Discontinuation of FP100C

[Christiaan Phleger]

Yeah NO way in an icy Hades any price drop anywhere at any point in the future.

For those of us who have been users of Fuji products since the 1980's the pattern is the same. Which IMO comes from how Fuji works; they make a huge amount in giant runs and then well after they stopped production the announce the discontinuation (of course citing "reduced demand"), they then keep jacking the price until its gone. They wring out excessive profits on R&D that was paid for decades ago on equipment that was paid for and already scrapped in some cases. Instead of putting that money into a better product or keep one going they've walked away well before anyone knows.

Its a chickensh** way to do business.

All the while 'claiming' to support film and losing tremendous money on digital trinkets; check the Sipa numbers for the state of the digital camera market. I for one have long stopped purchasing any Fuji products and actively campaign to people who ask what digital camera to get to never buy Fuji products at all. You guys do what you want, but thats what I'm doing having been burned by the loss of too many products such as Velvia Astia Neopan 400 (REALLY FUJI? A 400 speed T grain emulsion is too hard with no demand??) and mark my words ACROS final run has been made and this film will go soon as well (notice the price bump? a sure sign its dead now).

It already is a National tragedy that decades of fine Japanese cameras will have no Japanese film left to put in them and Fuji executives should be publicly SHAMED for this point alone. And for any rebuttal that its all about the economies of scale and dropping demand hasn't been paying attention to what is going on (78,000+ APUG users and growing) and I'll say it again; Fuji will sell every single box of FP-100c. "Reduced Demand" my big hairy A**.

F**kFuji

 

[Roger Cole]

I seriously doubt that Fuji is benefiting in any way from the price run up. Does anyone have any evidence that they have actually raised their prices to distributors, versus distributors raising prices to retailers and retailers to customers?

 

[Christiaan Phleger]

How could they not be making money?
They made 100 of something; sold the first 50 at X which would pay for the R&D and tooling, and then jacked the price each time they sold another 10 units until it was gone with none of the profits going back into R&D or doing another run. I fail to see how anyone could not understand how that wouldn't make money. Its a scorched earth method of raping their customer base.

 

[Lionel1972]

I think we need a big mass media press article (something in the likes of The New York Times) titled "How Fujifilm is lying to its customers" where all of the above would be put on the spotlight. Then we'll see how much Fujifilm cares for its reputation.

 

[Roger Cole]

How could they not be making money?
They made 100 of something; sold the first 50 at X which would pay for the R&D and tooling, and then jacked the price each time they sold another 10 units until it was gone with none of the profits going back into R&D or doing another run. I fail to see how anyone could not understand how that wouldn't make money. Its a scorched earth method of raping their customer base.

Sigh.

I have seen no evidence that "they" (as in Fuji) have "jacked up the price."

Distributors pay Fuji a certain price, then charge more to the retailers they distribute to. Then the retailers mark it up more to cover their costs and a profit and sell it to us. As far as I know the price inflation has been at the retail level. It may possibly also be at the distributor level. I have not even heard an allegation that it's being done at the manufacturer (Fuji) level. I suppose that's possible but seems quite unlikely.

I fail to see how anyone could assume that, because B&H is raising the retail price by a dollar a day and others have raised it even more, that this means Fuji has raised their price. If that was where the price increase was coming from the increases would be the same or closely comparable across retailers. They aren't, with already wildly varying retail prices.

 

[Theo Sulphate]

...
Distributors pay Fuji a certain price, then charge more to the retailers they distribute to. Then the retailers mark it up more to cover their costs and a profit and sell it to us. As far as I know the price inflation has been at the retail level. It may possibly also be at the distributor level. I have not even heard an allegation that it's being done at the manufacturer (Fuji) level.

Agreed - which is why I think the price will eventually come down. Retailer A may keep it at $30 and sit on tens of thousands of dollars in inventory for months; retailer B sees an opportunity to sell all of their inventory at a much lower price. Retailer B wins because even though their profit is less, they are making vastly more sales, taking sales away from other retailers.

When Fuji mentions "reduced demand", I believe they are referring to all the sales they used to make for passport and other ID applications in developing countries - countries which are now switching to digital. Those customers used far more Fuji pack film than amateur photographers.

Even so, Fuji could have kept the 4x5 FP films and FP-3000B / FP-100C and set a price that would've made it worth their effort. Sadly, I think the bean counters convinced management that FP pack films were stifling their company and integral filn (Instax) was good enough.

 

[Roger Cole]

We did in fact see FP-3000b come back down in price after the initial surge. Today, something like two years after discontinuance, it's still readily available albeit at prices that have crept way back up. I like FP-3000b, but not enough to pay $25 - $35. (If it were more moderate in contrast I might at $25 though.)

 

[Wayne]

How could they not be making money?
They made 100 of something; sold the first 50 at X which would pay for the R&D and tooling, and then jacked the price each time they sold another 10 units until it was gone with none of the profits going back into R&D or doing another run. I fail to see how anyone could not understand how that wouldn't make money. Its a scorched earth method of raping their customer base.

Agree with Roger. You are jumping to entirely unfounded conclusions.

 

[Ken Nadvornick]

Also agree with Roger. When I said never leave money on the table, I was referring to distributors and formal retailers and amateur eBayers. Not the manufacturer. Distributors and retailers run their own businesses separate from their suppliers, and must answer to their own particular demons. eBayers usually just gouge if they think they can.

If it was an across-the-board manufacturer increase, then one might expect a more or less uniform increase at the final retail level as that new cost was passed on? Similar in both amount and timing? But that's not what I see here. I see wild-assed pricing fluctuations, apparently based on whatever someone holding the product thinks they can get for it at the moment.

These individuals are trying to maximize their return by leaving no money on their respective tables.

Ken

 

[skorpiius]

My order put in on Feb 29 at $11 shipped on March 7. My 2nd order put in on March 1st at $13 has not.

Very happy these backorder orders went through, I probably ordered far too much in a panic (110 boxes), but I had just given up on buying any more FP-3000b and was at least glad FP-100C was available new, just days before the news, so I kind of lost my mind haha.

 

[amellice]

My order put in on Feb 29 at $11 shipped on March 7. My 2nd order put in on March 1st at $13 has not.

Very happy these backorder orders went through, I probably ordered far too much in a panic (110 boxes), but I had just given up on buying any more FP-3000b and was at least glad FP-100C was available new, just days before the news, so I kind of lost my mind haha.

Lucky you, the order I placed on March 1sh when it was 11 didn't ship yet hopefully it will soon since I ordered it the day next to yours

 

[Theo Sulphate]

... I probably ordered far too much in a panic (110 boxes) ...

All FP-100C or was FP-3000B part of that? It's not too much if you can use it all before the chemicals no longer work properly.

In my experience, Polaroid integral film that I've had in the refrigerator at 33F-40F for 11 years now (slowly using it...) has lost much of its color and the developer often does not spread evenly. For some reason last summer, my original Polaroid SX-70 film suddenly seemed fresh again for a while - maybe the many warm days helped.

How long does refrigerated Fuji pack film last for making reasonable quality images? I ordered only 5 of FP-100C and 5 of FP-3000B because prices were getting silly.

 

[NedL]

My batch arrived today. It's going to take some doing to make space for it in the fridge.

In a way that is hard to describe, part of the fun is already getting sucked out of using it. I usually think of them as fairly "disposable".. for example, I was thinking of making a slot in my macro pinhole camera so that I could insert the pack, make a picture, then transfer it back into the old polaroid camera to pull the tab. Just a goofy idea that seemed fun to try. I've also put a pack on the baseboard of my enlarger and projected color images onto it...and made color photograms with the last picture in a pack. Now I'll probably be less willing to goof off as much, but that's where the fun is.... It will take a conscious effort not to treat it like "each shot counts now", and just have fun....

 

[fdonadio]

I probably ordered far too much in a panic (110 boxes)

I'm feeling a little ashamed... I got only 10 boxes!


Flavio

 

[Roger Cole]

I'm feeling a little ashamed... I got only 10 boxes!


Flavio

Me too. Partly recently-post-divorce finances to keep the budget in recovering mode, partly not sure how much I would use. But I do have a use in mind for a project I want to do soon so I wish I had bought more. Still could of course but at much higher price. Mine has not shipped. I ordered 2/29 and it still shows pending.

 

[Roger Cole]

Probably better to have ordered too much than too little though. I suspect anyone who thinks they ordered too much will be able to get their money out of it by reselling it (and if they bought early more too, if so inclined.)

 

[skorpiius]

All FP-100C or was FP-3000B part of that? It's not too much if you can use it all before the chemicals no longer work properly.

In my experience, Polaroid integral film that I've had in the refrigerator at 33F-40F for 11 years now (slowly using it...) has lost much of its color and the developer often does not spread evenly. For some reason last summer, my original Polaroid SX-70 film suddenly seemed fresh again for a while - maybe the many warm days helped.

How long does refrigerated Fuji pack film last for making reasonable quality images? I ordered only 5 of FP-100C and 5 of FP-3000B because prices were getting silly.

All FP-100C

Over the past few months I've stocked up on 68 boxes of FP-3000B, at a price of on average $18 or $19 USD.
Then in Feb I ordered 10 boxes of FP-100C from B&H at $11, and then another 50 at $11 on the day of the announcement, and another 50 at $13 the next day.

So if I get all I've ordered I'll have 680 b&w and 1100 colour peel apart instant photos to last a lifetime... (or the ~5 years it might stay good)

 

[skorpiius]

Probably better to have ordered too much than too little though. I suspect anyone who thinks they ordered too much will be able to get their money out of it by reselling it (and if they bought early more too, if so inclined.)

Well that's the thing I also have the option to sell excess at a point where what I sell pays for all I've already taken. But the primary point was to have stock to take photos.

I just really like the process and looks I get using my 250 automatic.

 

[skorpiius]

To quote myself in another thread

"..film for me is like riding a classic high quality bicycle for transportation. Peel apart film is like also having some weird steam powered bike in the garage that gives me great pleasure to ride for fun." And gets lots of funny looks.

 

[skorpiius]

Some actual concrete news about a last ditch attempt to save it

http://savepackfilm.net/updates/the-journey-begins

 

[MDR]

I hope the "doc" can save the Patient and will keep my fingers crossed.

 

[GarageBoy]

Unlike the FP3000B discontinuation notice, where FP100C was still available, FP100C IS the last of its type - once its gone, that's it, so people will stock up
Imagine the last 120 film being discontinued

 

[skorpiius]

Exactly, plus the 10 million+ cameras produced which will no longer be able to be used, which is a huge waste in my opinion.

 

[Roger Cole]

Unlike the FP3000B discontinuation notice, where FP100C was still available, FP100C IS the last of its type - once its gone, that's it, so people will stock up
Imagine the last 120 film being discontinued

And color is no doubt more popular than black and white among many, especially the users of old pack film cameras versus backs on other cameras.

Since there is still some FP-3000b available even at hideous prices I dismissed a month ago I may get some of that too. I wish I could get 100b. The 3000 speed is fine and often helpful, but the stuff is awfully contrasty.

My FP-100c ordered 2/29 shipped today.

 

[nolanr66]

I have never used the film myself. I shoot 35mm B/W but I did go to BHPhoto to check out the cost and availability and they are out of stock and the cost was almost $19.00 a pack if they had some. The cost is way out of my league anyway.