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PKM-25

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Well I just ordered 200 sheets of IR820 in 4x5, that is all I can do this time around, been a super expensive year for stocking up on film!
 

Tony-S

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Well I just ordered 200 sheets of IR820 in 4x5, that is all I can do this time around, been a super expensive year for stocking up on film!

Isn't IR film more susceptible to fog, even when stored frozen?
 

Pioneer

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Well I just ordered 200 sheets of IR820 in 4x5, that is all I can do this time around, been a super expensive year for stocking up on film!

+1 - My latest order of Efke 25 just arrived and I will be unable to buy anymore film until after Xmas!
 

PKM-25

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Isn't IR film more susceptible to fog, even when stored frozen?

I have heard that, but so far, have not experienced it and I live at 8,000 feet. All my 400 speed and infrared is frozen in a dedicated unit with no food, I keep a large film xray bag over the top of it all, not sure if it does diddly or not.

For example, about two hours ago I developed a roll of David Romano re-spool of 70mm HIE / Aerographic 2424 that I shot in my Hasselblad on and off from early Fall last year finishing with the Winter X-Games. When I was not shooting the roll, I double ziplock bagged the film back and stuck it in the freezer until I used it again, even the shot rolls live in the freezer until I am ready to soup....

The film I just developed that was spooled in 2003 and probably was coated at least ten years ago is absolutely perfect with no real sign of base fog, just the same as my 11/2009 35mm HIE, about the same as HP5 overall.
 

DREW WILEY

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I finally got into my freezer last nite and I was wrong about the Rollei Pan 25 label. It simply said "Made in Europe". Apparently a generic package. Guess if I want real Efke 25 I should order it in the real Efke green box! Otherwise, don't know what I'll get. On more damn film I gotta stockpile.
 

alex.g

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so all after all Efke is almost dead? selling film in bulk is not an option, too?
 

georg16nik

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I doubt one could answer that in a worldwide way, some dealers might be running low stock by now, its been a month already..
so all after all Efke is almost dead? selling film in bulk is not an option, too?
 

ADOX Fotoimpex

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And what are the odds that ADOX/Fotoimpex will be able to continue providing EFKE film, even if in bulk rolls only?
Well if you read the thread you will see that we can´t sell anything that is not made anymore.
Confectioning is not the issue. Making money in making film in general is.
On the other hand I have seen some numbers on page 28 which are on the other end of the scale.
We do not intend to sell a roll of film at 20$. Between the current price of 3,50 EUR and 20$ there is a lot of room.
The consumers are very strong in the photographic market. They push prices via the dealers to the manufacturers to the limit.
In order to sustain a business everyone has to make some money. Efke would have needed by far less than 20$ per roll to go on.

Mirko
 
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ADOX Fotoimpex

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It is very simple: efke canceled all outstanding orders. The stock we have left is insufficient for dealer size orders now. Freight costs will be too high.
But we look ahead into the future and at Photokina we will already present a new pricelist for new products to come which then will be available through our dealers as usual.
This all happened very fast.

Mirko
 
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Roger Cole

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That was probably me, because I said I'd pay $20 for a roll of IR. And I would - occasionally. Maybe 2-3 rolls a year. I wouldn't even think of paying that much for a conventional film when I'm happy with Tri-X and the offerings from Ilford, and occasionally Foma. But if, IF, I really liked a film and thought it offered something those films didn't, then I'd pay more for it. Not $20 (Infrared is a special case - there's very little alternative) and it's hard to say how much. For one thing, 35mm costs more than 120 already and I tend to think in terms of 120 since I don't shoot much 35mm in black and white. But when I do, I often shoot TMZ for which I already pay $10 a roll. If another film did something I thought was unique I feel safe in saying I'd pay the $10 for it, because I already do. In 120 probably the most expensive films I buy are still a bit under $6. I'd pay $10 for one that was different and special.

Not having used the Efke films I certainly can't say I would. But some people here love them, and if they were that good, I would. That's all I'm saying - if you make something unique in the market, or substantially better, people will pay more for it. If it's just another pretty good film then it must compete in price with similar good films.
 

piu58

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> Tell me why I can't buy this product?

This is an Efke film, as all CHS films are.
 

Felinik

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In order to sustain a business everyone has to make some money. Efke would have needed by far less than 20$ per roll to go on.

Mirko

Cut out the middle man and sell direct online. Negotiate a volume deal with DHL or UPS and make sure the shipping conditions and prices for the customers are reflected in the prices of the products.

I can't buy EFKE locally anyway, no stores in my area carries it, so I used to get it online from Germany.
 

georg16nik

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Kodak films are optimized to use less raw materials, get them cheaper compared to EFKE or any of the smaller manufacturers.
A customer expect EFKE to be price competitive to Kodak - in a sense work more for less profit.
EFKE exit photo biz and start using their machines/whatever for products that wont hold them on their knees.

...If it's just another pretty good film then it must compete in price with similar good films.
 

ADOX Fotoimpex

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This won´t work because the "middle men" finance the product availability and optimize freight and customs. Efke produced on demand every 6 weeks and we kept stock for 6 months in order to be somehow able to supply in a way that a customer can expect us to. It is extremely expensive to sell small quantities of product to individuals and give technical support etc. You need the capital (interest), infrastructure and people for that and this costs you money. In the end you get to keep at maximum the amount that the "middle men" earned as a profit. By no means you will be able to keep all the markup he added. An now guess what?
The middel men arent´t doing to well in this price driven market either.....

So this will bring you nowhere. The market needs to stabilise it´s markup chain. Today Fuji Europe announced a 20% price increase on all silver halide products. This is good news for the industry and for the consumers even though consumers might disagree in a first reflex.

Mirko
 

ADOX Fotoimpex

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Felinik

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I don't know about all that, after all logistics is logistics, no matter what product you sell. Now of course I have no idea what margin chains there are on film, but assuming there's at least two instances inbetween the manufacturer and the client, it should be a quite good deal in the end if done right.

And I'm quite sure many of the middle men wouldn't mind emptying some of the shelf space and get more space for other products that move faster with higher figures shifting.


(I'm working in production/marketing/sales of similar kinds of products...)
 

David A. Goldfarb

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Threads merged, moved to "Industry news."
 

David A. Goldfarb

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Was Lodima being coated in the Efke plant in the end? That discussion was a few years ago, and I forgot how it was resolved, and a search doesn't turn up much about where the paper is manufactured.
 

dr5chrome

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This is true for any custom shop - including us. It is the reason labs, stores & factories close. The buying market will not pay more or doesn't have the money, and does not understand the true costs of providing these services and product today. It's amazing the complete ignorance most have to this dilemma. I am actually shocked when I speak to someone who gets the current market situation.



 
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The buying market will not pay more or doesn't have the money...

The number who can but won't is dwarfed these days by the number who would but can't...

Ken
 
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