Does termite fumigation fog or damage photographic paper or film?

Sirius Glass · Nov 20, 2021

The building I live in will be fumigated for termites with Sufuryl Floride, product name: Vikane. Does anyone have experience of know of any impact on film, black & white or color, OR photographic paper, black & white or color, photographic processing chemicals, black & white or color? I do not have an alternative storage place for these. Do I have to double wrap them as one does for food?

Kino · Nov 20, 2021

Yeah, I'd be concerned.

Maybe go down to the container store or some similar store and get some gasketed sealing totes or those vacuum bags for comforters; anything thick and air tight.

I have no first hand knowledge of the pesticide, but it will be by design an aerosol that is invasive; I would not tempt fate...

DREW WILEY · Nov 20, 2021

Sounds like voodoo to me. Any kind of sulfur compound is a giant No-No around film and photographic prints, developed or not. I'd just get some big ordinary thick (4 or 5 mil) contractor sized polyethylene trashcan bags, wrap your things in them, then tightly knot that bag, then put that bag into another, doing the same thing for sake of a double layer of protection. A typical box of 32 or 40 trashcan bags should allow you to protect quite a bit, unless, of course, you have to deal with really large prints.

Totes aren't going to seal tightly enough, but might be useful for organizing sealed bag items. Fumigants are designed to penetrate any possible opening, even the smallest. Don't forget about protecting your food-related kitchen things too.

After the nightmare, make sure you rinse out well all your developing trays etc, and sponge off your workspace surfaces and enlarging easels, etc. to remove any possible residue.

Donald Qualls · Nov 20, 2021

@Sirius Glass I'm rather surprised that stuff is still allowed in California. Above and beyond its lethal toxicity, it's 4000-5000 times as strong a greenhouse gas as carbon dioxide and very long lasting in the atmosphere.

That said, I'm going to go with the advice to double wrap everything photographic as if it were food; I'm also going to suggest you insist on seeing an actual test for the gas before reentering your building -- taking the pest control company's word for it has been lethal on occasion. It's tempting to suggest (though likely too late to have any effect on the current incident) also contacting your local environmental groups about petitioning to ban the material.

Oh, and be aware -- it's much heavier than air, so can settle in depressions like bathtubs, basements, and sumps. Ensure these are especially well ventilated after your fumigation.

Pieter12 · Nov 20, 2021

I would double-wrap them like food in the bags provided by the exterminator. The gas won't penetrate those, and once dissipated is longer a concern.

Pieter12 · Nov 20, 2021

How much do you have? Can you pack up and take them with you--you obviously have to vacate the premises. I would try to find out about any effect the gas might have on processed prints. You probably have more of those than raw materials.

Paul Howell · Nov 21, 2021

Can you lock up your papers and film in the trunk of your car?

Old_Dick · Nov 21, 2021

How about asking neighbors for storing things. One might have room in their freezer.

Sirius Glass · Nov 21, 2021

By the way, the fumigation company warns not to use any plastic bags, only the ones they supply for free because their bags are made with nylon and will block the fumigant. Regular plastic bags do not.

Sirius Glass · Nov 21, 2021

Moderators: Please remove "Cross Posted in both subforums" from the title.

Sirius Glass · Nov 21, 2021

Old_Dick said:
How about asking neighbors for storing things. One might have room in their freezer.

The only ones I know are in my building. We are all in the same boat, so to speak.

David A. Goldfarb · Nov 21, 2021

Sirius Glass said:
Moderators: Please remove "Cross Posted in both subforums" from the title.

updated

Sirius Glass · Nov 21, 2021

David A. Goldfarb said:
updated

Thank you.

gone · Nov 21, 2021

Having lived in the Twin Cities of Termite Hall of Fame (Hilo and Daytona Beach), I have a little experience w/ this. The building people or termite people are required by Federal law to provide data to tenants that explains how they should bundle up all food items, clothing etc into heavy duty plastic bags. So that would of course include your photos.

It's no big thing. Bundle it all up in 3 or 4 layers of thick plastic bags, tie it up tight, there you go.

For condo and home owners in termite areas (the subterranean termites can eat through concrete and steel and get into your places through the roof/walls/floors), tenting and using toxic chemicals only lasts a short while. If you want to get rid of termites forever, drill small holes near the wall studs, and the floor and ceiling braces. Then spray in a mixture of boric acid and ethylene glycol. I forget the ratio, it's on google. A gallon lawn sprayer w/ a hand pump does the job. The liquid glycol soaks deep into the wood, and carries the boric acid in w/ it.

Lasts literally forever, it's safe (you'd have to get into the structure and chew a board foot of wood for there to be an issue), and a DIY thing. Just patch and paint the little holes later. It's a nice selling point when you sell too. The last time I did this, everything ran about $300 total.

Pieter12 · Nov 21, 2021

Paul Howell said:
Can you lock up your papers and film in the trunk of your car?

Not at current SoCal temps.

mshchem · Nov 21, 2021

Film in original packaging shouldn't be effected, right??
Save the Hasselblads!!!

Sirius Glass · Nov 21, 2021

momus said:
Having lived in the Twin Cities of Termite Hall of Fame (Hilo and Daytona Beach), I have a little experience w/ this. The building people or termite people are required by Federal law to provide data to tenants that explains how they should bundle up all food items, clothing etc into heavy duty plastic bags. So that would of course include your photos.

It's no big thing. Bundle it all up in 3 or 4 layers of thick plastic bags, tie it up tight, there you go.

For condo and home owners in termite areas (the subterranean termites can eat through concrete and steel and get into your places through the roof/walls/floors), tenting and using toxic chemicals only lasts a short while. If you want to get rid of termites forever, drill small holes near the wall studs, and the floor and ceiling braces. Then spray in a mixture of boric acid and ethylene glycol. I forget the ratio, it's on google. A gallon lawn sprayer w/ a hand pump does the job. The liquid glycol soaks deep into the wood, and carries the boric acid in w/ it.

Lasts literally forever, it's safe (you'd have to get into the structure and chew a board foot of wood for there to be an issue), and a DIY thing. Just patch and paint the little holes later. It's a nice selling point when you sell too. The last time I did this, everything ran about $300 total.

I was on the board and fought it for years and I lost the fight. I wanted the method you mentioned but the hysterics would not have it.

Do I have to pack up slides and prints? The terminator said not.

Don_ih · Nov 22, 2021

You can do everyone a favour by leaving a sample of paper and film to be exposed to the gas and then seeing if they are impacted in any way. The gas is not very reactive, from what I can find online, so it probably will do nothing.

pentaxuser · Nov 22, 2021

Don Heisz said:
You can do everyone a favour by leaving a sample of paper and film to be exposed to the gas and then seeing if they are impacted in any way. The gas is not very reactive, from what I can find online, so it probably will do nothing.

Never heard of this problem in the U.K.- wrong climate I presume - but your suggestion sounds excellent in terms of giving results that can be used should such fumigation be visited on other members

pentaxuser

Donald Qualls · Nov 22, 2021

Yep, UK isn't termite country. Too wet, or too cold, I presume. Even in the USA, termites are mostly an issue in the southern roughly 1/3 of the continental states.

osella · Nov 22, 2021

https://www.spij.jp/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/BSPIJ25_001.pdf

According to this study it doesn't seem to harm processed materials. There doesn’t seem to be any literature about materials that are still sensitized.

Paul Howell · Nov 22, 2021

Pieter12 said:
Not at current SoCal temps.

Depending on when the fumigation is to take place, today downtown, high of 84, beach cities, 70s, a few days in those temps will harm film or paper.

Sirius Glass · Nov 22, 2021

pentaxuser said:
Never heard of this problem in the U.K.- wrong climate I presume - but your suggestion sounds excellent in terms of giving results that can be used should such fumigation be visited on other members

pentaxuser

In southern California within six months of construction a wood frame house will have subterranean termites, if not before. The UK is too cold for those critters. On the other hand termites with the help of the Aborigines turn trees into didjeridus.

beemermark · Nov 22, 2021

If the contractor gives you approved bags why not just use them??

DREW WILEY · Nov 22, 2021

Sirius - Termites are easy to prevent in new construction, even the aggressive kind now moving up the coast from SoCal to mid-Cal areas like Monterey due to warming climate. Things like wooden studs can either be pre-treated at higher expense in advance, or treated with nontoxic borate solution during construction. The underlying soil can also be treated. Local building codes apply regardless; but those are almost routinely violated and bribed away in many inland tract developments anyway, where long-term integrity of a building is very low on their priorities. In the past, places especially susceptible to termites, like Santa Barbara, once required old growth redwood framing due to its inherent resistance to bugs and dryrot; but now that's impossible because nearly all of it was cut down long ago.

And what amazes me about SoCal building codes, versus here on the NorCal coast, they allow substandard "whitewoods" like hemlock as framing, versus the Douglas fir mandated here, assuming of course the materials have been legally rated and sold, and not just arbitrarily sold under unofficial retail categories like the big box outlets use. It's all supposed to be checked for legitimacy by inspectors anyway, if they themselves happen to be competent and honest. Now engineered framing materials are beginning to take over, which have certain advantages in dimensional stability, strength, and linearity, but are still relatively expensive.

A fascinating exception to the lax LA standards is in Beverly Hills, where everyone is so rich and conscious of high property values that they are able to maintain a strictly run building inspection department. One of my former assistants became an Inspector there, and kinda became a hero to us when the little guy was given enough official clout to successfully shut down a massive shoddy illegal remodel in one of the alternate homes of a particularly famous individual (I won't say who, but it just might be coincidental with the most controversial name pervading the Soap Box portion of the forum; but I never go there, so can't say for sure). All the neighbors were certainly happy about that too. A fun anecdote, at least. Wish my own city had a clean inspection department; but it's 50/50. I lucked out with a good one when my darkroom was built and formally inspected - someone interested in building one for himself.

Does termite fumigation fog or damage photographic paper or film?

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