DR5 getting published?
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This is great news! As somebody who does reversal processing fairly regularly at home, I will look forward to get full detail of the famous DR5 process.
So, I suppose he's retiring, right?
It still wasn't clear to me from what the video announcer said why there are releasing the process The DR5 process which was exclusive to DR5 appears to be continuing so why release it to the general public now or in fact is it being discontinued and if so why?
Thanks
pentaxuser
Thanks
pentaxuser
I've wondered why it is being released. Unless DR5 is shutting down, then the only reason to release the info is hint as to why his results with so many films are so good. His results are excellent. I have had film developed at DR5 before. He suggests that his process is very complex and perhaps isn't too worried that anyone will pick up the process to compete with him. It's one thing to have the recipe for a souffle and another thing to bake and excellent one. Therefore, again why release? To justify price or sway potential customers from home (and perhaps inferior) kits. A complete wild-ass-guess on my part.
Possibly in order to copyright/ patent it for some reason? I think most of the competing patents have now expired - there are only so many ways to reversal process BW film successfully.
One would spoil ones patent application if before one publishes the content.
if you follow the instagram link in the OP, and read the little blurb along side the photo you see that...
1) they're putting the dr5 process in the public domain and
2) they're "closing down the service" - which sounds like calling it quits to me.
1) they're putting the dr5 process in the public domain and
2) they're "closing down the service" - which sounds like calling it quits to me.
That is too bad, it is wonderful service.
They are not closing down, they're currently moving to a new place.
You had me worried a bit.
+100
Depends on what kind of person he is. It's possible he's reached a point where he's had his fun, and wants to see what, if anything, other people can do with his process.
Initially, I was thinking that he was just releasing it to the public domain...but, I think perhaps, you're correct. He may very well be filing for a patent.
Why else the suspense? Patents take time...just opening up to the public do not.
If it is, I just hope it's not going to be used to try and interfere with the various European made reversal processes. I note that the main patent that discloses the Agfa Scala first developer seems to have expired in 2018.
Something tells me that it's probably not as mysterious a formula as everyone wants to believe - possibly only with certain steps either separated or in a different order. From another thread it was reported that Ron Mowrey felt that some of the steps were (I recall) somewhat back to front to how they'd normally be done. I suspect that it likely relates to the usage of silver solvents and/ or their impact on claimed Dmax.
A lot of the problems people seem to have with reversal processing is the expectation that it can mysteriously do things that are physically impossible. Unlike neg/ pos which can absorb a degree of fog (and indeed some of the more modern film developers were designed on the basis that the right level of solvency, coupled to specifically placed iodide in the emulsion, delivered finer, sharper grain - and that a slightly higher resultant B+F was much less of an issue), reversal processing is going to be very much more sensitive to any age related/ poor storage caused base fog etc. In other words, people are placing far too high an expectation on finding a mythical process that solves their inattentiveness to film storage, process controls etc.
I think there is a business opportunity there if someone wanted to seize it. I used the DR5 service a couple of times over the years, but there were delays, they were shut down at times, pricing for scans was really high. If someone created a good customer service experience, I would pay a fair amount for it.
I don't see how that would be possible*. Surely anybody currently operating according to the process and apparatus described in a prior patent, even if expired, has a very legitimate claim to prior art.
*disclaimer: I am not a lawyer and although I have a passing knowledge of US patent law, I claim no knowledge at all of European laws
Assuming he is filing for a patent for DR5 would this grant protection to prevent any one else such as ADOX from selling its forthcoming kit in(a) the U.S. and/or (b) the rest of the world?
Clearly if it is going to be filed as a patent and it even gives protection to prevent other kits from being sold in the U.S. this is serious.
Another question if I may. Presumably filing for a patent involves that patent being put into the public domain. So is the patent only available for public consumption once it is protected or does the patent seeker, in this case the company who uses the DR5, have to make the process available via the Patent office while a decision is reached on whether to grant the patent or not and thus the DR5 runs the risk anyway that if it is not granted patent then others who were not sure of how it is done can then know everything?
If that is the risk that has to be run then is the owner simply making a virtue out of a necessity of having to disclose it in advance anyway by revealing that it will publish details of the process.
I'd have thought that if it is filing for a patent and that is the only reason to make the process available then if the patent is granted and no-one can then use it, the apparent generosity of the publishing announcement then rings very hollow indeed
pentaxuser
Clearly if it is going to be filed as a patent and it even gives protection to prevent other kits from being sold in the U.S. this is serious.
Another question if I may. Presumably filing for a patent involves that patent being put into the public domain. So is the patent only available for public consumption once it is protected or does the patent seeker, in this case the company who uses the DR5, have to make the process available via the Patent office while a decision is reached on whether to grant the patent or not and thus the DR5 runs the risk anyway that if it is not granted patent then others who were not sure of how it is done can then know everything?
If that is the risk that has to be run then is the owner simply making a virtue out of a necessity of having to disclose it in advance anyway by revealing that it will publish details of the process.
I'd have thought that if it is filing for a patent and that is the only reason to make the process available then if the patent is granted and no-one can then use it, the apparent generosity of the publishing announcement then rings very hollow indeed
pentaxuser
Europe generally has much tougher restrictions against patent trolling - and I'd agree that the large amount of prior art probably would make patenting any BW reversal process very difficult.
The whole point and purpose of a patent is to place a method and apparatus into the public domain - for the common good. The information disclosed is generally speaking, open to the public immediately.
One very important aspect of holding a patent is that one must protect it vigorously (think lawyers and enormous costs). If the patent holder fails to protect the patent then any privileges to monopoly for example are essentially forfeit. It takes considerable time and money to defend a patent.
Unless dr5 chrome have a corporate partner with deep pockets, I really don't think there is any reason for concern with regard to an assumed dr5 patent (if that is even what is contemplated) having any effect what-so-ever on existing processes and materials.
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