Film densitometer alternative

[darkroommike]

I have seen at least three different spotmeter modifications. Parry Yob did one in Peterson's Photographic years ago. Davis, of course, as others mentioned. And Picker might have done one too in his newsletters. If I didn't have a densitometer I'd use my scanner.

 

[Paul Ozzello]

If you can find an X-rite Colormunki photo for a reasonable price you can not only profile your computer screens with it, but also hook it up to an Android phone (not iPhone, Apple prevents that) and buy a $100 third party app to use it as a spectrophotometer. With a light plate you can use it as a somewhat clunky densitometer. It can do colour densitometry in all Status modes. And you can record the spectrum of any illumination. That will tell you CRI, colour temp, etc.

I'm experimenting with it and it seems I'm in the 'ballpark' with my Status M readings of C41 control strips. I also have a Heiland b/w spectrometer and some Kodak colour filters from an ancient Kodak densi. But these don't seem to be Status M. Of course I checked their spectrum with the Colormunki.

I only found a small US company, which may still offer a Status M densitometer. I think I found a price eventually and you won't call the Heiland expensive anymore after seeing that. After all the Heiland was created with the intend of being affordable. I balked at buying one for a long time and eventually gifted it to myself last Xmas.

This in an interesting option since I use a Colormunki for inkjet printing, but I don't have an andoid phone - is there a pc version I could use instead ?

 

[RalphLambrecht]

If you can find an X-rite Colormunki photo for a reasonable price you can not only profile your computer screens with it, but also hook it up to an Android phone (not iPhone, Apple prevents that) and buy a $100 third party app to use it as a spectrophotometer. With a light plate you can use it as a somewhat clunky densitometer. It can do colour densitometry in all Status modes. And you can record the spectrum of any illumination. That will tell you CRI, colour temp, etc.

I'm experimenting with it and it seems I'm in the 'ballpark' with my Status M readings of C41 control strips. I also have a Heiland b/w spectrometer and some Kodak colour filters from an ancient Kodak densi. But these don't seem to be Status M. Of course I checked their spectrum with the Colormunki.

I only found a small US company, which may still offer a Status M densitometer. I think I found a price eventually and you won't call the Heiland expensive anymore after seeing that. After all the Heiland was created with the intend of being affordable. I balked at buying one for a long time and eventually gifted it to myself last Xmas.

another vote for the Heiland from a very happy customer.

 

[Michael Firstlight]

I am surprised to see no one has yet to mention the RH Designs Analyzer Pro. It's not only a zone exposure meter, it has a dedicated switch to change it to densitometer mode: https://www.theimagingwarehouse.com/Products/Analysers-Meters/AVCA

Regards,
Mike

 

[Bill Burk]

I couldn’t resist- I bought this thing with a dozen Bakelite knobs… for thirty bucks free shipping. I hesitated only because I had to evaluate the risk that the vintage electronics might kill me.

 

[dkonigs]

I am surprised to see no one has yet to mention the RH Designs Analyzer Pro. It's not only a zone exposure meter, it has a dedicated switch to change it to densitometer mode: https://www.theimagingwarehouse.com/Products/Analysers-Meters/AVCA

Its basically doing the same thing that was suggested with the Besseler PM or Soligor SM20 earlier in this thread. Its just showing the logarithmic relationship between two light measurements in the projected image from the same negative. If the purpose is to simply evaluate the relative contrast range of that negative, that should be fine. If the goal is any other densitometer measurements (perhaps on a more absolute scale), then it may not work so well.

 

[dkonigs]

As someone who has recently been neck deep in tinkering with densitometers (though my interest has been on the reflection side so far), I've actually begun to form some strong opinions on the whole Heiland vs X-Rite debate.
If you're only measuring B&W film/paper, then Heiland is probably going to work fine. Well, you're not going to get absolute reflection measurements, and there's no way to properly recalibrate it (they only expose zeroing it to the user, not calibrating low and high values). But it should generally get the job done and is quick and simple.
But if you're measuring color film/paper, even on a B&W scale, go with the X-Rite. It does a far better job at making sure its actually measuring the correct part of the light spectrum. (Of course the downside with the X-Rite options is that they're all old and used, and may or may not be in the best operating condition out of the box.)

Sorry if this is opening a can of worms.

 

[Bill Burk]

I think the RH Designs unit tries to relate the tone you want to the grade and exposure. A nice trick that has a good reputation for working.

Now the Eseco unit should be interesting. I am not expecting it to meet my needs because it has such a short range, there’s only an 0.60 density range (3 stops) marked on its scale.

But I could work in steps. For example after exhausting its range I could open the lens on the enlarger a few f/stops (if the unit is sensitive enough to work three stops down in the first place).

 

[ic-racer]

View attachment 275556
I couldn’t resist- I bought this thing with a dozen Bakelite knobs… for thirty bucks free shipping. I hesitated only because I had to evaluate the risk that the vintage electronics might kill me.

For $30, you could have 3 of the PM1A; two working and one for parts

 

[Bill Burk]

I also got a Beseler PM4M because I think it is/was last in the series of top of the line. Plus it shows paper grade and density on the dial.

But I agree if a PM1 can be useful in the darkroom it might be worth it for me to pick up one of those to try, so I can see if it can be recommended.

Looking at my Omega CS-10 though, I remember now I hated it’s limited range, and it’s got six stops.

 

[ic-racer]

I also got a Beseler PM4M .

Post #30? Is that what it is?

 

[Bill Burk]

Haa no. That’s the Eseco Super Speedmaster Neutral Density Color Analyzer Model A-6

The Beseler PM2M is a fairly modern looking unit

 

[Michael Firstlight]

I think the RH Designs unit tries to relate the tone you want to the grade and exposure. A nice trick that has a good reputation for working.

Now the Eseco unit should be interesting. I am not expecting it to meet my needs because it has such a short range, there’s only an 0.60 density range (3 stops) marked on its scale.

But I could work in steps. For example after exhausting its range I could open the lens on the enlarger a few f/stops (if the unit is sensitive enough to work three stops down in the first place).

Yes, but it also has a separate dedicated switch to put it into densitometer mode to get log readings - something few know about the unit. Of course, you'd be better off with a dedicated film densitometer to take direct readings.

Mike

 

[Bill Burk]

Thanks Mike,

Do you use one? Just curious if it works well for a print aid.

To be clear, I bought these gadgets for the dials and knobs. And something to tinker with. I get a kick out of gadgets. I don’t expect to rely on it when printing.

As a densitometer, easel devices have drawbacks. You can’t easily read a “step wedge” (you have to move the negative back and forth in the carrier). Flare is introduced by the enlarging lens so the readings are not really correct for graphing.

I might “employ” one as a tool to guide paper grade choice and select f/stop (and whether or not I need ND 0.6) to get me in the ballpark for test strips.

But I fully intend to keep making test strips.

 

[Michael Firstlight]

Thanks Mike,

Do you use one? Just curious if it works well for a print aid.

To be clear, I bought these gadgets for the dials and knobs. And something to tinker with. I get a kick out of gadgets. I don’t expect to rely on it when printing.

As a densitometer, easel devices have drawbacks. You can’t easily read a “step wedge” (you have to move the negative back and forth in the carrier). Flare is introduced by the enlarging lens so the readings are not really correct for graphing.

I might “employ” one as a tool to guide paper grade choice and select f/stop (and whether or not I need ND 0.6) to get me in the ballpark for test strips.

But I fully intend to keep making test strips.

Yes, I own and use an RH Analyser Pro for exactly the purpose you describe. Here's the manual: https://rhdesigns.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Analyser_Pro_UM_v64.pdf

Regards,
Mike

 

[Bill Burk]

OK I found it's simple enough to aim an enlarger light down at the sensor and move the step wedge over the sensor itself. In this respect it's "not" an easel densitometer - it's a real densitometer.

The Eseco is not proving very accurate, or maybe I have more zero and sensitivity adjustment to work on. But I am getting 7 stops of range. Using it as a densitometer entails zeroing it with the enlarger at f/16 on the enlarger lens (100% transmittance with nothing over it) and then using the f/stops on the enlarger lens to get in range where the needle is on the scale. Then I remember how many f/stops I opened (times 0.3) plus the number of units the needle indicates.

The scale only shows 0.60 and the way I am using it only uses 0.60 of its overall range. But when I use the 100x range adjustments, it really gives me 7 stops of range of brightness that the unit can measure.

 

[Bill Burk]

Here’s my color analyzer lab setup.

Interestingly I cannot match the Kollmorgan 100 foot lambert + 80A Wratten to any setting on the Durst color head. I can match the color channels but not the white. I will try without the 80A or with 80A in front of both. But I think the conclusion is that you can’t match an 80A with CMY

 

[Bill Burk]

I think I will get a PM1A because if we can make that work as a densitometer then anybody can.