Fixer formula

[RPippin]

Looking for a good formula for fixer. Currently using TF-4 and love the stuff. However shipping of the liquid is a bit expensive, and the kit from Formulary is a bit high as well. Would like to mix my own fixer, so if anyone has experience with this let me know. Thanks

 

[nworth]

Here are a couple of very easy formulae for non-hardening fixers:

Kodak F-34 Fixer
Used in Process ECN-2 for color motion picture films
Water (21 – 38C) 700 ml
Ammonium thiosulfate (58%) 185 ml
Sodium sulfite (anh) 10 g
Sodium metabisulfite (anh) 8.4 g
WTM 1 l
pH=6.5 at 27C; sp.gr. 1.08.
Fix color negative motion picture film 2 minutes at 100F.
This formula works just fine for black and white films and prints too.

A "teaspoon" variation on F-34 is very easy and also works well:

Ammonium thiosulfate (60% solution) 185 ml
Water to make 1 l
Sodium sulfite (anh) 1 tsp
Sodium metabisulfite 1 tsp

TF-4 Non-hardening Alkaline Fixer
Water 1 l
Sodium thiosulfate 250 g
Sodium sulfite (anh) 15 g
Sodium metaborate 10 g

Ref: Photo Techniques, Jul/Aug 2003, pg. 14

 

[Photo Engineer]

The so called TF-4 fixer is no where near the real TF-4. For starters, TF-4 uses Ammonium Thiosulfate.

PE

 

[bwrules]

PE - how different is your Superfix compared to TF-4?

 

[Photo Engineer]

Vastly different! There is a formula for Version #1 that is posted here on APUG for you to read. Version VIII, which is what I am on now, is much more "friendly".

PE

 

[bwrules]

But does it wash out just as fast, or that's unknown?

 

[Photo Engineer]

Super Fix I fixes more rapidly than any other fixer, but wash times are just slightly reduced over other formulas, say about 20%. Super Fix VII fixes at about the same rate or just a tad faster than Super Fix I but washes out twice as fast thereby reducing water consumption by 50%.

These are rough approximation comparing apples to oranges, so the real fixers are quite different and behave differently. Synergy between fixing agents is used to gain fixing speed in Super Fix I, but a swelling agent is used in Super Fix VII in addition to another type of synergy to speed fix rates and wash rates. With Super Fix VII, we are approaching the limits of both fixation and washing due to the limit imposed by the diffusion rates of the chemicals into and out of film and paper emulsions.

PE

 

[bwrules]

So VII formula won't be published, it's a commercial fixer?

 

[Photo Engineer]

It is undergoing testing. Some people have gotten pre-production samples. I have no idea if it will be produced. It will be a premium price product I think, due to the chemistry involved.

PE

 

[nworth]

The so called TF-4 fixer is no where near the real TF-4. For starters, TF-4 uses Ammonium Thiosulfate.

PE

That's what I thought, too. This was the formula I got from the referenced Photo Techniques article. This is a frequent problem with formulas obtained from secondary sources.

 

[BetterSense]

Is it possible to just use plain Sodium Thiosulfate for fixer? If so what proportions? If not, what do you have to add to it?

Ever since I ran out of rapid fixer a while back I've been thinking it might be good to have a big tub of hypo around; maybe it would be cheaper anyway.

 

[Domingo A. Siliceo]

Here are a couple of very easy formulae for non-hardening fixers:

Kodak F-34 Fixer
Used in Process ECN-2 for color motion picture films
Water (21 – 38C) 700 ml
Ammonium thiosulfate (58%) 185 ml
Sodium sulfite (anh) 10 g
Sodium metabisulfite (anh) 8.4 g
WTM 1 l
pH=6.5 at 27C; sp.gr. 1.08.
Fix color negative motion picture film 2 minutes at 100F.
This formula works just fine for black and white films and prints too.
[...]

my ammonium thiosulfate is 98/100% (anhydrous), so should I dilute it first to obtain a 58% mix?

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Looking for a good formula for fixer. Currently using TF-4 and love the stuff. However shipping of the liquid is a bit expensive, and the kit from Formulary is a bit high as well. Would like to mix my own fixer, so if anyone has experience with this let me know. Thanks

I'll throw in a couple for self-mixing, one acid, one alkaline but both rapid and non-hardening. II don't know how they compare to TF-4, but I've tested and used both with success.

 

[nworth]

Is it possible to just use plain Sodium Thiosulfate for fixer? If so what proportions? If not, what do you have to add to it?

Ever since I ran out of rapid fixer a while back I've been thinking it might be good to have a big tub of hypo around; maybe it would be cheaper anyway.

Yes. It works great, but it doesn't last very long. Fine for one-shots, however, and for short printing sessions, maybe 15 8X10s and no more than about 36 hours in the tray. Try about 200 g of sodium thiosulfate pentahydrate per liter of water. A teaspoon or two of sodium sulfite will make it last a bit longer. By the way, the same applies to ammonium thioslfate rapid fixers; about 200 ml per liter of the 60% solution works fine for a one shot.

 

[BetterSense]

I guess that's really not much cheaper than rapid fixer then. Sodium thiosulfate is about $2 per pound, so that's about a dollar per liter of fixer. Ilford rapid fixer at 1+4 costs about $2 per liter. That's only a factor of 2 so I don't think you'd save any money at all if you used plain sodium thiosulfate one-shot.