Getting film onto medium format reel.

[mporter012]

I find it just about impossible to load medium format film onto the paterson reels. I simply can't do it. I've tried and tried. I spent an hour on a roll the other day, was profusely sweating and cursing, and probably had stroke level blood pressure from anger by the time I gave up. It's still sitting in development tank, un-reeled. I've tried steel and had better luck. Any other tanks/reels anyone would recommend for medium format? I absolutely hate developing film - if i had the money I would happily send it off, I simply can't afford to do so.

Thanks,

 

[480sparky]

I use both. I prefer the stainless steel, but sometimes I can't get it to spool on correctly, so I just give up on it and go to the nylon. I lay both out before I start so they're both ready to go.

The best thing to do is buy a roll of the cheapest film you can find and practice in normal light.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Practice in daylight.

I have very good experience with the Hewes Steel Reels for 120 film. The other steel reels not so much.

I also have very good experience with the Jobo plastic reels for 120 film. Those feed the film into the reel by twisting the reels back and forth.

For plastic reels the reels must be clean and dry. Really real clean. Try running a pencil in the grooves to put graphite in the sides and bottom.

 

[Gerald C Koch]

I too prefer using a SS reel. There is a device that eases the loading. It is a piece of SS just a bit narrower than the reel. This keeps the film cupped as it is loaded onto a real. One should cost about $5. However once a film kinks it is almost impossible to load. In this case just load the film using the opposite end.

Plastic reels must be kept scrupulously clean or they have a tendency to jam. Also never try to load a wet plastic reel.

 

[DannL.]

My favorite tank/reel was the JOBO 1520 for 120 film. To make loading even easier I would round off the corners of the film with scissors before inserting the film in the reel. Reel should be clean and dry.

 

[Oren Grad]

If you otherwise like the Paterson reels, try the Samigon near-clone:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/122989-REG/Samigon_ESA325_Multi_Format_Autofeed_Reel.html

It has much larger "lips" which provide a much easier target for getting the film started on the reel.

 

[Saganich]

Kalt SS reels will never fail you for MF. I've used the same two reels for about 15 years now and never a problem.

 

[MattKing]

If you otherwise like the Paterson reels, try the Samigon near-clone:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/122989-REG/Samigon_ESA325_Multi_Format_Autofeed_Reel.html

It has much larger "lips" which provide a much easier target for getting the film started on the reel.

These are sold under a number of different brand names, including AP. Freestyle sells them under their house brand "Arista Premium": http://www.freestylephoto.biz/55043-Arista-Premium-Plastic-Developing-Reel

They work very well for me - I've replaced almost all my Paterson reels with them.

There are tanks as well in the same line which have the advantage of being very small and having straight sides.

 

[Doc W]

Sacrifice a roll of film. Run it through the camera but don't actually photography anything. Then unload the camera and practise in daylight until you get the groove. I had to do that and it helped immensely.

 

[summicron1]

there is a trick with both kinds, but like you I've never liked the plastic reels -- the reel must be absolutely dry and clean and even then if the film has too tight a curl the damn things won't load, especially towards the end where you are pushing a very long length of film in from the far end.

Get an SS real and do this -- sacrifice a roll of film and practice a bunch -- get the feel of the film in your hand so you hold it with just the right amount of gentle bend so it feeds onto the reel -- the idea is to have your thumb and forefinger on the reel and the film fees through them as you turn the reel and wind the film up.

Yes, it takes a little practice but once you have it down you will never, ever, have a miss-feed again. I haven't in the last 30 years or so, and if i can do it, anyone can do it.

 

[Kevin Caulfield]

Run your thumbnail down each of the two ball bearings just to make sure they are not stuck in the slot. When you start loading, push the first inch or so of film past the ball bearings, even a few inches or so. Then you should be able to ratchet the film onto the reel.

 

[Hilo]

The suggestion to practise in the light, and then with your eyes closed, is essential. Film developing is actually one of the nicest things to do, but yes, you must feel comfortable with the loading.

Some are very ok with the Paterson system, some not. I belong to the latter. I have used HP Combina since 1980, but have had to use Paterson in different teaching locations. I disliked that system so much that many times I'd bring my own . . .

HP Combina tanks show up regularly on the various Ebays. The essential difference in systems is that the film is loaded from the reel's INSIDE to the outside. To me that's the natural way.

There are different tanks with this system: for 135 there are 1; 2 and 5 reel tanks - for 120 there are 1 and 3 reel tanks. For 120 there exists a small 1 reel tank and a larger 1 reel tank (which can also do 220). I prefer this larger 120 1 reel tank.
The 135 2 reel tank is the same as the larger 120 1 reel tank. You always need an orange loader which comes in two parts that you need to connect to one another. Should you find any of these tanks you can always send me a message to have a look at it for you.

 

[480sparky]

...... Run it through the camera.........

Why?

 

[Slixtiesix]

Try to cut the edges of the film like I showed in this thread. (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

 

[R.Gould]

With a thinner film, such as Fomapan, let the film hang from the backing paper, and that keeps it straight, run a pencil around the groves of the reel, and it slips in very easily, with a thicker film such as Ilford/kodak tear the film from the backing paper and use the slightly thicker end that the sticky paper gives and start that end, film again slips in no problem, again, use a pencil around the groves of the reel, every 3 or 4 films and, for me,Voila, easy peasy

 

[hoffy]

Try to cut the edges of the film like I showed in this thread. (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

This. +1,000,000

Simply chamfer the edges of the film so they don't get caught on the ribs of the reel and you'll be set. But as others have said, make sure the reels are perfectly dry.

Your heart will thank you

 

[bernard_L]

Originally Posted by Doc W
...... Run it through the camera.........

Why?

So that everything is the same as when doing it for real. Including that you first find the free end of the film, and at the end encounter the taped end.

 

[winger]

I used to be really bad at loading 120 until I found and watched a video by Jason Brunner (an APUGer) that demonstrates loading a SS reel. I have a Hewes reel that's never failed me (since I watched the video). I always liked the plastic reels for 35mm and thought they'd work better for me for 120. Until I tried. So I use the Hewes for 120 and plastic for 35mm and all is right with the world. Or at least that's not the part of developing film that I screw up now. And, yes, I practiced at least 5 times with a dummy roll before using a "real" roll.

 

[jeffreyg]

Adding my 2 cents .... I've used the same Kinderman ss reels for 44 years and as suggested: dry reels and a practice roll of film plus clip the end of the roll on both edges on an angle and while slightly cupping the film secure it under the clip; (if right handed) have the "open" end of the reel facing left with the edges resting on a clean flat surface and gently roll the reel in place while keeping the film cupped with your right hand. With a little practice it should become easy.

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/

 

[Truzi]

One thing I try to do with Plastic reels, when I use them, is help guide the film in with my thumbs. I position them behind the flanges that the film goes under. This helps keep it on track for reels with small guide flanges, and a little friction from the thumbs helps push it along (though you have to be careful, and "vigilant" to prevent binding).

Also, when loading plastic, I always thread it by pulling it in the reel at least half-way around before I start to ratchet. This helps give it a good start.

I prefer steel now that I have gotten the hang of them.
Two weeks ago I could not get my 120 film to load on either of two steel reels - it kept going off-center after a few wraps, threatening to bind. I remembered someone on APUG mentioning they never used the clips to hold the film in steel reels. I tried that, and it worked well.

Oddly, I had no problem with either reel on the same type of film when doing my next batch (so obviously I was out of practice).

 

[Paul Verizzo]

Run your thumbnail down each of the two ball bearings just to make sure they are not stuck in the slot. When you start loading, push the first inch or so of film past the ball bearings, even a few inches or so. Then you should be able to ratchet the film onto the reel.

A stuck or sticky ball is almost always the reason a nylon reel won't work. They should flop from one end of their little cage to the other as you tilt the reel back and forth. I've had to use a silicon spray once to get a ball free, then I air blasted the reel and soap washed it.

You can also use your fingers as balls if you find yourself with a stuck one you didn't realize before trying to load. Just lightly touch the film surface, and alternate hands as you alternate direction of cranking. Easier than it sounds.

I'm one of those guys who cannot use a SS reel for 120 film! Each to their own. I also like the rapid pouring in and out of the plastic tanks, and that I can drop a thermometer into the center to monitor temperature.

 

[pentaxuser]

All good advice. When I see this much advice I cannot help but think of the scene in "Son of Paleface" with Bob Hope when he is given advice as to how to take on a notorious gunslinger and win and as he is leaving the saloon he tries each bit of advice on a cumulative basis as he passes each of the "advice givers".

It is hilarious. Anyone recall the scene?

Just to make things worse I'll add my bit as well

You might want to try and get a 120 Durst tank complete with an attachment that fixes to the reel and allows you to pass the film through it and directly onto the centre of the reel. You lift the spring in the centre and push the film just under it. Having done this you turn a small handle on the edge of the reel and it pulls the film into the reel.

So other than getting the start of the film under the spring in the centre for which no special skill or dexterity is really needed the rest is simply mechanical.

I have a 120 Jobo tank as well but given the choice I'd go for the Durst every time. It only takes one 120 film at a time but is the most leak-proof tank I have ever used and only needs 450 mls of chemical.

Just remember he draws to the left so lean to the right. There's a wind from the East, better aim to the West. He crouches when he shoots so stand on your toes

You really can't go wrong

pentaxuser

 

[gone]

To simplify (I assume you have plastic reels). Practice, practice, practice. Also, curl the film backwards at the end w/ your hands beforehand to take some of the curl out. Before you load the film, make sure you have scrubbed the reels w/ hot water, soap and a toothbrush if you have been using Photo Flo. It will build up, you won't see it, and will cause you a lot of trouble when loading film. Make 100% sure the reels are perfectly dry before loading film. I never completely unroll the film either w/ any format. Just pull out what you need to get started, and let the paper curl away from it on its own. Then uncurl the paper w/ your fingers as you go along once you get the film started on the reel. Its important to have everything at a convenient height, so you're not in an uncomfortable position.

I find it a LOT easier to take the stuff into a dark closet if you don't have a darkroom. Make sure to stuff clothes (not the wife's. If you do that, you'll have much worse problems then loading a film reel) around the door to make it really dark, and load the reels outside of the tank. I put in a series of nails inside the closet door frame around the perimeter, and simply hang the clothes on the hangers so that they overlap. Only the bottom needs something rolled over it to make things light tight. It goes a lot smoother that way, and you won't get the sweaty hand syndrome. If you're getting that, you can forget about loading a reel in a bag. Put the film into the tank and put the top on, take your hands out, go burn one or have a drink, and go back to it later.

 

[Neal]

Dear mporter012,

While we're all adding our tips, one that I picked up somewhere on APUG that works for me is to load the opposite end of the roll. That is, the end that was farther from the spool when the roll was produced. It tends to have a larger bend radius. Combined with one of the tips above this, curling back the leading edge, loading the reels tends to go along without too much issue.

BTW, if you already haven't, Dead Link Removed.

Good luck,

Neal Wydra

 

[Sirius Glass]

I find it a LOT easier to take the stuff into a dark closet if you don't have a darkroom. Make sure to stuff clothes (not the wife's. If you do that, you'll have much worse problems then loading a film reel) around the door to make it really dark, and load the reels outside of the tank. I put in a series of nails inside the closet door frame around the perimeter, and simply hang the clothes on the hangers so that they overlap. Only the bottom needs something rolled over it to make things light tight. It goes a lot smoother that way, and you won't get the sweaty hand syndrome. If you're getting that, you can forget about loading a reel in a bag. Put the film into the tank and put the top on, take your hands out, go burn one or have a drink, and go back to it later.

Better, I found this works for all film sizes up to and including 4'x5" and it is from one of our sponsors.
http://www.freestylephoto.biz/25001-Photoflex-Changing-Room