Ever Shoot a T50?

[waynecrider]

So my brother went to a second hand store and bought me a T50 for a B-Day present. Nice gesture but I’ve got too many cameras already. Still I futzed around with it and read a manual online and I guessed it’s like a point and shoot being you can’t change the aperture without the camera defaulting to 1/60 shutter speed. Anyone here shoot one and have opinions?

 

[Cholentpot]

So my brother went to a second hand store and bought me a T50 for a B-Day present. Nice gesture but I’ve got too many cameras already. Still I futzed around with it and read a manual online and I guessed it’s like a point and shoot being you can’t change the aperture without the camera defaulting to 1/60 shutter speed. Anyone here shoot one and have opinions?

Yes. It has the greatest sound of any camera known to mankind.

It is full auto everything which really can be freeing. If you need to adjust move the ISO around. Camera exposed bang on just about everything for me. Fun camera for shooting. Load, focus and shoot.

 

[AgX]

As you say, it is a manual focus SLR P&S.

So far never used mine.


Maybe it could be used today as an introduction to SLR photography.

 

[blockend]

Yes, and I like full auto SLRs. Today I sported a Canon AV-1, the T-50 progenitor. I also have a Konica FP-1, the most auto of auto SLR cameras, which takes regular lenses but only exposes at 2.8, 5.6 or f11. Weird. The annoying thing about the Canon T-range is the film advance noise. You could probably hear one at a metal concert.

 

[waynecrider]

My problem with a body like this is how do I tell that the camera is using the better apertures then something like F2 or F22. You can't tell. Perhaps another body or brand with at least aperture selection. Any ideas on cheap bodies with almost auto everything?

 

[Cholentpot]

Yes, and I like full auto SLRs. Today I sported a Canon AV-1, the T-50 progenitor. I also have a Konica FP-1, the most auto of auto SLR cameras, which takes regular lenses but only exposes at 2.8, 5.6 or f11. Weird. The annoying thing about the Canon T-range is the film advance noise. You could probably hear one at a metal concert.

But...but...that's the best part!

 

[AgX]

We should not overlook that a program-only SLR is no "new" thing.

Agfa not only presented the first program camera at all in 1959 and in 1960 the program-only TLR Optima Reflex.
But in 1963 also the program-only SLR Selectaflex (even with exchangable lenses) came up.

 

[AgX]

Agfa stuck to their program-only policy during the following years.
One may ask why other manufactures did not follow soon. Patent issues might be one reason. Price issues another.

 

[Helge]

T50 seems weak when the fabulous T70 can be had for the same.
Beautiful, slightly weird, in a good way, excellent camera.
Compact and light for what it offers. Easy load, four priority programs: Tele, favors fast shutter and widest possible aperture (how most people use aperture priority) , Wide, favours small aperture and slow shutter, Regular (leans a little to much towards high shutter for my liking), Shutter priority and manual. Spot-ish metering and did I mention that it’s undervalued?
Also TTL and two matching zoom flashes.

 

[AgX]

The T70 has no DOF feature, in case that matters.

 

[Helge]

Neither does a lot of other cameras in that class. It’s probably my least used feature of the “nice to have” ones. Spot metering is far more useful for instance.
Edit: Actually with bellows and FL lenses you do get stopdown metering, and you get nothing else.

 

[BobD]

Don't forget the T60, the last FD mount SLR and actually made by Cosina.

 

[blockend]

To understand auto SLRs you have to get into the mindset of the day. Single Lens Reflex cameras were the thing to have. Some people wanted them because they needed the lens versatility, lots of people just wanted to be seen with a "professional" camera. There were "serious" photographers who thought any camera that wasn't full manual was a plaything for people who didn't understand exposure. However there were many who needed their snaps to come back from the lab properly exposed, and wanted something fancier than a Kodak Instamatic.

 

[Helge]

“Of the day”‽ That sounds like today too?

 

[Helge]

Don't forget the T60, the last FD mount SLR and actually made by Cosina.

And looks it I might add.
As neutered and lacking in charm and enthusiasm as the Minolta 370s or FM10.
Sure you could use it, in the same way you can use “comfortable, sensible” clothing or drive a Seat, Skoda or Hyundai “because it’s the same on the inside as all the other cars” and “it just need to go from A to B”.
It’s the baby out with the bathwater.
Aesthetics and provenance matters.
Even if you pretend it doesn’t.

 

[blockend]

Aesthetics and provenance matters.
Even if you pretend it doesn’t.

Aesthetics is in the eye of the beholder. A 1960s Skoda or a new Merc? The Skud every time. The provenance of photography is the photograph. A plastic point and shoot can make better photos than an F6 in the right hands.

 

[AgX]

[T60] As neutered and lacking in charm and enthusiasm as the Minolta 370s or FM10.

Well, due to its design I call it an SLR to take to the opera.

Tastes vary...

 

[Helge]

Aesthetics is not an exact science (what really is these days?), but that doesn’t mean that anything goes.
It’s the continuum fallacy: Because something is fuzzy around the edges, or looks different from some points of view, doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist.
There is such a thing as bad taste, and good and bad design, within the fabric of human society.
No matter what popular, conflict deferring, false idioms might say.
Everyone can agree not to listen to a small child or a teen, when judging a painting or selecting new wallpaper.
Why? Because they simple don’t have experience to judge.
That naturally extents to adults.
Some adults have less experience with art history and design in general.
The T60 straddles the fence and appeal to lowest common denominator, at a time when the mainstream design language changed from the 80s playful, elegant, sharp, dry, modernistic, functionalist, honest design, to the 90s and basically today’s more approval seeking, inflated, flour sack, pseudo art nouveau/streamline.

 

[blockend]

Aesthetics is not an exact science (what really is these days?), but that doesn’t mean that anything goes.
It’s the continuum fallacy: Because something is fuzzy around the edges, or looks different from some points of view, doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist.
There is such a thing as bad taste, and good and bad design, within the fabric of human society.
No matter what false popular, conflict deferring, false idioms might say.

I disagree. There was considerable resistance to Martin Parr becoming a Magnum member, particularly by Henri Cartier-Bresson. His work ran counter to the monochrome aesthetic that characterised Magnum's photojournalistic origins. Now Martin Parr's work looks mainstream, and he was in demand for his style commercially. People don't know what they want until they're offered it.

 

[Helge]

I disagree. There was considerable resistance to Martin Parr becoming a Magnum member, particularly by Henri Cartier-Bresson. His work ran counter to the monochrome aesthetic that characterised Magnum's photojournalistic origins. Now Martin Parr's work looks mainstream, and he was in demand for his style commercially. People don't know what they want until they're offered it.

Exactly. Most people who are not dealing with aesthetic matters on a daily basis or have given it much thought, have little grasp of why, how and when something appeals to them or anyone.

That there are rules, history and concepts in art doesn’t mean that there is nothing to discuss or disagree about.
Same with the “hard sciences“.
You can’t just brush any discussion away with platitudes like “it’s all in the eye of the beholder” or “you can’t discuss taste”.

 

[AgX]

Over the years here at Apug but also with camera collectors I learned that one cannot discuss camera design...

(And I even consider myself educated in industrial design.)

 

[blockend]

You can’t just brush any discussion away with platitudes like “it’s all in the eye of the beholder” or “you can’t discuss taste”.

You can discuss taste and aesthetics seriously and philosophically, but not in the consumerist way you're suggesting. Any fool with money can buy branded goods, and believe they offer him bragging rights. The Canon T50 and T70 are not visually pleasing if your tastes run to a Nikon F or a Leica III, but encapsulate early 1980s Japanese design aimed at a western market, definitively. Also, cameras exist for the sole purpose of taking photographs, the aesthetics of which have nothing to do with the desirability or visual appeal of the camera.

 

[Cholentpot]

Speaking of taste,

I love the sound of the T50, and to others is fingernails on the chalkboard.

 

[waynecrider]

Don't forget the T60, the last FD mount SLR and actually made by Cosina.

I looked at all the “T” series online. You have to wind the 60, ok no big deal, but I’d prefer a winder so might pick up a T70 or perhaps a Pentax 80’s model and use my screw mounts.

 

[waynecrider]

Speaking of taste,

I love the sound of the T50, and to others is fingernails on the chalkboard.

Yeah I kinda like it too. Don’t really know what contraption to compare it to?