First MF Camera: Folder or TLR

[RichardJack]

Depends on what your shooting. TLR's are 6x6 and folders can go to 6x9. Another option is a rangefinder. Bronica's 645 rangerfinder is compact and sweet.
But buy the best you can afford.

 

[michr]

I've been pretty happy with a Mamiya C33 and the add-on prism finder (not the porroflex). It's pretty bright, corrects the right-to-left viewfinder problem common on TLRs, and allows the camera to be held up to the eyes. Unfortunately, size and weight are an issue with that configuration --even the prism finder adds quite a bit of weight.

So if that's not an option, here's a configuration I'm always pushing. Some 6x4.5 folder, get an accessory rangefinder that fits in the cold shoe. Together these are small, light, and cheap. If you plan on shooting lots of portraits anyway, 6x4.5 folders are almost all portrait format. The viewfinders on cameras without integrated rangefinders are often quite a bit bigger than those with.

 

[Cholentpot]

I lean towards the TLR. It's light and I love focusing on the big huge viewfinder. I have a Richoflex VIIIIIIIIII or something and a Lubitel 2. However I don't find the TLR very good for portraits. I use a Mamiya 645 for that. I just started using a Bronica s2 and I'm curious to see how things look off that machine.

 

[Prest_400]

I just started using a Bronica s2 and I'm curious to see how things look off that machine.

That's interesting. I passed on bidding for one with the standard and wide lens. With a bit of a look, SLRs go for the same prices of TLRs circa 200€ at the expense of being hogs.

Budget unlimited I'd lean towards the GF670 or Mamiya 7
An option not mentioned are the Fuji 645's. There was a Folder (GS645) but it was riddled with issues. There's the fixed lens with cowbar GS645s, which seems to be well balanced; and the AF P&S GA645 series that you can count as folding given the collapsing lens. The latter are supposed to be excellent although a P&S approach might not be the best for the first medium format. 645 seems a nice economic format.

BTW, as of TLRs, most seem to sit between 800-1200g. Knob wind cameras like the Rolleicords are the lightest, and Rolleiflexes 2.8 are on the heavy end of the scale. Mamiyas are a whole different class.

 

[Cholentpot]

That's interesting. I passed on bidding for one with the standard and wide lens. With a bit of a look, SLRs go for the same prices of TLRs circa 200€ at the expense of being hogs.

Budget unlimited I'd lean towards the GF670 or Mamiya 7
An option not mentioned are the Fuji 645's. There was a Folder (GS645) but it was riddled with issues. There's the fixed lens with cowbar GS645s, which seems to be well balanced; and the AF P&S GA645 series that you can count as folding given the collapsing lens. The latter are supposed to be excellent although a P&S approach might not be the best for the first medium format. 645 seems a nice economic format.

BTW, as of TLRs, most seem to sit between 800-1200g. Knob wind cameras like the Rolleicords are the lightest, and Rolleiflexes 2.8 are on the heavy end of the scale. Mamiyas are a whole different class.

I like the SLR's for the close focus ability and the systemness of it. Otherwise they're heavy pigs that should live on a tripod. I've not run a full roll of 120 through mine yet but I have tested it with 135. I just put in some Shanghai GP3 and should finish the roll at some point. I have no clue where the shutter speeds are at and if the fungus in the lens is going to make trouble. Nothing I can do but shoot the roll.

 

[hacked - darinwc]

For a first mf camera I would suggest a tlr.
Either a rolleicord or a yashica 124 non g.

I've heard good things about the minolta as well, but I don't have one.

An isolette iii from jurgen is nice, but still has some inherent problems. Non coupled rangefinder will not always get the focus right. Front cell focusing will be soft closer than 10 feet and wider than f8.

 

[jgoody]

For a first mf camera I would suggest a tlr.
I've heard good things about the minolta as well, but I don't have one.

I have one - it's an excellent camera. I would advise a set of Rolleinars if you like to get close and get a TLR - it's a close up lens for both the viewing and taking lens with a prism in the viewing part to correct for parallax. The Minolta Autocord takes Bay 1 size (filters, Rolleinars, etc) as does the Yashica. There are also Bay 2 and 3 for various of the later Rolleis.

 

[Ron789]

So you want a 6x6 camera for candid shots and portraiture, size and weight is somewhat relevant but not extremely important since you'll also use 35mm camera's. You wear glasses and your main concern is a good overview of the entire viewfinder image to make a good composition. Your situation and demands are exactly the same as mine, though I also do street photography on 6x6.
My choice: a Mamiya C... something with a couple of lenses to accommodate different situations, like a 65mm for candid shots, an 80 or 105 standard lens, a 135 and/or 180 portrait lens. Making a composition in the large and bright WLF is easy. For focusing I use the loupe in the WLF or I take off my glasses and look straight at the focusing screen without loupe (at my age and with my eye defects, my eyesight without glasses gets better and better and close distances). Make sure you get a focusing screen with microprism or split image. I also have folders but the viewfinders are a nightmare with glasses. And for short distance focusing with MF, you really need accuracy.

 

[Ron789]

Oh... and don't forget to get you a paramender when you want to do portraits, especially with the longer lenses.

 

[paul ron]

as a backpacker, I say get both.

folder in the mountains, TLR is my walk around.

yashicamat is fun, cheap, and very light. the wlf magnifier works great if you take off your glasses... near sighted that is.

 

[phrons]

I started with a TLR.

Then I went with a folder.

The size, the convenience, and (at least for me since I come from regularly shooting a S2) the rangefinder focussing is much better.

FWIW, assuming you keep the lens collapsed when walking around both will take the same amount of time to set up a shot. If you walk around with the lens out with the folder you can red dot zone focus in an instant and never have to worry about focus.

 

[mgb74]

The folder that I've been looking at has been cla'd (certo6). The seller told me that, with glasses, he wasn't able to see the entire "frame". I can just do that with my retina.

Not all Retina models are created equal in this regard. The I and II is difficult with glasses; the III (c and C) is great.

Other's have mentioned weight as a factor. Most of my 120 folders are very light. But the Retina III (again, c and C) is heavier than you'd imagine for it's size. Still a great, compact camera though.

 

[punkzter]

Well, I cheated and got one of each. I purchased a Minolta Autocord off of ebay and the Agfa Isolette from here. They are both very nice. Of course, I've hardly used them yet. I will say that there was little cause for concern over the Isolette's viewfinder. I might not be able to make out the edges, but it's easy to use.

Also, I discovered that the Autocord makes me nauseous. So that might end up getting resold. I want to like it, as the viewfinder is gorgeous to look through, and has this three-dimensional look that is very cool. But...nausea. So I'll see.

 

[Marcelo Paniagua]

Well, I cheated and got one of each. I purchased a Minolta Autocord off of ebay and the Agfa Isolette from here. They are both very nice. Of course, I've hardly used them yet. I will say that there was little cause for concern over the Isolette's viewfinder. I might not be able to make out the edges, but it's easy to use.

Also, I discovered that the Autocord makes me nauseous. So that might end up getting resold. I want to like it, as the viewfinder is gorgeous to look through, and has this three-dimensional look that is very cool. But...nausea. So I'll see.

Why nausea? Because inverted image?

Agfa camera as nice. Pretty light and decent shooters. Got an Isolette and a Solinette myself. Isolette is waiting to get it focus ring unstuck. Solinette (35mm) is a great shooter. Apotar lens are pretty sharp.

I think you are going to have fun with it. Pretty light and, because zone focusing, you usually shoot pretty fast and get just the image you want.

Best regards

Marcelo

 

[baachitraka]

TLR: Rolleicord either V, Va or Vb
Folder: Zeiss Ikon Ikonta (Novar/Tessar)

 

[punkzter]

Yeah, the inverted image (I think). I get car sick pretty easily. It might also be because I'm looking down at an image. I'm not entirely sure. But it's happening.

What I'll do for now is move the camera around more slowly. That should help, and as I get used to the inverted image, I also won't have to move it as often or as much.

 

[zozur]

Then maybe MF SLR with prism will be your cup of tea...

 

[Marcelo Paniagua]

Yeah, it was weird for me as well when I first used a TLR (a Lubitel 30 years ago ) Fortunately it was one of my first cameras so wore off quickly.

Try using a tripod so image get fixed.

Regards

Marcelo

 

[Marcelo Paniagua]

Then maybe MF SLR with prism will be your cup of tea...

If you considered that route, Mamiya 645 1000s cameras are great and not that expensive.

Regards

Marcelo

 

[Sewin]

You'll soon get used to the mirrored image in a TLR.

For what it's worth I've had a Yashicamat D, great camera, but didn't use it much,a Nettar, very nice and portable.

But now I'm playing around with a Kodak 66,a bit underated and not mentioned much and cheap to buy in the UK.