Exposure settings for analogue using digital camera

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Lyn Arnold

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Hello all,

I want to use a digital camera (Pentax K-01) as a "polaroid" to determine exposure settings for still life using a off-camera flash unit. The final images will be taken with a Mamiya C33 TLR. How far off will the exposures be between the two? I really only need a starting point, and can then run a test roll to see what I've captured.

This is my first venture into using flash for still life; I have only used window light and metered with a spot meter in the past.

Hope someone can help,
Lyn
 

Pioneer

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Are you trying to capture the flash image using the K-01 and then transfer those same settings to your TLR?
 
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Lyn Arnold

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Yes. Take the shot with the digital firing an off-camera flash. I set up a small shield of aluminium foil over the Pentax camera flash that triggered a slave which in turn triggered the main flash sitting behind a thin sheet for diffused lighting. This worked very well and I could look at the digital image to get the exposure right. But I want to use my Mamiya TLR for these photographs.

So...plugging in the same ISO, how far would the settings differ between digital and analogue? Just a ball-park figure. I could just use the TLR with a flash exposure meter, but the digital camera gives me an instant picture of how the flash enhances the subject.
 

CGW

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If you've got access to a flash meter and use the Pentax flash simply as a trigger for your diffused main light, then I'd experiment with settings based on what the meter thinks rather than the other way around. Use the Pentax-aroid to check those settings. The flash meter is incident, the Pentax's is reflective, so different readings.Might save some film/processing/aggravation?
 

Pioneer

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I agree with CGW. A flash meter would provide a better reading though you will likely end up somewhat close with your current method.

Another option would be to go to the strobist website and use their advice to use you flash manually and take your shots. I rarely use TTL any longer but typically make my settings manually. Even when taking shots of my family during holiday gatherings once things are set I rarely have to make changes to the flash/exposure settings and I almost always get better results than I do with TTL. The only possible exception to this may be my Pentax LX but even then I usually work with manual flash.

This is even more true when I work with off camera flash. In those situations I am usually doing portrait work or product shots (ebay and the like) and once the camera/flash exposure is set it rarely changes.

A flash meter is great if you can get your hands on one, if not a digital camera will get you close, unless you are working with slides. Black and white and color negative stock have a better lattitude range so they are more forgiving of small errors. This is not the case with slides so if you are spending the money to shoot slides, do yourself a favor, spend the money to buy a flash meter.
 
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Lyn Arnold

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Thank you CGW and Pioneer. You have both been very helpful.

I have access to a flash meter, so will use that. I am trying to avoid going through 10 or so rolls of 120 film and associated processing.

Ahh! APUG/DPUG and all you wise people. You've saved my bacon yet again.
 

indigo

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Thank you CGW and Pioneer. You have both been very helpful.

I have access to a flash meter, so will use that. I am trying to avoid going through 10 or so rolls of 120 film and associated processing.

Ahh! APUG/DPUG and all you wise people. You've saved my bacon yet again.

If you have both a flashmeter and a digital camera, use both. Use the flashmeter to determine exposure setting and then use the setting to shoot with the digital camera to see what you get.
I use a lowly, old Nikon Coolpix 5000 an 5MP P&S and my 2 Minolta flashmeters . It works very well. I could see the result before I actually made the shot on film.
 

chuck94022

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Yes. Take the shot with the digital firing an off-camera flash. I set up a small shield of aluminium foil over the Pentax camera flash that triggered a slave which in turn triggered the main flash sitting behind a thin sheet for diffused lighting. This worked very well and I could look at the digital image to get the exposure right. But I want to use my Mamiya TLR for these photographs.

So...plugging in the same ISO, how far would the settings differ between digital and analogue? Just a ball-park figure. I could just use the TLR with a flash exposure meter, but the digital camera gives me an instant picture of how the flash enhances the subject.

I'd recommend investing a tiny bit of cash (certainly less than $50) in cheap wireless remote flash triggers (look at the Cowboy Studio trigger if your TLR doesn't have a hot shoe) so that you don't have to do the rigamarole with the aluminum foil on the master flash.

I'll also echo the recommendation to avoid TTL and just use manual mode on the flashes. The flash power and exposure values should transfer just fine to film, factoring ISO values, as long as your exposure time is less than one second. If your shutter speed exceeds 1 second (which would only be of consideration for the ambient exposure obviously, not the flash exposure) then you have to consider the reciprocity characteristics of the film. I don't expect this is an issue for the kind of photography you are doing.

Note that for the film, the box ISO is not necessarily the ISO to consider for equivalence to the digital camera. If you have tested your film and determined that it exposes best at, say, a slower ISO rating, use that rating when considering your transferred exposure value. Let's say your DSLR is exposing at ISO 200, and you tested your film to expose best at ISO 100. When I got things right on the DSLR, I'd boost flash power one stop and go one stop slower (eg, from 1/60 to 1/30) on shutter speed (but not touch aperture, to preserve depth of field).

That's the other thing to consider: depth of field. You will only get the same depth of field if you are using a lens of the same focal length on the TLR. This means that your medium format TLR is going to be shooting with a wider angle of view, so the composition is going to be different (35mm on a crop frame dslr is a normal lens, equivalent in terms of angle of view to 80mm on the TLR). The depth of field between those two lenses for a given aperture is going to be different.

For purposes of exposure, this doesn't matter, but if you are trying to get the same composition, with the same depth of field, you will have to make accommodation for changes to your aperture. You'll probably stop down your aperture on the TLR. Increase flash power by an equivalent amount (eg, if you drop down one full stop in aperture, double your flash power, for example, from 1/8 power to 1/4 power). And of course, if you stop down your aperture, you'll need to reduce your shutter speed an equivalent amount to compensate the ambient exposure.

Is that enough info to totally confuse the situation? ;-)
 

RalphLambrecht

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Are you trying to capture the flash image using the K-01 and then transfer those same settings to your TLR?

as long as your film ISO and the isoof your digital camera match in light sensitivity, the method should work; however I found that digital camera sensors are often more sensitive than their specified ISO would indicate.I agree that the flsh meter is the best option, you can also use it to verify your camera iso,.
good luck, and let us know what method workee for you
 

StoneNYC

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as long as your film ISO and the isoof your digital camera match in light sensitivity, the method should work; however I found that digital camera sensors are often more sensitive than their specified ISO would indicate.I agree that the flsh meter is the best option, you can also use it to verify your camera iso,.
good luck, and let us know what method workee for you

Interesting, I often find that images that are expose properly on film, and up underexposed I'm Digital given the same camera settings. I feel like my camera used to expose properly but lately seems to be under exposing, and I wonder does the cameras sensor get weaker as time goes on?? That possible? Like how an LED screen fades overtime?
 

Nokton48

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Digitest Balloon Beauty Light and Fill by Nokton48, on Flickr

Digitest of lighting setup Sky Blue Seamless Broncolor Beauty Light at F32 45 degrees camera left, Broncolor Balloon at a 90 degrees camera left F16 providing soft overall fill to the set. Silver Fill Panel camera light angled to 'feather' the fill. So far I have tried Hasselblad with 100mm, and also with 350 f5.6 with 8mm Extension Tube. Both TMax 100 bracketed f32 to F11.

Also I have set up 5x7 Sinar Norma with my longest LF lens, a 790mm F14 Rodenstock Apo Ronar. 47 inches of bellows draw measured/required, with 1.5 stops of Bellows Draw calculated. I'll leave it set up for a while until I am satisfied with what I have gotten. 5x7 contact prints are the goal on this one

Starting with small format and slowly moving up
 

Pieter12

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I'll leave it set up for a while until I am satisfied with what I have gotten
Not to butt in on your vision, but I would like more direction or contrast in the shot. The lighting is too diffuse and flat for my taste. You could up the contrast in printing, but since you have it set up, why not experiment with the lighting?
These were all shot with strobe lighting:
Orchid color.jpg Naked Ladies Flower.jpg Yellow Arfican Iris_BW.jpg
 

wiltw

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I started off with film and darkroom work, bought a flashmeter for wedding portraiture and covering weddings and receptions, and use the same flashmeter to measure light and flash for digital photography. The meter works for both film and for digital, with zero adjustment necessary between the different media types!!!
 

Nokton48

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Much better for me as well. Thank You!

I agree it needed a bit more "umphh".

It will be interesting to compare the analog rendering to these.
 

RalphLambrecht

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Hello all,

I want to use a digital camera (Pentax K-01) as a "polaroid" to determine exposure settings for still life using a off-camera flash unit. The final images will be taken with a Mamiya C33 TLR. How far off will the exposures be between the two? I really only need a starting point, and can then run a test roll to see what I've captured.

This is my first venture into using flash for still life; I have only used window light and metered with a spot meter in the past.

Hope someone can help,
Lyn
If you stick into flash photography or intend to get deeper into it, I recommend getting a dedicated flash mirror to get precise exposures. Among those the Goosen Luna star F2 is my special favorite. It measures ambient and flash and completely takes the guesswork out of exposure metering.
 

faberryman

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I wouldn't recommended using a digital camera as an exposure meter or in place of Polaroid film. You might come to the conclusion that using a digital camera is way less hassle than shooting film, and you like the results better.
 

Pioneer

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I wouldn't recommended using a digital camera as an exposure meter or in place of Polaroid film. You might come to the conclusion that using a digital camera is way less hassle than shooting film, and you like the results better.
Odd thought. A lot of us happily use both for specific purposes but it doesn't seem to alter our attraction to film in the slightest. In fact, I would be inclined to believe that a whole lot more members of this forum moved from digital to film than the other way around.
 

MattKing

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I wouldn't recommended using a digital camera as an exposure meter or in place of Polaroid film. You might come to the conclusion that using a digital camera is way less hassle than shooting film, and you like the results better.
Sort of like avoiding the forbidden fruit?:whistling:
 
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