DREW WILEY
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- Joined
- Jul 14, 2011
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Cruise ship art!?
No, it is not art. Drrrft.
Ah, I see; this one is easy to settle. The only thing we have to agree on is the definition of art. Looks like we'll be able to bring this to a conclusion within 3-4 posts, tops.
So you knock his reputation and skill on gossip you read without firsthand experience other than looking at his photos on the web claiming you're "not fond of them", who has made tens of millions selling his photographs from his galleries in the biggest cities in the world.
Ah, but are the providers representing to you that the cruise ship art is likely to appreciate in value as an investment?
That is where the Peter Lik approach bothers me.
The fact that his cruise ship art isn't as much to my taste as others might be is irrelevant to my consternation.
Yes. By the way, most sales on ships are by bids. Of course, the gallery sets a minimum price for the first bid that he knows makes them their profit regardless if there's only one bid. That's a little shady too, I suspect.
Cruise ship art is like cruise ship jewlery is like cruise ship casino gambling: all are entertainmnet no matter how they are marketed. But why is setting a minimum bid where a profit is assured shady? Seems like good business to not take a loss, auction or otherwise. Ha you stated that misrepresentation of investment potential was shady I'd be more inclinded to agree, excpet for it's just another PT Barnum style marketing.
Why do so many people buy art? For investment purposes, as well as decorating. Don't any photographers here sell their photos let;s say an edition of 20. As more are sold, they raise their prices of what's left, arguing that their prints are now more rare, so their value has gone up. That's a lot of hokum. Well, that's what Lik does, as do most professional artists. Just don't guarantee the appreciation. That's what stock salesmen do. They imply but don't guarantee it will go up.
So is art. Go figure.
I was really thinking that Phoenix was going to be the return of Ciba/Ilfachrome.
I don't see a technical relationship between the Phoenix R&D trajectory and Ciba/Ilfochrome. If it would end up as a printing material (and there's no sign of that in any way), it would end up being something much more similar to RA4 in being a chromogenic rather than a dye destruction process.
Ah yes, I see. I think we're supposed to interpret the rise-from-the-ashes as a reference to the first color negative film Ilford introduced in 1960. Or perhaps to the return to anything related to color in the analog domain at all.I think my expectation came from the fact that they called it Phoenix which implied that it would 'rise from the ashes'. Where as the actual Phoenix that we got, is something altogether new.
Yes it was. The father of an old friend of mine was so senior at the General Motors asssembly plant's paint department that his job was to put the firebird decal on the cars.the firebird is cool
Yes it was. The father of an old friend of mine was so senior at the General Motors asssembly plant's paint department that his job was to put the firebird decal on the cars.
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All that Cibachrome/Ilfochome capacity is long gone and not coming back. They dabbled in RA4 at one time too. Now any kind of color material coming out of that is just inkjet paper. A whole industry would have to be completely resurrected, including a market too. At today's cost levels and more stringent enviro regulations, it's not going to happen. Even the special base material would have to be resurrected.
All the processing drums left in the world wouldn't even be a drop in the bucket compared to daily Ciba consumption in its heyday. It was processed in up to 50 inch wide rolls by multiple commercial labs in this area alone. Those big roller transport machines had to be specially built to survive the sulfuric acid bleach;
workers lungs didn't do so well either. I did it in drums outdoor instead, and used up to 40 inch wide rolls; but most of my work was smaller.
In terms of look, as well as at least analogous PET full gloss base, Fujiflex Supergloss is its successor - even better, but RA4, so printed from either color negatives or scanned inverted chromes. Hopefully, it will be around awhile more, but hard to say; it's coated in Japan.
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