Do Jobo tanks and reels go bad?

[david b]

Is there any way that something is happening with these SS graduates? I also have a SS sink.

After many rinses and washes, the SS grads feel slimy. Not sure why.

I've got some brand new plastic graduates that I am going to try.

Any other thoughts?

 

[Photo Engineer]

Thats not good. My SS beakers and stuff are squeaky after I clean them.

PE

 

[Arvee]

Any progress, David?

Fred

 

[radiantdarkroom]

I have personally seen jobo tanks and reels wear out. So try some new ones.

 

[david b]

still happening.

changed everything.

no reason for any of it.

sucks.

 

[canuhead]

Not sure if it's related but I was having the similar frustrating problems with my 35 and 120 film. I kept getting marks (almost twin tear drop shaped) along one edge of the film, approximately where the cross supports are on ss Hewes reels. I changed dev, went back to using stop, changed water filter, you name it. Finally,by fluke, I think I discovered it was related to film drying in my Senrac dryer.

I'd been using the Senrac previously without issue but noticed the mark on both edges after I flipped the reels mid-dry. As well, the dryer has not been kicking out the heat like it used to and the motor would also conk out. No idea how this could affect the film but since I went to hang dry, the blemishes have magically disappeared.

So David, if you're drying your film on reels with a fan and /or heat, try hanging them. Long shot but worked for me nonetheless. Good luck

 

[david b]

Nope, happening somewhere in the developing.

Still happening. Changed everything.

Just about killin' me.

What's the point of shooting film if the negs are usable?

 

[MartinL]

Is it possible that the film got exposed to heat in the area that the problems are occurring in? Have you tried a fresh roll of film maybe a different brand? It my be a long shot but you seem to have eliminated everything else. If you have switched from the Jobo to a Patterson and are still having the exact same problem I think your problem may be happening before development. How/where are you storing your film?

 

[david b]

I've tried Agfa APX 100, FP4+, HP5+ and Acros.

I've tried a one minute prewash, a two minute prewash, and no prewash.

I've tried xtol and rodinal.

I've tried a brand new Paterson tank (wanna buy it) and new Jobo reels.

I've tried tap water, bottled water, distilled water.

I'm so frustrated, I'm about to try a Nikon D3.

 

[Ian Grant]

You really need to post some scans of the negatives.

Something very odd is happening, last time I heard of a similar problem it was unexplainable fogging, turned out to be from a tiny Red led. By the sound of things it probably has little to do with the tanks themselves.

Ian

 

[david b]

See post #16

 

[Ian Grant]

Apologies it's such a long thread I missed those small images. I assume that's the top edge of the film.

It does appear to be due to developer agitation as Ron & Bill Schwab have previously indicated. I would suggest one way to try and eliminate the causes would be to get a fellow photographer to process one of your films using your chemicals, tanks etc see if it happens to him or her.

I have to admit that I have had a similar problem once or twice with Paterson & Jobo tanks and it has been totally due to my becoming less careful with my agitation routine. Over agitation can be as bad as under agitation as there's a higher chance of getting air bubbles.

Things to remember are ensure the locking rings are fitted so the spirals don't ride up the column, careful gently inversion to prevent foaming, and a tap at the end of each cycle to remove any potential air bubbles that might have formed.

Lastly make sure there's no trace of wetting agent left in the tank from the previous film processed, likewise any other washing up liquids, if there's even a slight bit of foaming of the developer you'll have these problems.

Ian

 

[david b]

Ian,
thanks for your time with this.

I've been developing film for a very long time and never had these issues before. Certainly not ones that last for this long.

Anyway, for the record, I agitate/invert for the first 60 seconds and then 3 inversions at the top of every minute from that point
one.

Also, as perviously stated, I have tried brand new tanks and reels and had the same problem.

I live in NM. We have something like 5% humidity and I am often full of static electricity. To add to this,
I develop in a 9 foot stainless steel sink. I never feel a "charge" but wonder if this might have something
to do with this but I doubt it.

No matter, I am completely at a loss.

I had a friend develop a roll that I shot using his chemistry and tanks. It came out fine.

It without a doubt is somewhere in my development at I cannot figure out what is going on.
I've showed the negs to people who have been doing b&w longer than I am alive and they
have no idea.

So...I keep shooting and take my chances.

 

[David Grenet]

Are the marks on both edges of the film, or only one? Top or bottom (on the reel, in the tank)? Sorry if you have already answered this - as Ian said, it's a long thread!

At this point I'd probably try changing my agitation technique completely and see if it makes a difference!

 

[david b]

I am using a Jobo tank, 1540 I think, that holds two 120 reels.

Both rolls come out with marks on the bottom edge. They are random.
They are oblong and are sometimes layered.

 

[canuhead]

I can't help but wonder if it's still related to drying. Are you hanging the film, sponge or squeegee ? Maybe stray water drops as they roll down the film ? Just thinking of anything here David since it has everyone stumped.

 

[david b]

The marks appear before the drying stage.

 

[canuhead]

ok, scratch that one then...

 

[Ian Grant]

You could try roller processing, with continuous agitation. That might eliminate your problems.

Ian

 

[canuhead]

maybe try stainless steel reels ? I know it's another investment but worth a try ?

 

[canuhead]

yano this is kinda loopy but could this have anything to do with the ball bearings or whatever they are, that push the film along ? maybe they're pinching the film down/compressing/rubbing/abrading or something...like I said, loopy, but at this point...

 

[Arvee]

David,

Things outside the core process:

1) Try loading film with cotton gloves (maybe skin oil/changing bag sweat since the problem is at the edges)? For example, I have very acidic sweat and can fix film with sweat;

2) Does the distilled water come from a known pure source (maybe try boiling some tap water to eliminate the dilution/processing water as a problem, or change brands if you're buying at the grocery store)?;

3) Any contact with silicone products (that stuff will migrate everywhere and is extremely difficult to remove)?;

5) Chemical storage containers?;

6) Contamination in the changing bag?;

If I come up with any others I will post them.

Perhaps you can make a list of of your process steps and the changes (process and materials) you have already made and check them off as non-causal. Then maybe the culprit will be left on the list.


Fred

 

[david b]

Not sure but it worked

Okay....so I just went in the darkroom room and did another tank (2 reels) of 120 film, but I did it a little different.

I did a one minute presoak.
Then I dumped and poured the developer in.

I agitated for one minute, doing inversions.

T H E N
I turned the lights off and took the lid off the jobo.

At the top of every minute, I physically pulled the reels
out of the tank and then slowly put them back in. I did this twice
at the top of every minute.

With 30 seconds left, I put the lid back on and then turned the lights
on.

I dumped the developed and then did a water stop.

Dumped the water and added the fix.

After 5 minutes in the fix, I did my normal wash.

Guess what?

The film is perfect as far as I can tell right now.

It's hanging and I will put it on my light table as soon as I can.

So, this leads me to believe that something is happening in the agitation
when the lid is on. Some sort of bubbling is going on.

If this is the way I have to do it, then I will.

Any ideas on this one?

 

[bdial]

Is it leaking? (and thereby letting air/bubbles in)
At least more than what you would have considered to be normal...

 

[david b]

as I've stated before, I have been using the same tanks and reels for quite a while.

My agitation has not changed.

The tank in not leaking and I have also tried other tanks and reels and the problem
still occurred.

I am at a loss as to why this would fix it.