f1.4 50mm Takumar - to SMC or not to SMC?

[Steve Roberts]

Hi All,

In my occasional perusing of eBay and, in particular, Pentax items I find myself taking an interest in the prices of the f1.4 Super-Takumar and f1.4 SMC Takumar lenses. My impression is that usually the Super-Takumar version (i.e. non-multi-coated) seems to be presented as more desirable than the SMC version and this seems to be borne out by the prices asked. Though there is no criticism that I would level at the SMC lens, I have always considered the advantages of multi-coating to be somewhat over-rated - even the contemporary Asahi Pentax advertising showing a supposedly identical picture of a young lady taken against the sun with each type of lens isn't all it seems - in the SMC shot she has moved to obscure the sun slightly more than in the first shot.

So my questions are firstly am I correct in my impression that the non-SMC lenses generally command higher prices than SMC and secondly, why should this be?

Best wishes,

Steve

 

[Hatchetman]

there is an early version with 8 elements that some people think is better. that may be what the price premium is.

 

[Paul Howell]

The super tact are much better with color, I have the 50 1.8 in both the SMC and MC, I use the SMC when shooting color on my K5, for black and white I prefer the non SMC. I think the 50 1.4 SMC version also has a radioactive element which my also have a bearing on price.

 

[Ian Grant]

I used Super Takumar and SMC Takumar standard lenses alongside each other and could never see a difference, there were some Super Multi Coated Takumars as well in the older stye Super Takumar barrels, well at least my 105mm is.

Pentax coatings on Super Takumars were very good, you'd see more of a differences between them and the MC versions with wide angle lenses and zooms where Multi-coating has a greater effect. I've not noticed the Super Takumars fetching better prices than the screw mount SMC Takumars and they aren't more desirable.

However the older Super and SMC Takumars are more desirable than later K mount Pentax lenses as they can be used on many digital cameras with adapters and this may mean they fetch slightly more than K mount equivalents.

I've had MC lenses from other manufacturers which flared quite badly, in fact Hoya withdrew their complete MC lens range because of flare issues in the late 1970's or very early 80's. I had a 28mm Hoya it was very sharp and no distortion but it flared badly, Hoya hadn't coated every glass to air surface. The went back to the drawing board and designed a completely new range of lens which they sold under their Tokina brand name.

Ian

 

[Ian Grant]

The super tact are much better with color, I have the 50 1.8 in both the SMC and MC, I use the SMC when shooting color on my K5, for black and white I prefer the non SMC. I think the 50 1.4 SMC version also has a radioactive element which my also have a bearing on price.

I thought it was the f1.4 Super Takumar that used a radio-active element in the glass.

Ian

 

[Paul Howell]

I thought it was the f1.4 Super Takumar that used a radio-active element in the glass.

Ian

I thought I wrote 1.4 SMC, doesn't SMC stand for Super multi coating? If not, my misunderstanding of the past 40 years. At one time I had the 1.4 SMC but dropped and never got it repaired as I had the 1.8s.

 

[Ian Grant]

You got a bit muddled I think

The super tact are much better with color, I have the 50 1.8 in both the SMC and MC, I use the SMC when shooting color on my K5, for black and white I prefer the non SMC. I think the 50 1.4 SMC version also has a radioactive element which my also have a bearing on price.

It's the 50mm f1.4 Super Takumar (pre SMC) that yellows, it can be cleared by leaving in sunlight so is not so good for colour but fine for B&W The SMC - Super Multi Coated Takumar is better for colour work.

Ian

 

[Kirks518]

Ian is correct, the yellowing can be cleared with exposing it to sunlight for an extended time. I cleared two of them by leaving them on a window sill here in Florida for about 8-9 months. They command an even higher premium when they are "UV Treated".

If left yellow, I personally think it makes for nice warming, and it doesn't really adversely affect skin tones. I think with the yellowing it makes a better 'portrait' lens.

OP: If you want a non-MC, I have a few. PM me if you're interested. If you want one without any yellowing, you'd have to wait a few months though.

 

[Paul Howell]

You got a bit muddled I think



It's the 50mm f1.4 Super Takumar (pre SMC) that yellows, it can be cleared by leaving in sunlight so is not so good for colour but fine for B&W The SMC - Super Multi Coated Takumar is better for colour work.

Ian

Seems that I am somewhat muddled. What SMC stand for?

 

[Hatchetman]

It stands for Super Multi Coated

 

[cuthbert]

All my SMC are yellowed to a certain extent, even the latest production with a rubber ring that usually come with the Spotmatic Fs.

The 8 elements is a sort of collector's item, it was a very sophisticated design and expensive to produce, I didn't notice any improvement in comparison to the latter ones.

My favourite are the last generation because they allow open metering with the Fs. Yellowed or not, they work fine in B&W and colour:

 

[Fixcinater]

Any of the Tak 50s are prone to yellowing of the glass outside of the very first 8-element design, whether they are Super or S-M-C with the metal focus ring or SMC with the rubber focus grip.

My fave is the 8-element for wide open or the SMC with rubber grip for the 8-aperture blades for better bokeh when stopped down.

 

[Ricardo Miranda]

I don't have any more my Screw mount Pentax book, but Ian alluded to some differences in the finish of these lenses.

The Super-Multi-Coated Takumar lenses were introduced in 71 with the Spotmatic SP II and had the same barrel design as the previous Super Takumars.
The SMC Takumar had pretty much the same optical design for most of the range. Some lenses were improved, if I remember well, as is the case with the SMC Takumar 85mm /1.8 and 135mm /2.5. What distinguish them is most had a new barrel design with rubber coatings.
All Super-Multi-Coated and SMC Takumar had the leaver and other features for open metering with the F and ES series.

 

[Ian Grant]

Any of the Tak 50s are prone to yellowing of the glass outside of the very first 8-element design, whether they are Super or S-M-C with the metal focus ring or SMC with the rubber focus grip.

My fave is the 8-element for wide open or the SMC with rubber grip for the 8-aperture blades for better bokeh when stopped down.

That's not my experience, it was only the 50mm f1.4 Super Takumar lenses that yellowed it was the only Pentax lens to use the radio-active glass,the f1.8 and f2 lenses didn't yellow I have a 55mm f2 Super Takumar and SMC Takumar lenses and neither have the yellowing issue.

What you might think is yellowing on other Super Takumars is due to the colour of reflective coatings, people refer to pre-Multi coated lenses as Single coated but this is a misnomer because even quite early on many coated lenses used 2 and later more different coatings. By the time Zeiss and Pentax announced and released the Super Multi Coated lenses some lenses were already quite similarly coated, Rodenstock's coatings on their Sironar (pre N etc) is probably the best pre-MC I've seen.

Ian

 

[Fixcinater]

I should have specified: 50s = not the 55mm. Odd that you say the later ones aren't radioactive but it seems I have seen some stained S-M-C/SMC 1.4s. Could easily be I'm wrong.

The yellow coating is easy to confuse at first glance with the lenses off the camera but most untreated Tak 50s are yellow enough to see it through the viewfinder upon comparison.

The 35/2 also yellows. My S-M-C copy took a long time in the California sun to clear up.

 

[mgb74]

FWIW, the SMC are compatible the the Spotmatic F (open aperture metering). IIRC, some Super-Tak lenses are and some are not.

 

[narsuitus]

there is an early version with 8 elements that some people think is better. that may be what the price premium is.

I have two non-SMC lenses; one is 8-element (upper left) and one is 7-element (lower left). I think the 8-element is the better performer of the two. In fact, of the six 50mm lenses I use, it is my favorite and is well deserving of the premium price.

50mm Lenses by Narsuitus, on Flickr

 

[Ian Grant]

FWIW, the SMC are compatible the the Spotmatic F (open aperture metering). IIRC, some Super-Tak lenses are and some are not.

The only non SMC marked lenses that are fully F/ES compatible are marked Super Multi Coated Takumar these are the same barrels as the Super Takumar.

Super Takumar and other older Pentax or other M42 mount lenses cannot be used with full aperture metering the exception is the Tamron Adaptal lenses with the F/ES mount which is what I use with my F.

Ian.

 

[Fixcinater]

I've run across a couple 55mm Super Taks that had the metering lug. Maybe they were switched name rings but to come across two of them seems a bit odd. Definitely not the norm.