E6 Builds Character

CGW · Mar 14, 2012

Who knew shooting all those slides actually made us better photographers?

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/what_slide_film_taught_me.shtml

Mainecoonmaniac · Mar 14, 2012

I think so. Maybe he can be better in the darkroom by printing them in Cibachromes.

amsp · Mar 14, 2012

To me it was just so weird that after all that talk about how E6 is so amazing he ends with.. "In conclusion, I know and accept that for better or worse, I am stuck with digital photography. From a cost and convenience perspective, I cant imagine going back to film of any kind."...wait, what??

Poisson Du Jour · Mar 14, 2012

"Below is a portrait I captured in 2000, shot on Kodachrome 64 slide film using a Leica M6 and a 35 Summicron. The scan does not quite look like the slide, but at least I know what its supposed to look like. The slide is so sharp that you can see the embers in the cigarette clearly with a loupe."

That slide being referenced is just bloody awful, yes, just that even from a Leica! I have seen much more competent images from an Olympus XA and Epson V700 scan that do show every detail faithfully. Not much credibility to the rant about digital other than to add that he jumped over too hastily without taking slides to the max. He learnt nothing at all. The final statement is the leave-page cue: lazy, incompetent and prejudiced.

EASmithV · Mar 14, 2012

Digital is for those who enjoy corrupted, unusable digital files in 2025.

I know for a fact that I will be enjoying the advances in scanning technology in 2025.

wblynch · Mar 14, 2012

Aw. I missed the joke. First post gone. poof!

David Brown · Mar 15, 2012

CGW said:
Who knew shooting all those slides actually made us better photographers?

Some of us knew this decades ago. I'm so glad that someone who "started pursuing photography as a serious hobby in 1999" is around to remind us ...

benjiboy · Mar 15, 2012

benjiboy said:
.

I didn't " take up photography seriously in 1999", but in 1952 , one way that shooting slides has improved my photography over the years is it's taught me to precisely frame my shots, be exact in my metering, and calculating the exposure.

Mainecoonmaniac · Mar 15, 2012

All those unskilled cowards like me bracketed

E. von Hoegh · Mar 15, 2012

David Brown said:
Some of us knew this decades ago. I'm so glad that someone who "started pursuing photography as a serious hobby in 1999" is around to remind us ...

In 1999, I had been using (not "shooting") slide film for 28 years. In 1971, I was getting about 30-35 keepers per roll, not 4 or 5. What I learned from slide film was how to meter properly when exposing it and how to control temperature when processing it.:confused:

pstake · Mar 15, 2012

CGW said:
Who knew shooting all those slides actually made us better photographers?

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/what_slide_film_taught_me.shtml

Yes slides are a hard master, a good teacher. And still give better images than any DSLR, etc., that I have seen.

amsp · Mar 15, 2012

I used to frequent Luminous Landscape a lot before realizing it's populated 99% by pixel peepers and gear masturbaters. The editorial contributors are very similar being mostly self proclaimed experts, weekend warriors with high paying day jobs like lawyers, doctors and engineers who spend obscene amounts of money on equipment and then bury themselves in the technical stuff to make up for the lack of any kind of aesthetic sense. I'm so happy I found APUG, it's like a breath of fresh air in the putrid stench that are internet forums.

E. von Hoegh · Mar 15, 2012

amsp said:
I used to frequent Luminous Landscape a lot before realizing it's populated 99% by pixel peepers and gear masturbaters. The editorial contributors are very similar being mostly self proclaimed experts, weekend warriors with high paying day jobs like lawyers, doctors and engineers who spend obscene amounts of money on equipment and then bury themselves in the technical stuff to make up for the lack of any kind of aesthetic sense. I'm so happy I found APUG, it's like a breath of fresh air in the putrid stench that are internet forums.

True. But, LL can be very amusing at times.

wblynch · Mar 15, 2012

I read the story in the link.

Sad that the writer never projected any of those thousands of slides. He threw away 80% of his slides and he never knew if the best might have gone in the bin because he didn't project them.

I am only a hack but I know that my best photos are not always the most technically perfect.

I also know that slides were meant to be projected. When people talk about the narrow latitude of slides or the over saturation of the colors they are forgetting the projection light will balance all that out.

Sometimes I think a copy photo taken off the projection screen is a better representation of a slide than a direct scan.

We are still a long. long way off before digital media can match the beauty and 3D look of projected slides.

Steve Smith · Mar 15, 2012

amsp said:
To me it was just so weird that after all that talk about how E6 is so amazing he ends with.. "In conclusion, I know and accept that for better or worse, I am stuck with digital photography. From a cost and convenience perspective, I cant imagine going back to film of any kind."...wait, what??

Yes, it always seems to come down to a triumph for convenience over quality.

amsp said:
high paying day jobs like lawyers, doctors and engineers

Engineers are highly paid? When did that happen?

Steve.

LJSLATER · Mar 15, 2012

amsp said:
I used to frequent Luminous Landscape a lot before realizing it's populated 99% by pixel peepers and gear masturbaters. The editorial contributors are very similar being mostly self proclaimed experts, weekend warriors with high paying day jobs like lawyers, doctors and engineers who spend obscene amounts of money on equipment and then bury themselves in the technical stuff to make up for the lack of any kind of aesthetic sense. I'm so happy I found APUG, it's like a breath of fresh air in the putrid stench that are internet forums.

Amen, brother.

Luminous Landscape used to be one of my daily hits, but I've chosen a path different from Mr. Reichmann & Co.

Consider also this article featured recently:

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/the_making_of_sugarloaf_rock.shtml

amsp · Mar 15, 2012

LJSLATER said:
Amen, brother.

Luminous Landscape used to be one of my daily hits, but I've chosen a path different from Mr. Reichmann & Co.

Consider also this article featured recently:

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/the_making_of_sugarloaf_rock.shtml

I kinda like the result for what it is, a matte painting

Mainecoonmaniac · Mar 15, 2012

Yikes! The image was shot on a medium format camera and a $20K Phase One digital back. Gear masturbators got some bucks.

http://www.calumetphoto.com/eng/product/phase_one_p45_digital_back_for_hasselblad_v_classic/pe71336

CGW · Mar 15, 2012

wblynch said:
I read the story in the link.

Sad that the writer never projected any of those thousands of slides. He threw away 80% of his slides and he never knew if the best might have gone in the bin because he didn't project them.

I am only a hack but I know that my best photos are not always the most technically perfect.

I also know that slides were meant to be projected. When people talk about the narrow latitude of slides or the over saturation of the colors they are forgetting the projection light will balance all that out.

Sometimes I think a copy photo taken off the projection screen is a better representation of a slide than a direct scan.

We are still a long. long way off before digital media can match the beauty and 3D look of projected slides.

Some years back, friends got Pro Cabin and Kindermann projectors for very few $. Had a pile of unmounted Scala and later larger piles E100GX and Velvia 6x6 and 6x7. A couple times annually with food and booze, we have a "Jurassic" night and invite a few strays from the digital side over to gawk and gasp. Fun!

Poisson Du Jour · Mar 15, 2012

I do not give much credibility to Luminous Landscape, especially third-party written articles like the one at the crux of this discussion. In many places there is evidence of plagiarism and similarity to what another photographer has said, that being Ken Rockwell. Of the two, KR has some useful, well-founded information. The visit to LL earlier this week was probably my first in about 4 years. As for the writer taking up slides from 1999, well, I wonder how it strikes him that photographers around the world have been using slide film since Nelson lost an eye? I don't go back as far as some on APUG, but I started in 1978 with Kodachrome and continued that for 10 years before shifting to Fuji, which I still use. We should be grateful for being members of a skilled, switched-on, experienced and knowledgeable community that is APUG: many people do look to those with lots of experience for advice and they have made a wise choice in light of the terrible mash of heresy and bullshit that propagates digital-weighted photographic forums. That's my Friday Rage and Rant. Now I'll have my brekky!

CGW · Mar 15, 2012

LJSLATER said:
Amen, brother.

Luminous Landscape used to be one of my daily hits, but I've chosen a path different from Mr. Reichmann & Co.

Consider also this article featured recently:

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/the_making_of_sugarloaf_rock.shtml

He's very hard to take these days--smug, self-important, and just as aesthetically challenged as ever. He used to get flamed 5-8 years ago as shill for Canon since he enjoyed what appeared to be a very privileged relationship with them. The site's still worth a look for its reviews of new toys. Happy that his sample resolution shots now seem to be a bit more diverse than the satellite dishes atop the CBC building in downtown Toronto. I was starting to recognize the pigeons!

vpwphoto · Mar 15, 2012

Bracketing News photos....not!

Mainecoonmaniac said:
All those unskilled cowards like me bracketed

No bracketing when you used Ektachrome for Photojournalism.

benjiboy · Mar 15, 2012

Steve Smith said:
Yes, it always seems to come down to a triumph for convenience over quality.

Engineers are highly paid? When did that happen?

Steve.

Not when I was an engineer either I can assure you Steve.

keithwms · Mar 15, 2012

benjiboy said:
Not when I was an engineer either I can assure you Steve.

Engineers (and scientists) are now in ever higher demand and are thus commanding higher salaries than ever before. In the US and many other western countries, there has been a big drop in the number of STEM students (STEM= sci, tech, engr, & math) and that is now catching up to us. Suddenly a lot of our technical talent has to be imported from abroad and, lo and behold, the big innovations are coming from abroad too. We're just beginning to see the tip of the iceberg right now, but the projections are already pretty clear: we're going to have a massive domestic shortage of young people with technical skills. And to add insult to injury, we've also got a mountain of student loan debt and students who can't get jobs. So there is a big disconnect between the kind of capabilities that the workplace needs, and the kind of capabilities that colleges and universities nurture.

If this issue interests you, let me refer you to a graphic which presents the stats very clearly:

http://wraltechwire.com/business/tech_wire/biotech/image/8430736/?ref_id=8430665

People like me (with one foot in academia and one foot in the "real world") are desperately trying to convince leaders of the magnitude of this problem. The situation is really dire and sets us up for a period of technological stagnation (as eloquently described by Tyler Cowen in his nice little book, The Great Stagnation).

Okay, I will now step back from the lectern / pulpit, sorry

~~~

Yes, the E6 process is very demanding and it requires very good metering and knowledge of light.

pstake · Mar 15, 2012

Hear, hear. Good, if somewhat meandering, post. Interesting graphic on the link. Important for people of my generation (i'm 31), especially.

E6 Builds Character

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency