environmentally nasty

Not just that. It had a limited shelf life, too. As I pointed out earlier, for a product that would likely see low-volume use for the most part, this would create a logistical challenge. Not to mention that what we experienced as a mild environmental concern in the 1980s/1990s would probably be a total non-starter today.

Agulliver · Oct 27, 2023

Kino said:
I cannot imagine that; it would be an enormously stupid thing to do.

However, that list could imply they are forming a new distribution wing that can handle more brands and types of photographic materials than just those associated with Illford.

In any regard, their little posting has done the trick and generated endless speculation and notice.

I am sure they'd only drop the Ilford name if they had to....if for some reason the license to use it expired. Which all seems unlikely....but then so is Harman having perfected a new colour film.

REgarding the use of the trademark, that list does not mean that Harman intend to manufacture or distribute all those items. It's a class of items, with the actual list provided by the trademark office. It would also make sense for them to include everything reasonably conceivable in case they later want to produce something and then don't have to go back and re-register the trademark.

Having done it myself, registering a UK trademark isn't very difficult or costly but it's still something you don't want to keep doing every time you add a product line or new service.

Over on Instagram, Harman have denied that it's rebranded Kodak-made film.

Agulliver · Oct 27, 2023

AnselMortensen said:
Well, that narrows THAT down....

It actually does.....because I don't see "photographic darkroom equipment" in there....which would probably rule out a new portable enlarger as being at the forefront of this endeavour. Nothing prevents them from doing so, but it's not specifically listed in the types of products that the trademark is registered for.

This now clearly is film and/or paper and/or chemical related.

4season · Oct 27, 2023

foc said:
What do you think about these as likely candidates?

Film: Besides the obvious (color), is there some specialist b&w product that's gone missing?
Enlarger: Seems logical to me, though odds are slim. But wouldn't an updated suitcase unit be something.
Easel: Seems less vital than an enlarger.
Film strip scanning device: Does not promote use of photographic paper!
Transmission densitometer: Cool, but for advanced users.

Agulliver · Oct 27, 2023

4season said:
Film: Besides the obvious (color), is there some specialist b&w product that's gone missing?

220 and 127 film, for example. But there's no reason why Harman couldn't market them as Ilford.....after all, if they have implemented production of 229 or 127 film they'll likely start with something like HP5 anyway. Little point in selling it under the Harman name, and starting off a whole website and set of social media accounts for that.

Whatever it is, Harman feel it's significant. And the trademark hints strongly that it's film, paper or chemicals at the core of it.

However unlikely, I am leaning towards it being either a complete rebrand of existing Ilford products to the Harman name, or it's actually colour film...possibly produced in cooperation with another company.

retina_restoration · Oct 27, 2023

Whatever it is, the reveal is imminent

mshchem · Oct 27, 2023

Agulliver said:
220 and 127 film, for example. But there's no reason why Harman couldn't market them as Ilford.....after all, if they have implemented production of 229 or 127 film they'll likely start with something like HP5 anyway. Little point in selling it under the Harman name, and starting off a whole website and set of social media accounts for that.

Whatever it is, Harman feel it's significant. And the trademark hints strongly that it's film, paper or chemicals at the core of it.

However unlikely, I am leaning towards it being either a complete rebrand of existing Ilford products to the Harman name, or it's actually colour film...possibly produced in cooperation with another company.

It's not impossible to imagine Ilford producing something like 620, 127 and 220. Finishing it in a low cost country with unsophisticated machines.

Having said this it's likely to be something that appeals to everyone, not just Sirius Glass and Me.

mshchem · Oct 27, 2023

Maybe it's an app.

bardamu · Oct 27, 2023

not sure why, but I feel like whatever it is, it's going to be a disappointment

Agulliver · Oct 27, 2023

mshchem said:
It's not impossible to imagine Ilford producing something like 620, 127 and 220. Finishing it in a low cost country with unsophisticated machines.

Having said this it's likely to be something that appeals to everyone, not just Sirius Glass and Me.

Harman pride themselves on high quality products. I doubt they'd get those formats finished in anywhere cheap. And in any case, surely they'd use the Ilford name. They'd have every right to use it. This is something that requires use of a name other than Ilford, and yet relates to film/paper/chemicals.

Agulliver · Oct 27, 2023

mshchem said:
Maybe it's an app.

The trademark is registered for use with sensitised photographic material, film/paper/chemicals/plates and suchlike. While they could also produce an app, it's not sensible to register a trademark for photo-sensitised materials and then use it for an app.

Agulliver · Oct 27, 2023

retina_restoration said:
Whatever it is, the reveal is imminent

Well, the event is closer than it was yesterday.

And it is now even closer.

But it could still be days away.

destroya · Oct 27, 2023

its a wish and a stretch, but seeing as they did some work for Fuji finishing their acros II film....(dont flame me for wishing)

Harman will now make both Ilford and Fuji' B&W films, which will bring back some discontinued films and Fuji will make color film, both slide and neg for Harman. A joint venture to save film for both companies.

would love to see harman Astia and provia 400x products

John

4season · Oct 27, 2023

retina_restoration said:
Whatever it is, the reveal is imminent

Cool industrial soundtrack, is it the sound of film being made?

mshchem · Oct 27, 2023

4season said:
Cool industrial soundtrack, is it the sound of film being made?

Sounds like when I got a flat tire on my bike this week.

Maybe it will coincide with Halloween???

BMbikerider · Oct 27, 2023

Dustin McAmera said:
I went to the 'Search classes' page and searched for 'photographic film' Under Class 1 it gave me this list. I think Harman's IP agent (or whatever) has listed all of those that might apply. If they hadn't included cine film in the list, and later decided they wanted to make it, they'd have to do a new application, and pay everybody again.

Unexposed photographic film

Photographic film [unexposed]

Sensitized photographic film

Unexposed photographic films

Photographic films [unexposed]

Photographic chemicals for processing photographic films

Sensitised photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the production of microfilms

Photographic media [films, unexposed]

Photographic chemicals for developing photographic films

Sensitized photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the production of microfilms

Unexposed colour photographic films

Unexposed cinematographic film

Sensitised photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the development of microfilms

Sensitized photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the development of microfilms

Unexposed photographic film for the production of printed circuit boards

Photographic film, not exposed

Strips of sensitised photographic film [unexposed]

Unexposed camera film

Sensitised photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the duplication of microfilms

Sensitized photographic film (Unexposed -) use in the duplication of microfilms

Unexposed sensitized photographic films

Transparent film in roll form [photographic, unexposed]

Transparent film in sheet form [photographic, unexposed]

Unexposed cinematographic films

Photographic emulsions

Emulsions (Photographic -)

Unexposed film

Films (Sensitized, unexposed -) for use in photography

Unexposed X-ray film

Photographic paper

Transparent films [photographic, unexposed] for overhead projectors

Chemical preparations and materials for film, photography and printing

Media for recording visual images [sensitised films]

Unexposed photographic paper

Photographic chemicals for processing photographic plates

Unexposed sensitized lithographic film

This is really exciting but not as much as watching paint dry!"

mshchem · Oct 27, 2023

BMbikerider said:
This is really exciting but not as much as watching paint dry!"

Ha, exactly. Maybe simply trying to reel in more instagram accounts

mshchem · Oct 28, 2023

Maybe big announcement is Fotoimpex is selling HC-110

removedacct3 · Oct 28, 2023

bardamu said:
not sure why, but I feel like whatever it is, it's going to be a disappointment

Of course, all the teasers on social media indicate they are after youngsters, not old, gray or bold

Dustin McAmera · Oct 28, 2023

You mean it's a selfie stick?

Ian Grant · Oct 28, 2023

MrclSchprs said:
Of course, all the teasers on social media indicate they are after youngsters, not old, gray or bold

Ilford assume we are customer anyway

Ian

Agulliver · Oct 28, 2023

To some extent, you're right. We already do (or don't) buy Ilford films, paper and chemicals . We are very aware of who Harman/Pemberstone/Ilford/Kentmere are and of their products. Many of us have been using them for decades.

The youngsters at whom this is aimed may well not be as familiar with the history of Ilford and their range of products.....and they're also very much interested in colour print film....

Harman Photo cryptic announcement/teaser

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