Does termite fumigation fog or damage photographic paper or film?

[Sirius Glass]

Sirius - Termites are easy to prevent in new construction, even the aggressive kind now moving up the coast from SoCal to mid-Cal areas like Monterey due to warming climate. Things like wooden studs can either be pre-treated at higher expense in advance, or treated with nontoxic borate solution during construction. The underlying soil can also be treated. Local building codes apply regardless; but those are almost routinely violated and bribed away in many inland tract developments anyway, where long-term integrity of a building is very low on their priorities. In the past, places especially susceptible to termites, like Santa Barbara, once required old growth redwood framing due to its inherent resistance to bugs and dryrot; but now that's impossible because nearly all of it was cut down long ago.

And what amazes me about SoCal building codes, versus here on the NorCal coast, they allow substandard "whitewoods" like hemlock as framing, versus the Douglas fir mandated here, assuming of course the materials have been legally rated and sold, and not just arbitrarily sold under unofficial retail categories like the big box outlets use. It's all supposed to be checked for legitimacy by inspectors anyway, if they themselves happen to be competent and honest. Now engineered framing materials are beginning to take over, which have certain advantages in dimensional stability, strength, and linearity, but are still relatively expensive.

A fascinating exception to the lax LA standards is in Beverly Hills, where everyone is so rich and conscious of high property values that they are able to maintain a strictly run building inspection department. One of my former assistants became an Inspector there, and kinda became a hero to us when the little guy was given enough official clout to successfully shut down a massive shoddy illegal remodel in one of the alternate homes of a particularly famous individual (I won't say who, but it just might be coincidental with the most controversial name pervading the Soap Box portion of the forum; but I never go there, so can't say for sure). All the neighbors were certainly happy about that too. A fun anecdote, at least. Wish my own city had a clean inspection department; but it's 50/50. I lucked out with a good one when my darkroom was built and formally inspected - someone interested in building one for himself.

I am aware of the wood treatment, but builders do not do it. Also they use fir which the termites greatly prefer rather than some other wood that they do not like so much.

 

[Sirius Glass]

If the contractor gives you approved bags why not just use them??

I am using them, but I still have a concern about the film and paper which I cannot move out.

 

[Paul Howell]

I would use bags, then store the bags provided by the contractor, then put in a large in a Coleman cooler, maybe a couple of them, with latches, then tape shut, couple of layers of tape. Or use RV black silicone sealant to seal shut then tape over the seam with tape, even if some fumes get though layer after layer ought keep paper and film safe. Not very ethical, I've know people who have bought gear needed for a few days then returned it.

 

[Paul Howell]

One of my cats jumped on the keyboard before I edited.

I would use bags provided by the contractor, then put in a large Coleman cooler, maybe a couple of them, with latches, then tape shut, couple of layers of tape. Or use RV black silicone sealant to seal the seam followed by tape over the seam, even some fumes get though layer after layer ought keep paper and film safe. Not very ethical, I've know people who have bought gear needed for a few days then returned it.

 

[grat]

Here's another paper which suggests you'll be OK:

https://allstarce.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Structural-Fumigation.pdf

They point out that this compound has frequently been used in museums, libraries, archives, and research facilities.

Page 6:

General Use: Sulfuryl fluoride is odorless, colorless, non-flammable, non-reactive, and noncorrosive at temperatures normally encountered in structural and other fumigations. As a result, it can be used to fumigate photographic supplies, metals, paper, leather rubbers, plastics, cloths, wallpapers, household furnishings, and a variety of other articles.

 

[grat]

Here's a useful warning, however:

Will Vikane harm my photographs?
No. Vikane has been used to fumigate commercial photographic establishments containing films and photographic papers. A brown cast has been seen on color prints developed with exposed solutions. No problems have occurred with photographic paper or plates.

If you have professional photographic materials, we recommend placing developing materials and fixing solutions in sealed bottles or creating new solutions after the fumigation. Do not leave developing materials in open trays.

(From "LD Termite" website, Santa Maria CA)

 

[Sirius Glass]

Here's another paper which suggests you'll be OK:

https://allstarce.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Structural-Fumigation.pdf

They point out that this compound has frequently been used in museums, libraries, archives, and research facilities.

Page 6:

Here's a useful warning, however:


(From "LD Termite" website, Santa Maria CA)

Thank you!

 

[Donald Qualls]

Here's a useful warning, however:


(From "LD Termite" website, Santa Maria CA)

Agreed, that's actually useful, tested knowledge. If you have color chemistry, you can probably store the color developer(s) for a few days in your car (or take it with you to the presumed hotel you'll stay at). Everything else should be okay in the fumigator provided bags.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Paul, the outgassing of the silicone caulk would itself be an issue, except for a very expensive type not available in stores. But you're speaking hypothetically anyway. One should be fine with sealed polyethylene bags by themselves (but not vinyl).

And Donald - why would darkroom chemicals ever be in anything but an airtight chemically-inert bottles to begin with?

 

[DREW WILEY]

Sirius - builders do anything they are paid and contracted to do. People acknowledge that now is the time to build more pest and fire resist structures, and more energy efficient and earthquake-resistant too, but everyone also wants or needs more affordable fast-built housing. You can't have both! That's the dilemma.

 

[BrianShaw]

Drew… the guidance I read, and perhaps what Donald is citing, referenced fumigation of commercial film processing labs.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Commercial labs once fumigated their workers on a routine basis, with their own kinds of chemical fumes. So poetic justice, maybe. Heat tenting is now catching on instead of fumigation tents. But given the lax attitude of the outfit that did it to a house across the street a couple months ago, and all the expansion/contraction stress repairing needed afterwards, I'd think twice before doing that to any structure of my own. Heat tenting is not realistic for large structures like apartment buildings either.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Paul, the outgassing of the silicone caulk would itself be an issue, except for a very expensive type not available in stores. But you're speaking hypothetically anyway. One should be fine with sealed polyethylene bags by themselves (but not vinyl).

And Donald - why would darkroom chemicals ever be in anything but an airtight chemically-inert bottles to begin with?

Donald does have a point. The fumigation company repeatedly pointed out that any factory sealed container is safe in itself, except wine bottles, and that any container once opened must be either removed from the building or double wrapped in special supplied bags with the openings of the inner bag be twisted, folded over, twisted again and sealed with masking tape and then the openings of the outer bag be twisted, folded over, twisted again and sealed with masking tape.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Well, ordinary masking tape is quite permeable, so it must not be that big a deal. Any serious tape would have to be polyethylene based itself, as well as designed to stick on poly reliably, and there are such things. But bags can simply be knotted at the top, and that reinforced with a wire twist tie or plastic zip tie. This is easy stuff to figure out. Why make a mountain out of a molehill ? If one has a major art collection, well, it might make better sense to temporarily relocate that.

Home darkrooms aren't like commercial labs of the past, which might have had hundred of gallons of already mixed and replenished solutions in their developing machinery. The relatively small quantities we use don't cost much in time and money to remix, are mostly stored in bottles anyway; and I use all of my own one-shot anyway, once diluted from the bottles to working strength. No big deal. Doesn't mean I want a visit from a fumigator, however. Got pets to think of too.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Well, ordinary masking tape is quite permeable, so it must not be that big a deal. Any serious tape would have to be polyethylene based itself, as well as designed to stick on poly reliably, and there are such things. But bags can simply be knotted at the top, and that reinforced with a wire twist tie or plastic zip tie. This is easy stuff to figure out. Why make a mountain out of a molehill ? If one has a major art collection, well, it might make better sense to temporarily relocate that.

Home darkrooms aren't like commercial labs of the past, which might have had hundred of gallons of already mixed and replenished solutions in their developing machinery. The relatively small quantities we use don't cost much in time and money to remix, are mostly stored in bottles anyway; and I use all of my own one-shot anyway, once diluted from the bottles to working strength. No big deal. Doesn't mean I want a visit from a fumigator, however. Got pets to think of too.

Specifically painters tape, wire twist ties or plastic zip ties are prohibited and they will inspect every bag inside and outside the refrigerator and freezer. This is directed by the state health department.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I said knotted off first (airtight). Red poly "Builder's Tape" will do after that; but is quite thin, so must sometimes be doubled up. The real deal high end 3M product is an extremely expensive tape hard to find. Can't imagine they hand out that. My idea of exterminating is a good shoe thump on the lil' critter. Fortunately, the infamous Formosa termite has not traveled this far north yet, and is not likely to in my neighborhood at all, which is very cool most of the year due to coastal fog and wind. But damp wood little black termites do invade wood around here already weakened by dry rot. They sure gave a neighbor hell with his old wooden foundation plates, built prior to modern standards. Presumably, they're all edible and a good source of protein. Somebody else can experiment with that theory if they wish. Thousands of pangolins and anteaters can't be wrong.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Each owner/resident is responsible for supplying the tape. They recommend masking tape. I am also thinking about Gaffers' Tape as a choice.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Gaffers tape bonds poorly to polyethylene, and is designed to be removable, just like painters tape. Gorilla tape is a more aggressive better option, though not permanent either. "They" recommending masking tape certainly doesn't inspire confidence in their competence. And I do know a thing or two about masking tape. We ordered a wide variety of it in multiple pallet loads at a time, directly from 3M; we had a direct industrial account. Having been in the building and contractor supply trade for forty years, both "termite contractors" and exterminators were particular infamous for sheer incompetence. There were obviously a few commendable exceptions, but I'm of the opinion that most of them used more of their preservatives to get drunk on than they applied to the job itself - speaking cynically of course.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I think in their spare time, they sniff their own products to get high.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Sniffing was more characteristic of people dealing with old school auto paints or furniture lacquers. They got addicted to toluene. At one point we were hiring people with auto paint matching backgrounds because they were so skilled with color, but that backfired because, working with hot solvent pigment systems in poorly ventilated spaces, rather than water-based, it's like they were sniffing glue the whole time. Could be mellow one moment, and then, right out of the blue, punch the boss in the nose without even knowing why. One went home at the end of the day in good humor and stabbed his own brother at the dinner table without even realizing he did it. The heck with that! Good thing the predominant auto paints have now themselves evolved, and true lacquers have now been outright banned from cabinet shop applications due to sheer flammability, though ironically, they can still be sold retail to completely incompetent amateurs.

 

[Donald Qualls]

And Donald - why would darkroom chemicals ever be in anything but an airtight chemically-inert bottles to begin with?

And don't we have more than one long thread on how permeable some of our common "airtight" chemical storage bottles are?

 

[DREW WILEY]

If they are permeable, one is using junk bottles or recycled food and drink containers perhaps. I already mentioned that. Any real lab supply house can supply the real deal, along with hard specifications. And traditional amber glass bottles are excellent for long term use if specified caps are used. Anyone who even took a high school chemistry class knows that. My mere mention of "airtight" specifically qualified my statement. And thin recycled plastic camera store bottle are NOT that; nor are "accordion" bottles that allow you squeeze out excess air inside, but are too thin and cheap to prevent oxygen permeation. Those kinds of things are OK for short term storage of dilute stop bath and common fixer, but not much else.

 

[subminijami]

You should follow the instructions by the company doing the work, we did and had zero problems. If you use expired, frozen, film and paper they are worthless in the eyes of insurance companies you will not get reimbursed one cent for them. There is no way you will be able to prove that it was the fumigation and not cosmic radiation that fogged them. Perhaps you should find a moving and storage company and move everything to an offsite location.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I finished packing up the food, film and paper yesterday and turned in the keys. Now I have to check on the plants daily and undo everything on Monday.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Got my fingers crossed for you.