Ethol LPD questions

[minuteman]

Hi,

My first year in the darkroom I have been using AGFA MCP RC-paper which was developed in AFGA Multicontrast Developer and have been very satisfied with this combo. The stock is exhausted, and it is nearly impossible to get original Agfa-paper anymore. As a replacement my local dealer recommended Efke Varycon and Ethol LPD for its long shelf life.

For the first attempts i tried negatives which printed well with my old AGFA combo. The results were disappointing, so i guess i'm doing something wrong ;-)

-Developement time is way too short, 60 seconds here, 2-3 minutes recommended. LPD-dilution is 1+3.
-I'm missing punchy, deep blacks (maybe because of the short dev time?). Also the Efke-Varycon paper does not seem to respond to selenium toning.

Anyone could give me a starting point?
Thanks in advance and sorry for my poor english,
Chris

 

[df cardwell]

LPD is a great developer.

If you need a longer development time,
just increase the dilution, 1+4 ~ 1+7

 

[Jim Noel]

The Efke paper is significantly slower than most Agfa. Do a full sheet test strip at 10, 20, 40, and 80 seconds to determine first test exposures.
Jim

 

[thmm]

As Jim writes, the Efke paper is much slower, I believe it will need slightly more than three times the exposure time that MCP does. Also, it is a relatively silver-rich paper, and usually requires the full recommended development time, or even a bit more. I don't quite understand why you only developed for 60s, was that the recommendation for the developer?

I haven't tried selenium toning it myself, but I have heard that Varycon doesn't change much in tone. However, the blacks should become deeper. Again, it might take longer times or a more concentrated toner for a pronounced effect.

 

[fschifano]

I'm not familiar with Varycon through personal experience, though I have read the tech sheets. It is slow, with a paper speed of ISO 125 under unfiltered tungsten enlarging lamps, compared to the Agfa papers which came in at ISO 400 if I recall correctly. That's two stop, so 4x the exposure. As to development, I can't say. It is pretty hard to overdevelop paper though, if you've gotten the exposure right. It may look done in the tray after 60 seconds, but it's not. There are subtle changes, most notably to the highlight densities, that happen after that and they are difficult to see under safelight illumination. Only after the print is fixed and dried are they more readily apparent. I use a lot of Foma paper, and it takes a good 2 1/2 to 3 minutes before it is fully developed. And one more point, Varycon recommends a red safelight. OC safelights might cause some fogging.

Fromm the Varycon paper's description on Freestyle's web site:

"A standard red safelight must be used. OC safelights or a combination of red and OC safelights may result in fogging. Please do a safelight test for your own darkroom environment."

 

[titrisol]

If you are not getting blacks then you are underexposing the paper.
Take a negative you know the time from AGFA and run a test sheet/strip that includes the times above
Once you determine your correct time then you can correct based on the factor =New_time/Old_Time for all next pictures

LPD is quick, 60s seems fine, but you can dilute it to 1+7 or 1+9 or even higher
That not only makes the times more manageable but also will respond to toning better

 

[df cardwell]

Bravo Titrisol !

All dilution does is control the rate an image develops.
Aim for 1.5 minutes with RC, and enjoy.

 

[minuteman]

Many thanks for your advices. I tried 1+7 dilution and the results are much better now. Need more practice though. Strangely it seems that higher dilutions don't have any effects on contrast ...

bye,
Chris

 

[df cardwell]

Strangely it seems that higher dilutions don't have any effects on contrast

The truth is that Dilution has no direct affect on Contrast !
(and in prints, for various reasons, none at all !)

 

[Rolleiflexible]

My first year in the darkroom I have been using AGFA MCP RC-paper which was developed in AFGA Multicontrast Developer and have been very satisfied with this combo. The stock is exhausted, and it is nearly impossible to get original Agfa-paper anymore.

You are a lucky man. Adox has
returned Agfa's MCP papers to
market:

http://www.adox.de/english/ADOX_Papers/ADOX MCP -/MCP.html

If you are in the US, you can buy
MCP 310 now from Freestyle:

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/12684-Adox-MCP310-VC-RC-8x10-100-sheets-Glossy?cat_id=501

And MCP 312 is on the way:

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

It should be available also from the
usual European vendors, if you are
not in the US.

My wife and I print most of our work
on the fibre version of these papers
(MCC 111) in LPD at a 1:3 dilution and
we are hooked on the combination.

 

[titrisol]

True, since paper is developed to completion
HOWEVER with Ethol it is said that the more diluted the "warmer" the image
I tried severla dilutions with Ilford MG and MG-WT and then toned in selenium and sulfide(Viradon)
The higher dilution image looked barely the same a bit browner in the MG-WT, BUT the hughe difference came when toning, the more diluted LPD produced images that tones to a wonderful aubergine in WT+selenium and a very pleasant dark-chocolate MG+Viradon
Since then I went to 1+14, 1+19 and so forth

Bravo Titrisol !

All dilution does is control the rate an image develops.
Aim for 1.5 minutes with RC, and enjoy.

 

[Rolleijoe]

I've used both combinations which you have tried, and the two are definitely not the same as many here before me have stated. I still have an 8x10/100sh box of Varycon Fotokemika fiber paper sealed, from when I switched to Fomatone papers with the LPD developer. Absolutely brilliant combination.

My favorite paper is Fomatone 333. An RC paper with a Fiber look. Various dilutions of LPD give different results, which are never-ending. I've one 12x16 box of 542 on hand, but saving it for something special. Also have the Fotokemika 16x20/50sh on hand, Agfa MCP 16x20, and Fomatone 333 16x20.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

A overall veil caused by improper safelight color can cause the low contrast you describe. I have had this experience myself. Never assume one safelight color works for all b/w papers.