Film / dev recommendation

[lauge]

I just started developing my own film again after a couple of decades and after some rolls of film feel I got the hang of it. And now to the noobie question; what is the best combination of film / developer out of the following list (available at the local store)

Developer:
Ilford: DD-X, ID-11, MICROPHEN, ILFOSOL 3 Tetenal: Ultrafin Agfa: Rodinal

135 film:
Kodak: plus-x, tri-x, tmx, tmy Ilford: pan f+, fp4+, hp5+, delta 100, delta 400 Fuji: neopan 100 acros, neopan 400

To try all combo is too expensive, I have search here and other sites to get an idea but lots ambiguous information has confused me even more. What I'm looking for is good micro contrast or acutance, high dynamic range (if that has anything to do with film/dev combo) and pleasant grain. So would like to hear what you think is a good fast (400) and slow (>125) combos?

 

[wclark5179]

I would recommend: ID-11 or D-76 film developer. I mainly use it at 1+1 or another way to look at 1plus1 is 1 part stock to 1 part water.

I would pick one film from here:
Plus X
FP4

Or one from here:
Tri X
hp5

Or one from here:
TMX
D100
Acros 100

Or one from here:
TMY
d400
neopan 400

So pick one from each group. Then narrow it down to two films. Let them become your friend. Get to know them real well with the ID-11/D-76 developer. Once you have them down then maybe move around and try another one or two.

Also stay involved here as some folks use film that may not be one of the first two you pick but interest you.

Hope this helps you!

 

[tkamiya]

I came back to "doing film" after 25+ years like yourself. First, I stressed about the same thing and picked Tmax100, 400 + XTOL combination to start. I struggled for about a year to get close to what I was looking for. Doing it as Kodak specifies got me too high contrast and very hard-to-print negatives.

Now, I've settled to a timing that works for me. (-15% development time)

Surprising thing is, TriX400 + D76 gave me the result I was looking for - without even trying - the first time! I came to conclusion that since _my_standard_ was set in 25 years ago, I was looking for something I was used to seeing. Hence, classic film + developer combination was pleasing to my eyes. It took me a year to recognize this.

Classic film like Tri-X and T-grain film like Tmax will give you definitely different look that greatly affect the end result. Today, I stock TriX, PlusX, Tmax100, and 400. For developer, I have both D76 and XTOL. I have both developers only because they are inexpensive and I have my notes on each with each film already.

So... my answer to you is, it all depends. There is no such thing as "best film" or "best developers" the same way as there is no such thing as "best car" or "best fruit". What pleases your eyes and give you the result you are looking for is the best combination.

You will hear lots of "pick one film and one developer and live with it for a year" comment. I fully agree, out of my own experience, you can get to a point you'll see a desired result in about a year. I also fully agree, even with Tmax100 and 400 (two films), it became frustrating to keep my record straight. I also think, trying 10 different film and 10 different developers will get you no where.

But... knowing what I know today, I would probably try two different kinds. Classic film and new film and ONE developer. Do about 10 of each and revisit the decision. While 10 won't get you to know everything about the film, you will probably get an idea to narrow down your choice much better.

Good luck to you. Don't forget to have fun though. Welcome to APUG! where we obsess film and developers! EVERYDAY!!

 

[nickrapak]

I would agree that D-76/ID-11 is your friend. Me personally, I like the Plus-X/Tri-X combination for fast and slow films. It has the classic black and white grain structure, and is easy to develop.

 

[mcgrattan]

Personally I don't really like using powder developers and, in the UK at least, it tends to be easier for me to find Ilford (or Paterson) developers in local shops. So, I tend to use Ilford DD-X for fast films, and recently I've been using Ilfosol 3 with slower films [although I've been happy with other developers in the past].

My film preferences are Pan-F, Fuji Acros, Neopan 400 or HP5 [I like both] and Delta 3200 as we go up the speed range.

I think the advice to pick one or two films and one developer is a good one. If it was me I'd probably choose Pan-F and HP5 as one slow and one medium-fast film, and stick with Ilfosol-3. However, I'm based in the UK and have never really had much success with Kodak products, so the advice above to go with D-76 and Tri-X/Plus-X is also, I'm sure, very good too.

 

[mawz]

Just to be different, I'd suggest using Rodinal as your first developer. It's easier to control initial solution temperature since that's controlled entirely by the water temperature due to the small amount of Rodinal concentrate used, it's cheap and it plays well with most films. Oh, and being from concentrate, no need to mix up a stock solution.

Then pick either HP5+ or Tri-x and you're set.

 

[tim k]

After this thread is up to say about 30 posts, if two people agree....there's your combo, your all set.

 

[lauge]

Thanks for your replies. The reason for asking this kind of question is that I wanted to avoid buying too many different films an developers. The shop sold me ID-11 so have done that with two HP5+, an FP4+ and a Tri-X with 1+3 but wanted to stay with just two (fast and slow) films and one developer for each to learn developing techniques well. It's seems like ID-11 with HP5+/Tri-X and FP4+ was a good idea, if I want max acutance or sharpness with these combos which dilution, speed and times would be recommended? If I went with rodinal what kind of difference will I see compared to ID-11 both good and bad?

 

[Worker 11811]

The first thing you should do is concentrate on teaching yourself to work with film again after a 20+year hiatus. Therefore, it is best to just pick a film and a developer and work with it until you are back in the swing of things again.

You should certainly put some thought into your choice of materials. Any smart person would. But, in the end, don't labor the point too much. Just pick a good film and a good developer. Don't worry about the details too much... Yet...

T-Max and D-76 is a good combination. They are easy to get where I live. They are well-known products. They behave in a well-known and predictable fashion. There are pros and cons to this combination, just as there are with any combination but your main concern is to re-learn film, not to be perfect the first time out of the gate.

A gallon of D-76 will process 10 or 20 rolls of T-Max film, depending on your film type, dilution ratio and the developing methods you use.

Once you have gone through this first batch of film and developer, gather together all the film you have developed and all the prints you have made from it.
Get yourself a six-pack of beer or a bottle or wine or whatever your preferred beverage is then sit down and look at all of your pictures.

Just look at them... Look at them in one big group. All together. Compare different pictures and rolls of film to each other. Decide what you like and don't like about your pictures.

Think about your exposure. Think about your development process. Think about your shadows and highlights. Think about your contrast. Think about overall tone. Think about grain and sharpness. Just analyze your pictures and decide what you like and what you don't like.

Once you have it set in your mind what is good and bad about your pictures, go out and get one more batch of film and developer. Do the whole thing all over again.
This time think about what you would like to change in your pictures and try to effect those changes using the same film and developer you used before.

Maybe you could change your exposure. (I like to over expose by about 1 stop. Sometimes more. Sometimes less.)

Maybe you could change your development time. (I like to develop for 85% of the published time in the data sheets but sometimes I change that too.)

Maybe you could change the way you agitate the film. Maybe you could change something else. Whatever you do, tinker with a few things and see how these changes affect your finished product.

Now, you have TWO big batches of film. Get everything together and get another bottle of wine. (I prefer beer... Chimay, to be exact.)
Do your comparisons again. Make your decisions about what is good and bad. Develop a list of two or three questions like "How can I improve detail in the shadows?" or "How can I make my images sharper or less sharp?"

Just come up with some tangible observations and some questions based upon them.

Then, when you have that, come back and tell people what you found out and ask your question again.

The reason for all this is because there are 1,000,000 different combinations of film and developer and methods of processing that you can use. Each one of them is just as valid and useful as the next, provided you know what you want to achieve with them. If you don't know what you want your film to do for you, it will be difficult or even impossible for you to decide what is the best combination for your purpose.

I started developing film again just about 6 months ago. I started out using T-Max and D-76. I got good results but my pictures weren't "just right." I tinkered for a while then I changed to Legacy Pro (Fuji Neopan) and I developed in XTOL. Now I get some really tasty pictures that are easy to print. I've been using that combination for 3 or 4 months, now and I'm happy with the results. I have a bottle of HC-110 on my shelf which I bought just for experimentation purposes and so I could have a readily available backup handy in case I needed it but, as of yet, I haven't even opened the bottle. The film and developer I'm using now work well enough for me that I don't need to use the HC-110.

So, that's my answer... There is no answer except for the answer you provide for yourself.

I guess it's some kind of Zen thing...

 

[Christopher Walrath]

Lauge. The reason your previous searches have returned ambiguous results is because there are as many working combinations out there as there are photographers who might use them. Pick a reputable developer and pick a reputable film and just see what it does for you. Pick your starting point and go from there.

 

[wclark5179]

Hey, you got to start experimenting yourself. Your eyes see differently than mine & perhaps most folks here. A lot of what you vision as "this is what I want" perhaps could be something different with another person.

I've developed several rolls of film this week (about 2 dozen!) alone! Big deal! What's my soup maybe your poison. Take in what we suggest here but the decision rests with you relative to film type and developer.

I gave you some ideas. Now make enough photos to develop at least a hundred rolls each of the two types I recommended you zero in on and go from there. See if any of them correlate to your vision of the world as you are trying to tell with your photography. There aren't any silver bullets or a quick one two punch that will be your panacea and if what I type here is all hogwash and I'm off base, I apologize.

I still experiment as I haven't yet found the ultimate/film developer combo.

Best to your success in finding photography heaven.

 

[tim k]

Randy, That was a very thoughtful reply. And is a very logical approach. I think I may have to adjust my film/developer/beer ratio.

 

[wiggywag]

T-max 400 in X-tol or Foma Excel (similar to Xtol). When you get it right it is so beautiful, and it is nice with a fast film. It is extremely sharp. I use dilution 1:2.

 

[TareqPhoto]

So from the posts, Developers: D-76, XTOL, Rodinal, and maybe ID-11
films: Tri-X, T-Max, HP5+, and maybe Plus-X or Delta/FP4+ or Across

Good luck!

 

[lauge]

Thanks for all you replies! I realize this question is hard to get a simple answer to, though I thought I had narrowed it from just best dev/film combo in general. Rodinal is the cheapest developer so I will probably go with that (D-76 and XTOL are not available) and 20 rolls of the two films with the coolest canister as they all cost the same at the shop. Then I will follow Randy's advice with 10-20 rolls of film and a glass or two of Oban and then take it from there.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Me personally, myself and I, recommend D76 or ID11, because it is a standard developer from which it is easy to depart to others when realizing the consequences.

Picking the right developer/film combination is always a compromise between speed, resolution and sharpness. You can find a developer that improves one or two characteristics but always at the expense of degrading the third. There is no one-does-it-all combination.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Rodinal is one of the sharpest but grainiest developers around. Its speed optimization is tolerable. Consequently, if you like sharp and grainy pictures, go for it. If you shoot 35mm, its a choice of love, but D76 and ID11 will give you less grain and more speed without the Rodinal sharpness.

Choices, choices ...

 

[wclark5179]

"I realize this question is hard to get a simple answer to"

Yes it is!

Can be frustrating!

That's why I visit here, to see what others are doing.

I guess it's not a perfect world!

Currently I'm using Pan-F with Wimberley WD2D+ developer. Just trying to see if it works for me.

As someone else said, choices, choices! Many choices. That's where I find I can place my vision on the choices I make.

Have a wonderful week!

 

[Worker 11811]

Then I will follow Randy's advice with 10-20 rolls of film and a glass or two of Oban and then take it from there.

You know... Your choice of beverage is MUCH more important than your choice of film!

You could conceivably choose almost any film or developer and your experiment will produce good results but if you choose the wrong drink the whole thing will go awry! Yes, I think a good top-shelf single malt Scotch will do nicely! Damn! I think I'm going to have to try some of that!

If you get enough Oban in the mix I bet you won't have to worry about your pictures looking grainy!