Of course in an island as small as the U.K. a leak big enough to affect film might be the least of our worries.
As for my sources, they are impeccable, I assure you!After all, even if I was quoting myself!
PE
Sandholm and I were both correct about the mistakes made at TMI, PE. To mention him alone here implies that I was not correct.
But it is not correct that "pure luck" saved it from being even more disastrous. That is crazy; you two are defending a ridiculous overstatement, and categorizing the operators as a group of 100% screwups, who had nothing to do with preventing this from becoming a worse accident. The truth of the matter is that a bunch of people scrambling to figure out what the hell to do finally arrived at the right answer. That is not luck. Luck would have been choosing response steps "purely" (to use Sandholm's term) at random from a wide possibility of options, and having the chosen step turn out by chance to be the correct step. There wasn't any chance involved in a group of operators finally figuring out what was going on and how to stop it. This was not "pure luck." Do you really believe that some divine thing such as CHANCE saved that reactor from totally melting down and probably busting open?
Are you here to post information that stirs people up and gets the last laugh? That is a funny way around responding to contrary points, especially from someone who uses the fact that he used to be a scientist in order to defend his arguments so often. Ignore my points if you don't want to respond to them. You have no duty to answer anyone. But at least accept that they are reasonable points, and don't make fun simply because I am not 100% on the same page as you.
However well-intentioned your post was and I do think that it was, PE, don't get me wrong! all you had to do was wait for real information with a real, nameable source. If your sources are impeccable, then name them. And tell us what they said. "Hi, folks. Fujifilm Japan reporting here. Radiation is going to affect our film production. We are receiving this much, which is enough to affect our film negatively," would be what they would have need to have said to make this a responsible and timely post on your part. As of now, it is an alarmist and fear-stirring post without cause.
No mSv values has been release except the values are 1600 times higher then normal, and Japan has earlier reported that the normal value for them are 10.27 mSv/24h, so the 1600x increase should give them a value around 16500 mSs/24h. Chernobyl was around 10,000300,000 mSv/hr, so its far from Chernobyl. If you worked at a nuclear plant you know that most of them say that you should not be exposed to more then 20 mSv for a whole year, and current/earlier (dont know now) its around 640 mSv/hr at "ground zero", and I would not call this "nothing", that IS really bad, just for reference (and this is a single dose, not over 1hr)
100 mSv - great risk for birth defects
3-4 Sv - 50% chans to die
10 Sv - 100% chans to die, aka DEAD
Here is a live geiger counter in Tokyo http://www.ustream.tv/channel/7517126
(a geiger measurement alone can not be translated to mSv, because to do that you have to know the type of radiation and how deadly it is)
cheers
Yes, it is to be expected. But what are the levels? Not enough to do anything to anyone. Even in the communities surrounding "ground zero," this is not the case.
If I knew, I would say.
This intense posturing on Internet is getting quite annoying.... Seems no one can talk about product shortage or buying "just in case" without prefacing statements with their deepest concern to people of Japan or else they get attacked for being insensitive, self-servicing, and just plain evil.
The truth is, people of Japan are suffering immensely. The truth is, people in rest of the world still has to live their lives and enjoy themselves. The truth is, products shortage will likely be a reality at least for a short term for some products. Rest of the world enjoying their lives doesn't impact people in Japan. While I wish people don't buy now only to sell later at inflated prices, products are there to be purchased.
Look... I was born there and lived there until late teen years. I appreciate very much when people ask me if my family or friends are impacted. (no one I know are impacted) But there is no need for this hyper sensitivity and posturing. This endless argument isn't helping anyone and you are only creating animosity. Please stop if you are concerned about people there and care about the actual problem. If would like to act, please consider making even small donations. If your situation does not permit it, please keep them in your thoughts.
That's all I have to say. Good night.
PE, Do your sources know whether there was any adverse affect to film coating operations from the Ginna NPP incident in 1982? From what I know, there was a small radioactive gas leak from a burst steam pipe. Since it is only about 20 miles from Kodak Park, I assume there was some contamination, but I would have no idea how much.
PE ,
How Chernobyl effected the European and British film production ?
Umut
There were none due to 2 factors. Wind blew much of the radioactivity south and east and KP was west of Ginna. Also, Kodak had a very complete protection plan in operation at that time.
PE
...Film is hyper sensitive to all radiation. If there is any present, they will have to introduce draconian methods at the Fuji plant in Ashigara to eliminate the problem...I have been told that Fuji film and paper users should stock up on film as a "just in case" provision to tide them through to the summer months...
...There is more radiation from taking a cross-country plane trip than from Japan right now!...
...Remember that I said nuclear tests in the Pacific had an effect on film made in Rochester!...
...it showed up as tiny black specks and then it only showed up after a few months. It took time for cumulative exposure to affect the films. The 120 films were heavily affected to my knowledge because the paper was "infected"...
Tonights news reports that sensors in Seattle and Vancouver have detected an increase in radiation. Also, some detectors in northern US have detected radiation as well...
...The levels from the nuclear tests in the Pacific were too low to affect anyone here, but they affected Kodak films and changed the way the buildings making emulsions and coatings were built and protected...
OK Ron, the main question for me is as follows. Given a freezer stocked full of Kodak sheet film made at least six months ago, being on the west coast of the US, how would you guess this incident might affect long term keeping? Any measurable artifacts over time compared to expected fog from normal cosmic radiation? Did the nuclear tests' fallout have more impact on Kodak production during coating and the time immediately after than it did on fully "mature" film? Thanks in advance....People will not notice it any more than they notice an X-Ray, but the film might look like someone peppered it with black dots...
I understood and was expecting cosmic radiation-induced cumulative fog on higher speed films in long-term storage. I inferred from your previous answer that any added "insult" would be at a lower order of magnitude, especially if one prevents dust from accumulating on top of the refrigerator....So, 400 speed film will "age" faster in the freezer than 100 speed film, and the dust is just insult to injury over the long haul...
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