filtration

[CMoore]

I know this gets discussed A Lot...I just spent 45 minutes reading the "Search" results, and that was some help...but I still have some questions.
1. I am still not sure what is the most important Reason/Consideration for filtering the water. What contaminants (in city water) do I need to worry about most.? That is... what kind of filter is needed.?
Our water is very "hard". Where the lawn sprinklers (not that we water lawns anymore) hit the fence, it bleaches the wood and eats it up. Glass and faucets in the shower get corroded in a hurry.
2. What is the biggest concern...or is it all the same.? That is to say...is film developing more likely to need "clean" water than print developing and washing.?
Right now I have been using (for the small amount I have done) distilled water for all but film rinsing. I have not printed at home yet.....darkroom coming this soon/this year. So I am wondering what type filter to install.
Thank You
Building a darkroom in a bedroom that shares a wall with a bathroom. Thinking about a filter At/Under the darkroom sink for just the cold water.

 

[gone]

All I can say is that when I started filtering my water/chemicals through a coffee filter in a funnel when I developed film, the amount of crap on my negatives went way down. It's not the water, it's the pipes. They may be very, very old, and sediment is gonna come out. It doesn't take much to stick to a wet negative, which is always fun when it gets blown up real big on an enlarger and by the usual law of the universe ends up in the most important part of your print.

Beyond a coffee filter, I don't think you need anything else for developing. Printing is much less critical for this. You're going to be washing the prints under moving water for a long time, while film is going to be hung to dry with a wet and hardening emulsion. There's no magnification factor w/ the print either.

 

[Doremus Scudder]

There are two things to consider here.

The first is particulates in the water. A good in-line filter will do the job well. There are some cheap ones you can just attach to a hose attached to a faucet or more elaborate models that can be plumbed in.

The other thing is dissolved minerals that cannot be filtered out. Sometimes an activated carbon filter will help here. A water-softener for hard water is common as well, but introduces salts into the water that will leave marks on film and paper, so a distilled water final rinse is usually needed. If the water has lots of dissolved minerals that cannot be removed, you may have to use distilled water for some or all of your chemistry and certainly for a final rinse. If you really want totally clean water in the darkroom and have lots of dissolved minerals in your incoming water, then a reverse-osmosis unit might be worth looking into.

It all depends on what is in your water. Your local water utility will have test results, so contact them to find out. If you're on a well, you will have to take samples to a testing facility.

That said, if your water is just "hard," i.e., has lots of dissolved calcium carbonate, then you can likely use it for washing and for mixing working-strength chemicals (used distilled for concentrated stock solutions). The developer will be the most critical here. If your water is very hard it can slightly increase the activity of the developer. As long as you are consistent, however, a 5-10% increase shouldn't make a significant difference.

Best,

Doremus

 

[CMoore]

Yeah...I am on city water.
Will give them a shout...great idea.
Thanks

 

[Ronald Moravec]

Packaged developers have water conditioning chemicals built in to deal with hard water. I have a 3 micron built in to deal with particles or debris from pipes or whatever. Coffee filters are of little value. First Aid Cotton wool in the bottom of a funnel is the only effective home filtration I have found short of lab grade filter paper.

The next biggest source is silver that precipitates from used fix. It looks like grey lumps in the bottom of your glass fix bottle. Sticks like glue to next film. Wash all day and it is still there. I suppose a centrifuge will separate which is overkill for home lab. I never reuse film fix. Use it up on test prints. In my home this is far worse than gunk in the water.

Next is a HEPA air filter and clean the room, shelves, floor , ceiling, counters, everything,

All the issues will then be gone. I have not spotted prints for years. Back when, I had some that looked like snow.

 

[Saganich]

[QUOTE="

The next biggest source is silver that precipitates from used fix. It looks like grey lumps in the bottom of your glass fix bottle. Sticks like glue to next film. Wash all day and it is still there. I suppose a centrifuge will separate which is overkill for home lab. I never reuse film fix. Use it up on test prints. In my home this is far worse than gunk in the water.

Next is a HEPA air filter and clean the room, shelves, floor , ceiling, counters, everything,

All the issues will then be gone. I have not spotted prints for years. Back when, I had some that looked like snow.[/QUOTE]


I have not noticed this. I suppose I carefully pour fix without disturbing the sediment. hmmmm. Same for my well seasoned D23. Good to know.

 

[mklw1954]

Using distilled water ($0.88/gallon at Walmart) to make up chemicals is inexpensive and eliminates water quality as a variable.

Filtering each chemical with a coffee filter prior to reuse is very beneficial as silver removed from film/paper surfaces, during development and fixing, is filtered out - no more tiny white spots showing up on prints.

I have slightly hard water and using it between film fixing and hypoclear, and for washing RC prints, presents no problem.

 

[Gerald C Koch]

The temporary hardness can be removed by boiling the water for 5 minutes and allowing it to stand overnight. The calcium will precipitate out. You can decant the clear portion for use in making developers. In my experience coffee filters are too coarse to be really effective. They are not designed to hold back anything smaller than coffee grounds. For fine particulates you need something like the filter paper used in labs.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

ll you need.

 

[Doremus Scudder]

I had a Kenmore water softener on my well for 18 years. That salt in the water story is bunk. Maybe the day after it cycled ther was some, but I doubt much even then. Be sure to get a Kenmore.

Back when I lived in San Antonio (really hard water), my water softener left enough salt in solution that it would form crystals on drying negatives. A distilled water rinse with PhotoFlo was really necessary. Maybe your Kenmore unit does a better job.

Best,

Doremus

 

[CMoore]

For Better Or Worse.....I bought one of these:

http://www.hassmfg.com/search.pl/1464225645-77505?keyword=11000&submit=Search

 

[Doremus Scudder]

For Better Or Worse.....I bought one of these:

http://www.hassmfg.com/search.pl/1464225645-77505?keyword=11000&submit=Search

You can't go wrong with those. Be aware they only filter out particulates, not dissolved minerals. Hard water is not a big problem with most chemistry, as discussed already, but if you get deposits on your negatives when drying, you should use a distilled water final rinse. I use distilled water with PhotoFlo for my final rinse and extend the time in the bath to two-three minutes to ensure that enough of the minerals are leached into solution to prevent drying marks.

Best,

Doremus

 

[CMoore]

Yeah...Thanks.
It has been mentioned above, somewhere.
And Yes...I will continue to Invest In/Stock a few gallons of distilled for the reasons you say.

I wish I could find the video, it was fascinating.
USA Press/Army photographers from the Vietnam War meet their North Vietnamese counterparts. Those guys were developing film in creeks and under tarps during monsoon. I should be able to make-do somehow.