enlarger timer for color prints

[plus]

Hello,

could you suggest me a very simple no red leds enlarger timer for color prints? with 2 or 3 memory positions to easly make burning in actions hopefully...

thanx guys

 

[Lopaka]

Small pieces of black electrical tape will make the red leds disappear.

Bob

 

[plus]

Hello Bob,

with my philips timer (got 3 knobs for 10 seconds, single seconds and fractions of seconds) is not so simple 'cause when you are burning you got to discover black tape to change times and then cover again the knobs... I saw the paterson triple timer but it's a simple clock I guess...not a true enlarger timer!

I need something like this paterson!

massimiliano

 

[Sirius Glass]

Black tape and either aim the timer away from the enlarger OR put a large piece of cardboard between the timer and enlarger OR both.

Steve

 

[thisismyname09]

I've found that the red LEDs don't really effect the paper at all, as long as you're not holding it directly in front of them for minutes at a time.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

I think you will find most timers are safe with color materials as long as you keep them at a distance. A bit of ND filter (any dark bit of plastic would do) over the display will lessen the chances of fog. A cardboard flap, attached with a bit of tape, can flip down to cover the display when needed. Darkroom Automation has supplied timers with an extra switch for dousing safelights or safelights & the timer display.

Darkroom Automation and RH sell timers that go through a sequence of exposures for main/dodge/burn exposures - allowing you to keep the display covered between exposures and removing any need to reset the timer's settings for the dodges and burns. Only RH sells timers in the EU at this time.

 

[fotch]

I have used a Gralab with a hood made out of cardboard. The timer is a couple of feet higher than the easel and with the hood, no glow from the dial effects the paper.

 

[RH Designs]

We use yellow leds on our timers because they are much safer for colour papers - the wavelength of the led light matches the dip in RA4 paper's sensitivity curve. The StopClock has ten steps of memory on each of two channels and will do what you want.

 

[plus]

Hello everybody,

peraphs ilfochrome papers got fogged with much more ease than R4? I saw with interest that 2 great devices both from darkroom automation and rhdesigns. I'm a black 'n white printer and I would like to convert myself to f stop printing also experimenting with splitgrade but in my mind I associate these devices only with b&w (do not know why)...on the contrary I could use them also for ilfochrome printing I guess.

Peraphs i'm going OFF TOPIC but WHICH ONE between these 2 alternatives should I use in your opinion so that I can also avoid fog problems with ilfochrome printing and, at the same time, converting myself to an fstop system with splitgrade capabilities??

1. pyro meter + f stop timer (DA)
2. stopclock professional (splitgrade capabilities) and zone master II (RHDESIGNS)

Pyro meter got no "grey tone preview" (zone master II got it instead) but I could just use a stouffer half a stop steps stripe for every kind of paper to PREvisualize the tones, right?

Help me to find the proper config for me.

all the best,
massimiliano

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

Well, if you are in Italy the choice is easy. Darkroom Automation doesn't sell timers in the EU, so you will have to use an RH timer. DA does sell meters world-wide, and they can be used with any timer - with the exception of an RH timer as the operating principles of the two systems are very different though the goals are the same.

The easiest way to make a grey scale is indeed a step tablet. Grade 2 paper is usually 1/2 a stop per zone and a step tablet should provide a white->black grey strip in 10 steps. Higher grades of paper will only cover 5 steps: black, 3 grey tones and white. With an f-stop timer it is very easy to make a grey scale in, say, 1/5 th of a stop and return you back to the 10 zone scale.

Even if you don't use a meter, or an f-stop timer, a grey scale for your paper is a very useful thing to have. You can use it to compare the tones in a test print to the tones on the grey scale - you can then make a very accurate guess how much exposure adjustment, dodging or burning is needed to go from the tones you have to the tones you want.

Instructions are available at: http://www.darkroomautomation.com/support/zonestrp.htm

 

[plus]

Nic, I saw DA sell in EU too trough digitaltruth...doesn't?

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

Nic, I saw DA sell in EU too trough digitaltruth...doesn't?

Only the meter. The timer only comes in 120VAC/60Hz with US-style power cord and outlets. We don't ship to the EU because of the onerous regulations - it just isn't worth it for a low-volume product. We may revisit the situation in the future, but for now Digital Truth will reject your timer order.

 

[fotch]

..................
The easiest way to make a grey scale is indeed a step tablet. Grade 2 paper is usually 1/2 a stop per zone and a step tablet should provide a white->black grey strip in 10 steps. Higher grades of paper will only cover 5 steps: black, 3 grey tones and white. With an f-stop timer it is very easy to make a grey scale in, say, 1/5 th of a stop and return you back to the 10 zone scale.

Even if you don't use a meter, or an f-stop timer, a grey scale for your paper is a very useful thing to have. You can use it to compare the tones in a test print to the tones on the grey scale - you can then make a very accurate guess how much exposure adjustment, dodging or burning is needed to go from the tones you have to the tones you want.

Instructions are available at: http://www.darkroomautomation.com/support/zonestrp.htm

Thanks, very interesting, can't wait to try it.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

... the [DA meter] can be used with any timer - with the exception of an RH timer as the operating principles of the two systems are very different though the goals are the same ...

Ah, just re-read this. Richard emailed me with some concerns, and he is right in that above statement is a bit misleading.

The DA meter can be used with an RH timer, but you are much, much better off getting the appropriate meter from RH.

The reasons for the poor fit between the two systems are:

DA works in decimal stops, RH works in 1/12ths (or 48ths, or 24ths, or ...). Converting from a DA meter reading of, say, "2.83" stops to the correct number of 1/12th stop key presses isn't anyone's idea of a fun time.

The DA system is set in and displays absolute stops of exposure. The RH system displays seconds that can be adjusted by 1/12ths of a stop.

The DA meter measures light in stops that translate directly to the stops of exposure that are set and shown on the timer. The DA meter display doesn't correspond with any setting or display on an RH timer except by mathematical jigger-pokery.

It is possible to construct a stops table that goes from stops -> seconds, where seconds are rounded to the nearest 1/12th of a stop relative to 15 seconds, and then use the RH timer as a seconds timer. But that defeats the whole purpose of the RH timer.

The two systems approach the same goal from almost diametrically opposed directions. Trying to get them to work together, although possible, would be a waste of time and money. I occasionally get calls from prospects who want to use a DA meter with their RH timer - I advise them to save their pennies and get the appropriate meter from RH. I am inquiring from Richard if he pays a commission...

 

[RH Designs]

Perhaps there's a product opportunity here, a DA-RH interface box. Or at least an iPhone app that does the conversion .

Nicholas is right though inasmuch as we approach the solution from different angles so using a DA product and an RH one together won't be straightforward. But a look-up table to convert the DA meter reading to seconds would work, and you then simply set the RH timer to the nearest exposure time in seconds as you would any other timer.

In answer to Massimiliano's question on Ilfochrome, I printed Ilfochrome for several years with one of our timers and never experienced a fogging problem. Just ensure the paper cannot be exposed directly to the display and set the display brightness to the dimmest setting.

 

[plus]

Thanx Nicholas thanx Richard. your support is always precious.....
richard: so I guess that I should combine stop clock pro plus zone master II if I want to experiment with ease also split grade functions ...otherwise could I use just the analyser pro also for splitgrade functions? Any "HARDWARE" problems with DURST M805 COLOR and DURST LABORATOR 138S (B&W CONDENSER LIGHT) ?

all the best,
massimiliano

 

[RH Designs]

The Analyser Pro is not designed for split-grade printing, it's intended for use with single exposures through a filter. It can however be used to determine burning-in times at a different grade.

The StopClock has two channels and a dedicated split-grade mode. The ZoneMaster (like the Analyser) is intended for single exposures through filters. It would be possible to calibrate a ZoneMaster for use with split exposures but it would be a lot of work and offer no advantage - as a result I've never attempted it!

Unless you want to control local contrast by dodging and burning in the separate hard and soft exposures, split grade offers no advantage over single exposure printing. You can get intermediate grades with split grade, but you can do that with a colour enlarger as well.

All three products will work with both your Durst enlargers.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

This thread, though, is 'enlarger timer for color prints.' It is my understanding that most color printers use a constant print time and vary the aperture to compensate for print size and negative density - resulting in prints made at a constant time and constant light intensity and thus minimizing color shifts. The Ilford EM-10 is designed for this style of exposure control when printing Cibachromes (uh, Ilfochromes...). I was under the impression the same held, relatively, true for RA4 prints.

Is that a fair statement?

 

[plus]

It's mostly my fault, I went OFF TOPIC and then curiosity killed the cat !
I'm sorry Nicholas.

all the best,
massimiliano