Encapsulating a lens in acrylic?

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removed account4

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It might work but what ends up happening is the cube just becomes a filter if that makes sense.. you can experiment with this to see what I mean by putting your lens behind dirty windows, or shoot through a glass of water, sparkling water at different distances from your lens. You won’t really see the stuff you are shooting through but it will diffuse the sharpness and take some of the edge off if that makes sense... my favorite taking filter is either a rainy or dirty window:smile:. Much cheaper than embedding your lens in acrylic:smile:. But maybe not as much fun :smile:
 
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jsmoove

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Yo! Even if its optically clear, lens inside the cube? So technically the sharpest material you could have for a lens would be air?
 

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:smile: i guess ...
what it is it you are trying to do do ? make a substance to shoot through that will make you imperfect images or make some sort of
filter system ( if i can call it that ) that will give you extremely sharp and contrasty images ? i was under the impression it was the former
because as soon as you put anything infront of the lens, even i probably will degrade the image ( unless it is thin, optically perfect glass, like a 400$ schneider B+W Ffilter ... or whatever..
Sorry If I misunderstood what you wanted to do..
 

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It may still function as a lens, but it would not function correctly. Of course the aperture and focusing helicoil would no longer work, as well as any other internal mechanisms. Also, I don't know if any acrylic resin would get inside the lens.

But lets assume we can avoid all of that by using a simple lens, like a magnifying glass. Even then, it wouldn't work correctly because the way a lens works is by the refraction of light as it passes from one medium to another. It's not the material of the lens that causes light to bend and be focused, but the transition between materials. When you coat the outside of the lens in acrylic, you're changing the refraction of the lens. So now the light has to pass through not just air, but acrylic, and that will change how the lens focuses light. For the lens to work properly, it's formula depends on air being the medium outside the glass elements. This is why underwater lenses sometimes won't focus properly on land, because they were designed for water to be the medium they're surrounded by. Now, you could put the lens in a hollow acrylic box, and it would function properly assuming the acrylic walls were of equal thickness throughout. That would work because the refraction of the light rays through the acrylic medium would be consistent no matter where they passed. That's why lens filters don't effect how a lens focuses (other than by filtering out certain wavelengths because no lens can focus all wavelengths simultaneously to the same point, which is what causes chromatic aberration). If you submerged a lens in acrylic resin, the resin would take on the negative shape of the lens and effect it's ability to focus light. It might still focus light to some degree, but it wouldn't focus light the same, and may or may not be usable.
 

bdial

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Simplistically, the focal length of the lens would change if it's not in air. The sharpness of whatever image it could focus would be very dependent on the optical clarity of the acrylic.
 

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So you want to texture one side of a cube to act as a ground glass, and have a lens inside the cube be able to be pointed at something and project an image on the ground glass?

One of the biggest problems you're going to face in making something like this as an effective art piece is probably not going to be getting it to focus, but rather managing your light sources hitting your 'ground glass' so you can actually see anything.

In a plain clear cube your ground glass is going to be washed out from other light sources.

You may have to get creative with how you shade things, possibly with a frame projecting around the 'display' side, and finding ways to block light that hasn't gone through the lens from hitting the ground glass.

Going with a clear acrylic 'doughnut' around the lens, with a black cone projecting out the back of the lens to the ground glass [and an air-void inside the cone so you don't mess with the refractive index of the lens] probably isn't the external look you were aiming for, but it might be the only way to have it project a usable image.
 
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jsmoove

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Hey everyone. Yes, I figured as such, it would have to be hollow inside for it to function correctly. I guess what im after is a printable slide viewer, or a slide viewer that has only one part/element. Instead of putting together lens+viewer+film, I was hoping to have the lens part of the design itself with the ground glass laser etched as an image (not film). Film unfortunately melts in encapsulation apparently. So yeah I guess the design would be this weird donut thing, going from the outside of the lens..
 

AgX

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Yo! Even if its optically clear, lens inside the cube? So technically the sharpest material you could have for a lens would be air?

A lens is (typically) designed to work within air.

Enbedding it within a resin instead creates a whole new optical system, with:
-) acrylic lens elements at back and front
-) acrylic lens elements inside the lens, if the resin creeps in there too.

Thus you would spoil your lens!
 

Ian Grant

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Get two blocks of acrylic and place them either side of a lens and test. While flat blocks would be like thick filter s as soon as yo encapsulate your are forming negative lens elements either side.

Ian
 

AgX

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Even just plane-parallel panes at each end have an optical effect (moving focal point).
 

Jim Jones

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A cube with one face textured to serve as a ground glass can form an image on the ground glass if a convex lens of the right curvature is formed on the opposite face. Don't expect image quality to compare what we are used to. You can experiment with this idea by texturing one face to serve as a ground glass and attach plano-convex lenses to the opposite side with the gap between them filled with oil, water, or some other clear liquid with an index of refraction similar to the cube and lens. The optimum plano-convex lens probably should have a non-spherical curved surface for optimum results.
 

AgX

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A cube with one face textured to serve as a ground glass can form an image on the ground glass if a convex lens of the right curvature is formed on the opposite face.
Quite some early SLR's combined the thick field lens and the ground glass, my grinding the plano side of a plano-convex lens.
 

jim10219

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If focusing on the ground glass is the issue, you could make it further than needed, and then slowly grind it until it's in focus. Of course with a simple lens like a biconvex, you might have issues getting the entire negative into focus, as the lens will have a curved field of focus, and you probably won't want to install an aperture to increase the depth of field.

As far as the film melting goes, you might consider and epoxy resin. Obviously clarity would be an issue, and so would bubbles. I don't know if the epoxy resin would destroy the film, but it or something like it, might be worth a shot if you're so inclined.
 

Nodda Duma

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Back with another question!
Is it possible to embed a lens in an acrylic resin cube on one end, to focus on the opposite plane/other side of the cube?
This is an example:
http://www.spoon-tamago.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/solacube-header-3.jpg
Would the lens still function correctly?

No, for reasons given above

Instead, buy a Fresnel lens with focal length specified at what you want the length of the cube to be. Cast your resin block with the Fresnel on one side, with grooved surface facing out and forming the outer surface of the cube.

Fresnel lenses of focal lengths between 40-80mm are less than $10 on ebay for 2.

Easy peasy.
 
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jsmoove

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Hi all, in my quest to find a single solid solution, I have found:
-optical liquid silicone rubber:
https://www.protolabs.com/resources/blog/optical-liquid-silicone-rubber/
-precision glass molding
3d printed optics in PMMA: http://www.luximprint.com/products/printed-optics/
&
http://glassomer.com/index.php/technology.html

I think one of these options would allow an in-lens design, not sure which one would allow a hollow cube
Or which one is the least costly!

More or less trying to recreate: https://www.acornnaturalists.com/clear-lucite-magnifying-box-small.html
But 10x magnification, and one solid object
 
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Nodda Duma

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You’ll have the opportunity to experience sticker shock with those approaches. :smile:
 

Jim Jones

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Nodda Duma

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That’s cool, Jim. For my 15th wedding anniversary last month, I gave my wife a microphotograph on a necklace in which you can see gushy sayings and stuff.. Basically a Stanhope but I didn’t know what it was called.

Of course at work the modern technology version is called a microdisplay. Gonna toss “Stanhope” around the office so the other engineers are in awe at the obscure terminology
 
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jsmoove

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@Jim Jones Hey Jim, this is exactly what I'm thinking, the modern Stanhope, but a little larger....and one solid object, lens molded into a cube....I'm hoping to focus on the opposing plane, where it could be etched....or depending on print resolution, microprinted as part of the plane.
 
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jsmoove

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Ah......should have read a bit further I guess...
"He used a Coddington or “Brewster” lens to show them off. This was a Plano-convex handheld lens whose focal length was the length of the overall lens, thereby greatly magnifying anything applied to its flat end"
from: https://stanhopemicroworks.blogspot.com/

Can I literally etch an image on a coddington lens? Where would I find a lens that has a focal length that is the overall length of the lens?
 
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jsmoove

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Cool, I asked.
That looks good as it looks like it focuses directly on its plane, but I need something a bit compact....sortof like loupe size I guess would be nice
 
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jsmoove

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Unfortunately they dont carry anything coddington in their supply. Similar to a coddington is the hastings lens apparently, but thats made of 3 lenses.
 
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