Ensign Commando Questions

Topsy · Sep 12, 2017

Hello

I had been looking around for a Commando for a while now, (still trying to find the elusive '45 Military Spec) and finally found one.

Obviously I don't want to damage anything and I feel like I've literally read every single page on the Commando (there aren't that many pages out there). I can't seem to find a manual for it. In fact, I can't seem to find anything much about it "marketing" wise either, no catalogues or such.

I've got three questions:
1. What does the small lever on the side of the winding knob do? (on the right side of the winding knob when viewed from behind)
I've got the 1st Civilian version with the knob on the winder if that makes any difference.

2. Shutter speeds seem correct, shutter speed selection is a 'bit' stiff though and needs operation with two fingers. Is this normal for the Epsilon shutter? Most of my experience is based on Prontors.

3. Viewfinder seems yellow. Does anyone know if this is a thorium element or a light tint?

Tried emailing "ensign.demon.co.uk" but that page got updated last nearly 9 years ago and the email is inactive.

Many thanks!

R.Gould · Sep 13, 2017

1 The small knob is something to do with the frame counter if you use the automatic winding on of the film, personally I have never used it on my commando as with the system you lose a frame, I prefer the red window system on my commando
2 The shutter speed setting ring on all of my \ensigns, all of which have the Epsilon shutter, is easy to turn, should be light and easy to turn
the yellow is just a light tint with the Commando,
they are a nice camera to use, just be careful of the epsilon shutter, used carefully they work well, but need care, never change from slow to fast speed, that is from a 10 to 25 with the shutter cocked, you will destroy the shutter if you do, if fact with the epsilon | would never change shutter speeds on the episolen with the shutter cocked, treat the shutter with great care as they are not up to German made shutters standard,
Richard

Topsy · Sep 13, 2017

Thanks a lot for your answer Richard.

Do you happen to know how that knob/lever would work? Currently when I fire the camera I get a mechanical clockwork sound from the film advance, similar to a very loud 1s shutter, but it does not advance the film, I however also can't make it not do the sound.

Would you suggest to leave the shutter and use it as it is or attempt to find someone to fix it? It feels as it it's rubbing on something/the ring is squeezed a bit.

I've read about that you shouldn't change speeds when the shutter is cocked, but thanks a lot for the warning, and thank you for the clarification on the tint, very much appreciated!

Getting to know a camera without many resources is quite hard, but fun!

Geoffrey

Topsy · Sep 14, 2017

Got some film it in a now and another question arose: How can I change the double exposure block to the 6x4.5 format?

Took two shots, with Delta 400 in it, up to now and this is going to be a ton of fun!
Got some Rollei Ortho 25 on the way now.

R.Gould · Sep 14, 2017

On mine the knob is set one way to set the film advance, move it slightly to the right, after winding on to 1 in the red window, it should be silent, for winding the film using the red window then simply leave the knob to the left, which is the best way as with modern films , the film itself is slightly thinner also the backing paper today is very slightly thinner so with modern films these winding mehesin's simply do not work and you will find some of the frames overlapping, with 645 you have to use the red window,use the upper window, on mine marked 16, 645 will not work with the auto wind, as far as the double exposure it is set to the film wind, when you press the shutter release button then that locks the shutter release, which clears as soon as you wind on the film, but be careful, on many of these old folders the double prevention does not work all the time, so as soon as you have taken the exposure wind the film on to the next number, I pretty much use folders all the time for MF, apart from a couple of Rolleis and a Microcord I love my folders, but they do have their quirks, so with the Commando, a lovely old camera, I would strongly suggest that you set the auto wind off and use the red window, the auto wind simply does not work well with modern films, and for 645 you have no choice, I have a couple of baldas and 2 Ensign Autorange 220's the balda's cn work with red window, although it has a auto wind, I tried them and I always get 3 or 4 overlapping frames, with the Autorange's I have no choice, they only have auto wind, for both 66 and 645, but the way they are made I have learned how to use the frame counters to avoid overlapping, but the Commando has a different systen which has no frame counter, you would need to refer to the red window, so better to use the red window for 66, you have no choice for 645, have fun with the camera,In all of this I am assuming that you have found the masks inside the camera, 2 built in hinged masks where the film chambers are that you put into the film path to change the camera from 66 to 645, and remember when taking 645 use the upper window, 66 the lower, you can't change mid film it is either one or the other,
Richard

R.Gould · Sep 14, 2017

Topsy said:
Thanks a lot for your answer Richard.

Do you happen to know how that knob/lever would work? Currently when I fire the camera I get a mechanical clockwork sound from the film advance, similar to a very loud 1s shutter, but it does not advance the film, I however also can't make it not do the sound.

Would you suggest to leave the shutter and use it as it is or attempt to find someone to fix it? It feels as it it's rubbing on something/the ring is squeezed a bit.

I've read about that you shouldn't change speeds when the shutter is cocked, but thanks a lot for the warning, and thank you for the clarification on the tint, very much appreciated!

Getting to know a camera without many resources is quite hard, but fun!

Geoffrey

I don't understand what the noise is, is it when you press the shutter, on any speed setting, and then the film not winding on, if that is the case it might be worth getting a cla, if it is a noise when winding on the film, it could be a problem with the winding, if so try winding with the lever set to red window and if that is quite then stick to that, other than that get a cla done it will cost but when done the camera will be fine for many years to come, but the Epsilon shutter is one of the simplest around, made in house by Ensign when the German shutters became un available due to WW2, up to the start of the war Ensigns mainly used Prontor shutters
Richard

Topsy · Sep 15, 2017

Thanks again Richard..

Yes, I found the barn doors I did actually research the camera a lot before I found one for sale, but I am a bit surprised by the issues I'm having with the winding!

That lever does not at all act like it should on mine.
If I put it to the left it will get pushed back to the right during winding.
On the right it does a "cckrrrrrt" sound when pressing the shutter, which I assume would ideally be the automatic winding mechanism doing it's thing.
I'm currently using 6x4.5 and as it is on the right all the time I run into a barrier winding, I assume this is in place to stop the auto-wind to wind on too far, so I push the lever back to the left to get past the barrier, which everytime sets off the "cckrrrrt" sound again.

If I do press the shutter with the lever on the left it does not activate the auto wind, so that seems correct.

It's just strange that the lever keeps getting pushed to the right.
I'll have to see if I can find anyone that can CLA it, I don't want to attempt it myself on this camera.
Also will need to speak with the seller, I'd technically have a 1month return but I don't really want to part with it, but I paid for a fully working camera and this is not quite that.

When I've done with the film I'll try to show a video of my issues, I'll still hoping for some kind of user error!

Also, by mine it's the lower window marked with "16" and the upper marked with "12". It seems right though with the film backing?

R.Gould · Sep 15, 2017

It is not autowind. it is simply works as a stop when winding on the film after exposure, you still have to turn the winder, perhaps the better word would be auto stop, you wind the film on as normal, but with the 66 the winder stops at the next frame, as per something like the Rollei, but it only works with 66, with 645 you have no choice but to wind using the red window, there is a sort of connection which should prevent the small lever going back , a lock of sorts, and with mine the lever only returns when you try and turn the winder the wrong way, if you turn the winder clockwise then the lever re sets, turn it normally anti clockwise with the lever locked then the lever should stay in place, it clicks into place on mine,as far as the noise, there should be no noise from anywhere when winding, and you should only hear the click of the shutter on the fsster speeds, or the whir on the slower speeds, anything else and the problem is with the camera, I suggest you forget about using the autostop and simply use the red window, yoiu have to anyway for 645, and for 66 using the autostop you lose a frame, 11 instead of 12,
Richard

Topsy · Sep 15, 2017

R.Gould said:
It is not autowind. it is simply works as a stop when winding on the film after exposure

Ah! That explains one bit of it! But on the other hand it explains the sound even less!

I'd like to forget about it but since it activates itself again each time it's a bit hard.

Here's a video of both the lever popping to the right "on it's own" and the sound..

The winding assembly does not make that sound when the lever is to the left.
I must also add that the sound in the video is about the shortest one (typical when you want to show somebody!) it's made, usually it's longer/slower.

R.Gould · Sep 15, 2017

One thing I can see from your video is that you have the first version of the commando and mine is a later version, your film winding knod is different to mine, as far as a noise, the shutter sounds fine to me, but the second time, the noise to me sounds like the shutter firing, try and pust the auto stop lever all the way until it clicks into place, it should lock, which relaeses the auto stop and allows you to use the red window, with 645 you have to use the red window, there is no other way, I can't hear any sort of whir or anything wrong but I can't explain the sound of the shutter firing when the shutter is not set,but when you pres the shutter release with the shutter not set the the shutter release will lock, that happens with any old camera with double exposure prevention and perhaps the noise louder than mine, mine maks a very slight click when I press the shutter without the shutter cocked, that is the only explaintion I can think of, as far as the lever for setting the auto stop, it can need a firm push, it may be a bit stiff,so make sure that it is all the way across and locked, I can't think of anything else unless maybe there is a fault with it, but that would be very unusual, so be firm with it, you should feel and hear it click into place, it is not very loud but very diffinate, I have just had another very careful look at your video and I can see that your little lever is not all the way across and is therefore not locked, does the knob at the top of your winder press down? mine is different, it is two knob one on top of the other both the same size, the top on mine lifts to release the film spool, I suggest that you try and move the lever over as far as it will go until it lock's into place, it is a very positive feel and sound
Richard

R.Gould · Sep 15, 2017

Hi Topsy, I have managed to work out the noise you hear, if I am right it is nothing to worry about, it is just the auto stop unwinding to release the wind to the next frame, it happens with mine, just tried it, I didn't get it at first as I never use the auto stop as it does not work with modern film, I prefer the red window, so if you can get the auto stop lever to lock then you should be good to go, after some further trials on my commando you need to push the lever down then all the way over to the left, where it should stay, try that and if it works then you should be set to enjoy the camera, one other tip, the Ensar lens is uncoated, so in sunny,bright conditions you can in some conditions get flare, so if you can find a lens hood for it then get it,
Richard

Topsy · Sep 17, 2017

I've now got through my film and can now wind more freely.

The knob on my winder is only there to lift up to extract the film as far as I can tell, just like your top one, just smaller and trickier to handle.

I think you're right about the sound, thanks!

I did do some investigation into the autostop knob getting pushed back. I have tried, multiple times, to push it all the way to the left. It does give feedback of being 'locked' in place, but it always gets pushed back to the right again after exactly one full turn of the winder.
Tested it by marking a spool with a pen, and sure enough it's the same place with each revolution.

Will develop the photos tomorrow and see what they look like. Focus tests etc, though I did make sure that it's about right with a piece of baking paper in the spool before hand to avoid what happened last year with my isolette (focus ring was rotated by 180°) and then contact the shop about the lever.

Thanks again!
Geoffrey

Fraxinus · Sep 23, 2017

This thread has proved very timely as I've just been given an Ensign Commando.
It's a bit of an enigma because it seems to have a Version 2 body (spool retractor button on top of winder) but a Version 4 lens & shutter (75mm Ensar f3.5-22; Epsilon shutter B, 1-300th). Serial No. is C2526.

The posts here have made me realise that the small lever under discussion is absent on mine. The slot is there, but no button/lever (see pic).

Not sure if this is the cause of my problem, as there is something amiss that I wonder if anyone here can comment on.

Without a film in the camera, the shutter release duly locks after each exposure until the wind on is turned a few times, at which point the re-cocked shutter can be fired again with the shutter release button.
With a film in the camera, the shutter release can be depressed for the first exposure but thereafter - having wound the film on for the next exposure - the shutter release remains locked.
Is this related to the missing lever? Reading Richard's explanation seems to suggest that the 'auto stop' is controlled by the lever, is this the case? The auto stop seems permanently engaged on mine although I don't want to use it, preferring to use the red window.
The auto stop counter moves on after each shutter release even with no film in the camera. I'm curious to know how it works and how it should be set when loading a new roll of film. My guess is that my missing lever may be the root of the problem?

As the OP says, there is precious little information available online about this historic little dual-format camera with the moving backplane focus.

R.Gould · Sep 23, 2017

If that lever is missing then there would seem to be a problem with the auto stop, I can't see it having broken, these are pretty solid cameras, it looks to me as if there was a problem with the auto stop and a previous owner has attempted to correct the trouble by removing the lever,
Topsy, the lever should bot return to the autostop position if it is set properly, I have had 2 or 3 of these cameras and never had a problem with the autostop, Problems with the shutter, but that is another storey, but other than that pretty problem free,
Roy, yours looks like a mk 1 to me, the mark 2,( there was only ever a mark 2) had tge shutter speeds to 300, but has a double winding knob, both the same size, one on top of another, and yours has the older type, a small knob above the winder, with mine you seperate the 2 the one on top coming up to release the spool and your should, AFIK, should have the earlier shutter with a top speed of 250, the later shutter only coming in the second generation of Commandos, they were not offered for sale for long they were stopped in 1949/50 due to poor sales following the war, and I wonder if a previous owner tried to put in a later Epsilon shutter as well as trying to fix problems with the auto wind, I have seen shutter exchanges in other Ensigns, including a Prontor shutter exchanged for an epsilon in a Selfix 1620,which actualy worked quite well
Richard

Fraxinus · Sep 23, 2017

Thanks Richard, I think you are probably right in your assessment, the auto-stop would seem to be the problem area. I'll persevere with it as it would be good to get it fully functional again.
What is frustrating is that it works fine without a film in it, so I'm curious as to how the linkage between shutter release, wind-on and the auto-stop counter is altered simply by having a film inserted. The counter counts up every time you fire the shutter with no film in the camera.

Incidentally, there appears to be much uncertainty over the model range. The Early Photography site lists four (http://www.earlyphotography.co.uk/site/entry_C680.html) with mine appearing to be the second model, it being the only one that has the small spool-lifting knob. The Mark 1 definitely had no leatherette covering on the top housing, which mine has.
Here are some pics of mine:

Topsy · Sep 23, 2017

The fist version was intended for the War Department / military use, I'd call yours Civilian version 1, to simplify things. I've also noticed each page calling them differently..

I fixed my lever by the way, Richard. I loosened the the three screws around the winder, moved that "cover" around a bit and re tightened them at the same spot. The lever now locks into place but I get the clockwork winding noise when winding. I'm assuming it's a bit like a bicycle hub.

I also think can tell you how you can stop it from locking without the lever, Fraxinus, but I'm not sure there's a revertable way of doing this.

There is a small lever that the shutter button presses down and stays up to "lock" the button, if I understood it's function correctly.
This small lever is pushed under the "cover" (the one with the three screws and the cut out towards the shutter button) and is being kept pushed down in there.
I imagine that if you can rotate that lever under the cover you might get it to stay there and not get your shutter locked anymore.

I'll take a photo tomorrow to try and make it clearer.

I can't make out why you're having issues with the film in though!

R.Gould · Sep 24, 2017

Fraxinus said:
Thanks Richard, I think you are probably right in your assessment, the auto-stop would seem to be the problem area. I'll persevere with it as it would be good to get it fully functional again.
What is frustrating is that it works fine without a film in it, so I'm curious as to how the linkage between shutter release, wind-on and the auto-stop counter is altered simply by having a film inserted. The counter counts up every time you fire the shutter with no film in the camera.

Incidentally, there appears to be much uncertainty over the model range. The Early Photography site lists four (http://www.earlyphotography.co.uk/site/entry_C680.html) with mine appearing to be the second model, it being the only one that has the small spool-lifting knob. The Mark 1 definitely had no leatherette covering on the top housing, which mine has.
Here are some pics of mine:
View attachment 187141 View attachment 187142 View attachment 187143 View attachment 187144

The commando was originally made for use by the armed services and was used by the British army in 1945, when the war was over it was decided to release it for general sale and as such was tidied up, leatherette fitted Etc, so in effect the Mk 1 was the army version, the second version was the tidied up version for sale, they did not sell well and so was improved a couple of times, but were never a big seller, so were withdrawn around 1950/51
Richard

Topsy · Nov 27, 2017

So.. I got fed up and put it aside for a while after I noticed that it does not focus quite correctly.

I believe is back focusing but I'm not entirely sure.

It's there any easy way of checking that? I tried setting up my dslr with a macro, focusing on baking paper that I loaded into the Commando, focusing on a distant streetlight at night, but the baking paper does not resolve well enough..

I guess I'll need to do tests with a proper roll of film. Are there any standard procedures that will make sure what the issue is? I don't fancy 'wasting' a roll.

After that I have no idea if or how the range finder could be adjusted. Since it's coupled I'd like to think that it would be easiest to shim the lens if it's back focusing?

R.Gould · Nov 27, 2017

The Commando is film plane focusing, the film plane moves in and out rather than the lens moving, normally works fine, I have 2 now (I recently got hold of a second one) and they both focus fine as a quick check does the rangefinder linp correctly at infinity,? this is a cheap and cheerful check, but even if the focus is rangefinder is slightly out at infinity with the lens stopped down to around 11 everything should be fine
Richard

Topsy · Nov 27, 2017

I know it's film plane focusing, that's why I'd rather not mess with the RF and would assume that it's still together correctly. (and if it's not I'd not want to mess with it either!)
The images line up correctly.

Yes, I'd assume so, but f11 is not always convenient. I intend to mainly use Rollei Ortho 25 in it..

I was wondering if the lens and shutter had been remove at one point and a shin had been lost/overtightened.

R.Gould · Nov 27, 2017

If you are using the camera/lens much wider than 8 then you will see a softer image, remember that the ensar is a triplet, a good one but a triplet none the less and you need to stop it down to at least 8 to get the best from it, remember also that it is an uncoated lens, the ensar performs at it's best at between 8 to 11, I have 4 or 5 ensigns with the uncoated ensar and they are all the same, between 8 to 11 they are at there best, open more and sharpness can fall off, same on every Ensign/ensar lens I own, loke most triplets they need to be stoped down to get the best out of them, as far as taking the lens out, shiming Ect, I used to have a third commando, and the shutter broke so I took it apart to see how it all worked, no shims in mine, and as far as over tightimg then that would not be a problem, the lens/shutter is very simple, on fact so simple I managed to get my shutter working, put it all back together and it is still working and focusing spot on, with any German shutter such as the prontor, or even worse a Compur I wouldn't even contemplate,

Topsy · Nov 27, 2017

Yes, I'm completely aware of that. But do you know what, it could be that I am the error. Though I do feel like I have a steady hand it could be that I simply kept wobbling! I found the first film I shot and that has a few photos on it that are sharp. The difference was the silm speed maily.
I do hope I am the issue.. I'll buy myself a faster film tomorrow and report back on that issue!
I feel a bit stupid now..

R.Gould · Nov 28, 2017

as long as he rangefinder images line up correctly at infinity, and then put the camera on a tripop, meaure with a ruler or tape a closer object and check that the rangefinder is reasonably correct at the closer distance then that rules out the rangefinder itself then the problem is you, I can't see how the actual focusing re the back could be out, and the lens itself is a fixed position, so unless the rangefinder itself is out then you are the problem,
Richard

Topsy · Sep 1, 2023

Way to go to dig up an old thread, but at least it's my own and I hope that makes it okay.

Last year my Commando broke down, at least that's how it felt, after it working decently for 5 years. I now got it into my head that I'd like to fix it and take it along on holidays with me (unrealistic now), but I may need some help.

What happened was that my winder, which was subject of this thread years ago, simply broke. I was winding on film and the lower knob started to lift up, exposing the insides of the winder. I put it all together again but it just doesn't stay sitting where it ought to.
If you lift the top knob to take the spool out, the winding knob can very easily be lifted up too and I'm sure that used not to be like that when I received the camera.

Adding to this issue, the double exposure prevention is on all the time, in other words it's impossible to fire the shutter via the shutter button.

Last night I took the winder apart and had a peek inside, gave it a clean et cetera and put it back together, I however did not see any way that the winding knob could have been fixed to stay down on the top plate and not lift up.
I also could not figure out how to remove the little lever on the side that switches between the auto-stop and manual wind. This lever, as far as I can see, must be removed in order to disassemble the whole winder down to the double exposure preventor (I'm assuming this is under the top plate).

The second issue is, and this also was subject of the thread in the past, the rangefinder itself. My guess is that someone assembled the camera with a cog in an incorrect position, thus giving a discrepancy of what the rangefinder shows and where the film plane lies. There's a cut out under the hot shoe shoe where you can see directly onto the mirror, along with two screws, but I doubt they're there for any adjustments?

I don't necessarily want to tear off all leatherettes to remove the top plate - if anyone could guide me to the location of the screws I'd be very glad!

Alternatively, if anyone knows and repair technician that might have experience with the camera, I'd be happy to receive his contact.

Many thanks,
Geoffrey

PS: I'm sorry and fear that this post will not have been all too understandable to anyone who hasn't got a model to hold infront of themselves or has first hand experience in repairing the camera, I'm also sorry for my made up terminology.

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