Dry Mount press price?

Discussion in 'Darkroom Equipment' started by jhochstoeger, Dec 9, 2013.

  1. jhochstoeger

    jhochstoeger Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2008
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Dear all,

    a photographer who is about to retire made me an offer to buy his dry mount press:

    Seal 3444H, 70x100cm (30x40inch), in good condition, I guess about 20 or 25 years old. some mounting tissue included. He asks 950€/1300$ for it. I find that a bit steep. We are in rural Germany, there is very little demand for such a thing (although i want it very much)...my estaimate were about 300€/500$...what to you think about the price?

    Thanks for your info,
    Best,
    JH
     
  2. pdeeh

    pdeeh Member

    Messages:
    4,645
    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2012
    Location:
    UK
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    It is only worth what you are happy & willing to pay.
    To another person it might be worth €950.
     
  3. jp498

    jp498 Member

    Messages:
    1,463
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2009
    Location:
    Owls Head ME
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I bought a 16x20 inch one for $100 a year or two ago, so your price of $500 would be close to proportional and reasonable. Look at closed auctions on ebay to see how well something doesn't sell, especially something difficult to ship.
     
  4. David Allen

    David Allen Member

    Messages:
    812
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2008
    Location:
    Berlin
    Shooter:
    Med. Format RF
    I think that it is too expensive. Although a new one from Monochrom will cost 3.000€, when they come up on eBay they go for around 3-500€ and are always buyer collects. That means that if he were to action it, the only potential buyers would be from your region.

    Bests,

    David
    www.dsallen.de
     
  5. andreios

    andreios Member

    Messages:
    350
    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2010
    Location:
    Prague, e.g.
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    One thing is that they are not very common in Europe. However, it does seem a bit too much. I paid around 200€ for the smaller model a year ago - and that was including international freight (within EU).
     
  6. OP
    OP
    jhochstoeger

    jhochstoeger Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2008
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Thanks guys for the helpful replys! that will help in my negotiating!
     
  7. ~andi

    ~andi Subscriber

    Messages:
    170
    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2011
    Location:
    here
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I was offered a Vaccu Seal for around 350 Euros including pump and base frame last year. But it was heavily used. I picked up a lightly used 500T in good condition for around 400 Euros this summer. I too think 950 is too much unless it's in rather excellent condition. However those VaccuSeals are usually heavily used because they tend to stand in BAUHAUS stores or professional framers shops. In the end, it's what you are willing to pay.
     
  8. fotch

    fotch Member

    Messages:
    4,806
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2005
    Location:
    SE WI- USA
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Offer what it is worth to you and not a penny more.
     
  9. Mark_S

    Mark_S Subscriber

    Messages:
    547
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Location:
    Tacoma, WA
    Shooter:
    4x5 Format
    Dry mount presses are tricky to figure on a value. New they are crazy-expensive. They are big and heavy, and therefore difficult to ship which means that when selling a used one, it is best if you can find a local buyer.

    I have a Seal 500T (36" x 24") which I got from a commercial framing shop. I paid $400 for it, about 6 years ago.


    The 3444 is a vacuum press - as opposed to mine which uses mechanical pressure - it may be that the vacuum press is less weight and easier to move? This might increase the value of the press.

    Bottom line - if there is nobody else who is interested in buying it, then 300€ is probably a good deal for the seller, but if there is, 950€ is probably not so bad of a deal for you.......
     
  10. paul ron

    paul ron Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,376
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2004
    Location:
    NYC
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Since you are so rural.... Because they are so heavy no one wants to ship it.. Too expensive. so they hardly ever sell fast n sell cheap... As a come pick it up item. Is this a local sale?... Bargain it down for the amt saved in shipping a 150 pound cast iron machine.

    In big cities, it sells as fast as it hits the advertsement page so competition brings the price up.
     
  11. OP
    OP
    jhochstoeger

    jhochstoeger Member

    Messages:
    8
    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2008
    Shooter:
    35mm
    As he listed it for sale the second time now, I guess there are not a lot of people asking for it.

    I gave him my offer, now it is his turn...
     
  12. Hilo

    Hilo Subscriber

    Messages:
    425
    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2011
    Shooter:
    35mm
    I bought a Seal 210 (almost 50X60cm and then you can press larger than that in parts) this year in Germany and paid 400 euros. Which I thought was steep, but I did think (and still do) it was worth it. Compared to the older Büscher it heats up quicker, and it is easier as it switches on and off automatically at the set temperatures. (btw the Büschers are very good too)

    Then, also this year, I found a Seal 500T (again in Germany) and pointed a friend to it, who paid around 400 euros too. I think that is around the same size as what you are talking about.

    The vacuum model I have never seen, to be honest I am not sure if it would work as well as the mechanical presses. It would be nice to have some opinions from people who have experience with them. I only use these presses to flatten fiber prints . . .
     
  13. c41

    c41 Subscriber

    Messages:
    115
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2016
    Location:
    Here
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    I'm resurrecting an old thread rather than start a new one since my question is kind of the same - how much/where from?

    I'm at that point with printing that I now have drawers filled with ever so slightly wavy fiber prints. It's been nice to send people homemade postcards but I'd like to set about the task of learning how to mount and present my prints as the final step on what's already been a long journey.

    Dry Mount presses are seemingly rarer than hen's teeth here in Australia. I've been monitoring every source I can think of but haven't seen a single one available until this very old (antique) looking one just appeared on our version of Craigslist:
    https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/prospect/miscellaneous-goods/photo-dry-mounting-press/1151748539

    I'd rather buy once and buy right than go through iterations of what I need. I'm only printing up to 8x10s currently (can't see the point in having larger/wavier prints with nowhere to really put them.)
    I can imagine down the track I'd go a little larger, but my current 4-blade easel is 11x14 so then I'd be into another easel or MacGyver solution to that issue.

    Can anyone recommend a good press to get me going that would ship here, or do you think the linked one is worth the trouble? Thanks.
     
  14. Rafal Lukawiecki

    Rafal Lukawiecki Subscriber

    Messages:
    809
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2006
    Location:
    Co. Wicklow,
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    This is a personal opinion based on the 3 presses that I have owned over the last 8 years: Bogen/Technal 560, Seal Masterpiece 210 and now a Bienfang Masterpiece 550. A smaller one will do 8x10 mounted to, say, 16x20 paper, but as you are likely to need a larger size in the future, you may want to get the biggest one that you can afford, and that you have the space for, as they will last and they are not easy to find second hand. My friend, a respected photographer Alan Ross, has recently replaced his Seal 510, which gave him some 40 years of use. He expects the same from his new one.

    You can still buy a new Seal Masterpiece, under its new brand name DK, from B&H in US and direct from the distributor in UK/Ireland. 250 will set you back some USD 2-3k and 550 double that, depending on voltage requirements (110V are cheaper). Second-hand they come up more often in US and rather rarely in Europe, maybe 1-2 a year. Sometimes they are called Bienfang, the middle of the three brands it had carried that I am familiar with. When I got my 550 a few months ago I let my 210 go to a friend who trades photo equipment, I can connect you with him in case he has seen others around. Shipping will be expensive, though. The machine alone is some 30-35kg for the 200 range, and about 95kg for 550. Crated for shipping, the 550 is 125kg.

    Bear in mind that you will also need to get to know it, and practice a bit, before it sings, using a tissue that is still designed for a mechanical press (as opposed to vacuum), so go for DK Colormount and not Unimount, for example.

    Good luck finding one. Once you have mounted your first print the joy of that perfect presentation will exhilarate.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
  15. c41

    c41 Subscriber

    Messages:
    115
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2016
    Location:
    Here
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Thank you for such a comprehensive answer, awesome. I'll take a little time to do some more investigation on some of the models you've suggested.
    I will definitely get hit by shopping costs, whatever option I pursue, 125kg!!!
     
  16. Nige

    Nige Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,181
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2002
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    yep, this somewhat sums it up. I recently got an even older one for $50 (came from a deceased estate) as my existing one tripped the house circuit breaker and I haven't had it looked at yet.

    I'd grab that one if it heats up and keep a look out for a bigger more modern one (which may never eventuate!)
     
  17. mrosenlof

    mrosenlof Subscriber

    Messages:
    125
    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2010
    Location:
    Colorado
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    37x30cm would cover 11x14 inches wouldn,t it? If it works properly it sounds like a decent product. I Have a seal 210 which is way overkill for my 8x10 prints. I haven,t printed bigger in years and could use the counter space if I had a smaller press.
     
  18. c41

    c41 Subscriber

    Messages:
    115
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2016
    Location:
    Here
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Thanks. I've contacted a courier company to see what it might cost to ship - the seller says it's 60kg and 'takes two to lift' so it might be prohibitive even for this.
    The models suggested above on B&H look great but I'm going to be in for $1000's to buy one, get it over here and wear the import duty as well.
    That'll have to be the long term plan. For now I'll see if I can get my hands on this one to experiment.
    I've certainly managed to compile a good selection of not quite presentable prints (fingerprints, sloppy borders etc.) I can practice on.
     
  19. c41

    c41 Subscriber

    Messages:
    115
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2016
    Location:
    Here
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Got a courier quote, one I could live with, then went back to the seller and... they told me it's too much hassle, might as well sell it for scrap metal etc. Damn!

    At least now I have a much firmer idea on just how painful the cost for a new one will be.

    Anyone in Adelaide should jump on that one before it does end up as scrap.
     
  20. Luis-F-S

    Luis-F-S Subscriber

    Messages:
    502
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2013
    Location:
    Madisonville
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    I'd look for one in Australia, they do come up but you have to be patient. In the states, they run from around $400 for a junker one and up. I bought a mint one for $800 shipped, though that was on the high side.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2017
  21. c41

    c41 Subscriber

    Messages:
    115
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2016
    Location:
    Here
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Thanks Luis. I will keep watching and waiting and hoping whilst saving for a new one.

    This is the first one I have seen in a year of watching and it's still 850 miles away, so I think a new Seal one might eventually come first.

    It's frustrating to be so close to what feels like the final piece of the puzzle.
     
  22. Puggsy

    Puggsy Member

    Messages:
    5
    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2017
    Location:
    Queensland
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Just happened upon this thread from c41. Me just newly registered with APUG.
    I have a Seal Jumbo 150 press and would be prepared to part with. Has not been used for several years.
    c41 Not sure where you are in Oz. I am 400k from Brisbane and visit there occasionally.
    Contact me if curious.
    Cheers
     
  23. c41

    c41 Subscriber

    Messages:
    115
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2016
    Location:
    Here
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Thanks. Sent you a message and great first post on APUG btw!