Epson V800 Blue line on negative (slide film) scans

[Svenedin]

I am having problems with blue lines appearing on my scans. I am scanning Fujichrome Velvia 100 (slide film). This film is not mounted as slides but is in film strips and placed in the film holder that came with the scanner.

The film was lab processed by a reputable lab.

I am using Epson Scan and the latest version as updated by the updater software.

I am scanning at 6,400 dpi but altering the resolution has not altered the appearance of the blue lines. I have also tried cleaning the scanner glasses and film holder, trying all of the different heights possible for the film holder, turning digital ICE on and off, 24 bit and 48 bit colour but the problem remains.

Can anyone suggest what is causing this problem? I very rarely scan colour so I am at a loss. Is it a scratch from the lab? I can't see it with a loupe (but I might have better luck in daylight).

In the example photo the blue line is horizontal across the lower part of the photo. This line does not appear on all the frames.

 

[Svenedin]

I think this is a lab issue. The blue line does not affect all frames but some of the frames are very dirty and seem to have odd green crystals on them. I will be expressing my displeasure at the lab's work.

 

[Trail Images]

My PC is off line so I can only respond through iPhone here.
Every time I’ve had this occur I had to use compressed air, very carefully, in the scanner bay area to blow light dust off the scanning element. It has fixed the issue for me several times over many years. Once I performed this as a last thought the first time I encountered the issue the very next scan was clean.

 

[Trail Images]

After reading your second comment my images were clean on the light table and was only an issue upon scans.

 

[Patrick Robert James]

That is almost assuredly a dirty mirror in your scanner. To make sure, flip the frame upside down and scan again. If the line is exactly the same, then it is the lab. 99% it is probably your scanner. If your scanner has a calibrate function, you should use that too. You should actually always use that before you make any scans.

 

[Poisson Du Jour]

I see this often enougn. Chemical (surface) residue on the film, particularly from labs using roller transport rather than dip-n-dunk. Clone it out (along with the blue line) in PSP/LRM (along with the heaps and heaps of dust!) and evening-out of corners (vignetting). Film can also very easily be scratched in-camera (just a speck of dust or dirt over the gate is enough to cause a lot of damage). "Odd green crystals" can also be symptomatic of excessive humidity, of which all Velvia emulsions are sensitive to.

Leave Digital ICE off for colour scanning — it is much better to master dust-removal by clone-out with tools.

 

[Svenedin]

My PC is off line so I can only respond through iPhone here.
Every time I’ve had this occur I had to use compressed air, very carefully, in the scanner bay area to blow light dust off the scanning element. It has fixed the issue for me several times over many years. Once I performed this as a last thought the first time I encountered the issue the very next scan was clean.

OK. I did think this might be the issue so I used both canned air and then lens wipes to clean all of the glass areas top and bottom but the problem persisted.

 

[Svenedin]

That is almost assuredly a dirty mirror in your scanner. To make sure, flip the frame upside down and scan again. If the line is exactly the same, then it is the lab. 99% it is probably your scanner. If your scanner has a calibrate function, you should use that too. You should actually always use that before you make any scans.

I will try this and report back. I don't know where the mirror is though. I don't think the scanner has a calibrate function -nothing about it in the instructions.

 

[Svenedin]

I see this often enougn. Chemical (surface) residue on the film, particularly from labs using roller transport rather than dip-n-dunk. Clone it out (along with the blue line) in PSP/LRM (along with the heaps and heaps of dust!) and evening-out of corners (vignetting). Film can also very easily be scratched in-camera (just a speck of dust or dirt over the gate is enough to cause a lot of damage). "Odd green crystals" can also be symptomatic of excessive humidity, of which all Velvia emulsions are sensitive to.

Leave Digital ICE off for colour scanning — it is much better to master dust-removal by clone-out with tools.

OK. I do know how to use the clone tool (one of the few things I do actually know how to use). There is always heaps and heaps of dust in my house -open fires, animals, old house.

One thing I would say is that I do scan monochrome films quite often. These have all been developed by me. I would be very annoyed with myself if my films looked liked this one. My black and white films are vastly cleaner than this mess.

 

[Anon Ymous]

I will try this and report back. I don't know where the mirror is though. I don't think the scanner has a calibrate function -nothing about it in the instructions.

I'm using a different scanner (Minolta Dimage Scan Dual III) and occasionally get a faint line at the edge of the long side of the scan. It's not on the film and goes away if I recalibrate the scanner. I use Vuescan and it's an option in a menu. Epson scan might not have it.

Best of luck.

 

[Svenedin]

I'm using a different scanner (Minolta Dimage Scan Dual III) and occasionally get a faint line at the edge of the long side of the scan. It's not on the film and goes away if I recalibrate the scanner. I use Vuescan and it's an option in a menu. Epson scan might not have it.

Best of luck.

The weird thing is the blue line only affected about 4 frames. The general dirt and weird green crystals affected a lot more.

 

[shutterfinger]

The "calibration area" on an Epson scanner is the rear most (end closest to the lid hinge) of the bed glass. Look at any film holder (Epson supplied) for the scanner, the notched out area at the rear is for calibration. In Epson scan the scanner calibrates at the start of each scan.

The mirrors in a scanner are at the front of the sensor block that moves from rear to front during a scan. To access the mirrors remove the scanner lid, remove the screws at the bottom of the lid hinge slots then carefully lift the base off the frame.
Prior to removing the lid start a scan then pull the power plug from the scanner at the back once the scan block has moved 2 to 3 inches or more forward. The base uses clips that are part of the base to attach at the front. Unplug the switch cables from the switch board.
The sensor is on the rear of the scan block, Do Not remove it from the block. If removed the sensor will have to be aligned to get proper scans. It is a time consuming procedure and requires a precision test target to get the image linear at all areas of the scan.
The under side of the bed glass must be streak free and the base and frame dust free upon reassembly. The inside of the transparency adapter glass must be streak free and the adapter dust free also.
Epsons usually gass out after 5 to 6 years and have to be opened and cleaned, the sensor may need cleaning after 10 to 12 years.

 

[Svenedin]

Ok thanks for that. My scanner is only 18 months old. If the problem persists I may have to send it back to Epson. Taking it apart sounds rather daunting and I would probably destroy it in the process. I would also almost certainly introduce more dust than there is already.

 

[Poisson Du Jour]

. I would also almost certainly introduce more dust than there is already.

Yes, that's right! Scanners are assembled in a clean environment. Opening them up will only make the problem worse, beside the placebo effect.
Dust and discolouration annoyed me so much I put my Epson V700 scanner out for kerbside recycling, as all of my photographs are drum-scanned (Heidelberg). I don't miss it.
Transparency film will always attract dust, so will mono film. A wipe down with an antistatic cloth is god pre-prep be free scanning, but should not be done on thinner negatives.

 

[shutterfinger]

I've cleaned a few older Epson scanners. Keeping the dust out on reassembly is that difficult. I have a V700 and V500 neither of which need cleaning yet.
Glass cleaners leave a residue. I clean the bed glass and transparency adapter glass with Windex and paper towels followed by a rub down with a clean heavyweight microfiber lens cleaning cloth once the glass is completely dry.

 

[Svenedin]

Yes, that's right! Scanners are assembled in a clean environment. Opening them up will only make the problem worse, beside the placebo effect.
Dust and discolouration annoyed me so much I put my Epson V700 scanner out for kerbside recycling, as all of my photographs are drum-scanned (Heidelberg). I don't miss it.
Transparency film will always attract dust, so will mono film. A wipe down with an antistatic cloth is god pre-prep be free scanning, but should not be done on thinner negatives.

So you have your films scanned by the lab? I have considered that but high resolution scans are expensive.

 

[Poisson Du Jour]

So you have your films scanned by the lab? I have considered that but high resolution scans are expensive.

Yes, that's correct. Masked transparencies for printing are sent up by courier, or in nice weather (not today!), I hop on the train for a 75km commute with the bike, with a couple of stops in Hipsterville and Snobsville for cofvfee.

I do have a V800 bought shortly after the V700 was disposed of, and that is sometimes used for proofing and family geneology work.

The lab scans are top notch, with all colourimetrics, dusting, profiling, USM and printing automated by serial droplets. Scan cost is built into the print production cost (I think this is $34 for a scan to 12x16" print, plus $64 for the print itself - Kodak Supra META RA-4). Though the technology has improved greatly over the years, desktop scanners will not give you the quality that drum scanners do, but they are still very good for people on a budget.

 

[hsandler]

The line looks a lot like a dust speck in the calibration area of the platen (near the hinge end of the cover). If you dust it and the line disappears, great. If not, then as mentioned, it might be dust on the underside of the glass or worse, in the scanning head assembly, which would require taking the platen off. Removing the platen to clean the underside is not as scary as it sounds; however, I've never attempted to touch the scanning head.

 

[Patrick Robert James]

For a flatbed I use a Canon 9950f which is somewhere around 12 years old I think. I have never had any issues removing the glass and cleaning the mirror surfaces which should be done occasionally. The mirror and glass can get a haze on it from the plastic of the scanner, kind of like the inside of the windshield on your car after some hot days. I use Zeiss lens cleaner, ROR or alcohol and a Q-Tip. I blow the mirrors off with compressed air right before I reassemble it. Like I said, I have never had any problems. I've even done a few little mods to it to eliminate as much flare as possible. It shouldn't be that hard to get the glass off on the Epson. I'm sure someone has put up a Youtube or a tutorial somewhere on the net.

Make sure the glass surface is clean where the calibration will take place. Usually it is in the gap at the top of the holder for transparency scans on most scanners.

The calibration function is under the "scanner" menu in the top menu bar, at least on my Mac it is. You might be surprised at the difference it makes. I occasionally forget to do it before I start scanning and go a little nuts trying to adjust everything so it is right, then I remember, and boom. You can get lines going through your scan, the color can be "off", so can the values compared to what they should be, as well as exposure. It really pays to do the calibration since it zeros out everything so to speak.

Hope that helps.