Developers for starting out

Hello everyone. I'm cobbling together a darkroom and just learning to develop and print. I've seen it frequently suggested to pick a film/developer/paper combination and stick with it to get the best results. After a good amount of reading, I'm inclined to start out learning to use HC-110, as well as either Pyrocat HD or Exactol. Conceptually, I like pretty much everything I've heard about HC-110 (relatively easy to use as a one-shot, great shelf life, no need for stop bath, very flexible), but I'd like to also learn to use a staining developer for higher accutance prints. I'm leaning toward Exactol, but I've seen so many good posts about Pyrocat HD that I can't help but consider it. I don't expect to print high volumes, so the cost difference between the two is not an issue for me. In general, I'm willing to mix my own chemicals but prefer not having to. I will be primarily shooting Delta 100, FP4 and HP5 in 120 format on old lenses (Rolleiflex 2.8F and Agfa Super Isolette). I'll be printing with a Durst M70 (condenser head) on Kentmere glossy papers up to 16"x20" and, when needed, will selenium tone. Any thoughts on this approach are appreciated. Many thanks.

36cm2 said:

just learning to develop and print ... 120 format

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For 120 HC-110 isn't a bad choice. The stuff was designed for newspaper work in the 60's and the primary push was to be fast, easy and reliable and image quality wasn't a big concern. For 35mm it isn't a very good choice, but it is fine for MF and LF work. D-76 is the 'standard answer' to the standard question 'what should I use for learning to develop film'.

Stay with _ONE_ developer. Sounds boring. It isn't. Concentrate on the image, not the developer. Do not start out with staining developers, they have so many interactions and variabilities they will get in the way of learning.

Begin with the old standard against which all developers seem to be compared - D-76. After using it for 100 or so times you will be familiar with what it can do and be ready to investigate other developers.

Sprint Chemicals are a good equivalent for D76 and it comes in liquid form.
Very easy to use as a standard developer.

http://sprintsystems.com/

I do not disagree with the D76 recommendation - but - I am one of those guys who says - "do it - or don't do it - just don't do it half way"
After years of wandering through endless chemistries - If I had to pick one and only one - it would be XTOL. It is a little crisper that D76 - you can make a version of it yourself very cheaply.
Don't be afraid to mix your own. If you can make a cake - you can mix your own chems. You can get everything you need on the internet or at Trader Joes or a pool store or a health food store or a grocery store. I make the Mytol version called "instant Mytol" It is made in a glycol base and does not go bad on the shelf. I have to add one ingredient with it; a scoop of sodium sulfite, and water and it is excellent -
Or - you could use D76 -
If you have to buy and use D76 - at least use it as a stock solution and mix it 1:1 with water and use it one shot. And don't keep it more than a few months. One shot developers are always preferred over - increasing development time 10% each roll and only doing 4 rolls per liter etc. Forget that nonsense - alway use it one shot. The only developer I do not use as one shot is Split D-23 which can can do about 15 rolls per liter and has a shelf life of several years. It is easy to make and hard to screw up - but it lacks some of the crispness of XTOL. I little softer than D76 I would say - not too good for 35mm but great for TLR use with exposure guessing.

I also suggest that you start out with D-76 and stay with it. As has been said, it is the standard against which every other developer is compared. I'd also suggest that you choose one of the three excellent films that you mentioned and stay with it. It really takes a while to fully appreciate what these film / devs can do. And any of these films is capable of producing superb results in D-76.

The last time I made a cake it came out looking like a scorched football. That being said, it sounds like maybe I've been get a bit ahead of myself with aspirations of HC110 and pyro from day 1. Maybe a rethink is in order.

Rodinal (or similar R09 from FOMA) - a very universal developer. I agree with Nicholaas: stay with one developer, try different combinations 1+20...1+100...

Others have said that D-76 is the standard against which other developers are measured. This is true, in a way, but this sort of phrase seems to imply that D-76 is objectively better than other developers. That's not true, except in certain narrow ways. It's just that D-76 is, first, a very popular developer; and second, a good compromise developer. It does most things developers should do reasonably well, but not spectacularly well. Broadly speaking, developers can be measured by their effects on acutance (apparent sharpness), speed, and grain. D-76 strikes a good average on these three measures. If you want to sacrifice one of these to get better results on another, there are developers that will do so.

I've never used HC-110, so I can't comment on it from personal experience; but based on what I've read, I'd say it's not that bad a general-purpose developer. It's also got the advantage of coming as a long-lasting liquid concentrate, which may be preferable to a powder that you must mix to a stock solution and then (usually) dilute to a working solution. Depending on how much film you shoot, your D-76 could go bad before you use it all. HC-110 isn't likely to do that. If you think you're likely to go through your first batch of D-76 before it goes bad, though, it's a more popular developer than HC-110, which means you're more likely to be able to get help if you run into some strange problem with it.

Concerning Rodinal, it's another liquid concentrate, and it's got legendary keeping qualities. It's generally recommended for fairly slow films, though, (say, ISO 200 and slower) since it produces bigger grain than most other developers.

Ultimately, developer choice is very personal, and some people get very passionate about it. IMHO, it's best to start with something common and general-purpose, like D-76, XTOL, or HC-110, and move on to Rodinal, pyro developers, and other things later. Some people might move Rodinal into the first category or HC-110 out of it. Like I said, it's a subjective and personal matter.

I'll go out on a limb and say why not go with a pyro developer. I use wd2d+ with good results. It would not have been a logical starting point a few years ago, but, especially if scanning is going to become an integral part of your workflow... it might be a good place to start. My feeling is that the pyro developers make the most of the advantages of film with respect to straight digital capture.

My most used developers are ID-11 and perceptol.

There's nothing wrong with HC110. It can even be used as a print developer if you add about a tablespoon of washing soda to each quart or liter of 1+32 HC110. Follow David Vestal's advice: "Expose enough and don't develop too much" or words to that effect. It's going to be a learning experience, and there are more important things to learn before you start searching for the "optimum" developer. Anyway, that's my advice based on my experience.

I will echo what others have said; D-76 is the standard and there is nothing wrong with HC-110.

I came back to photogrpahy after several years hiatus post-high school. I do color at home as well as B&W. As I do about 80% E-6 and the balance B&W, I wanted chemistry for B&W that was convenient to mix one shot, has a long shelf life after opening and was a good compromise between accutance, grain, and speed. Essentially, what I was looking for was a liquid concentrate with excellent keeping properties as a concentrate and acted for the most part like D-76. After a few mis-starts and some research I settled on HC-110 or Ilfotec HC as my standard. Because HC-110 was marginally cheaper at my local supplier, it is now my standard B&W developer.

keithwms said:

My most used developers are ID-11 and perceptol.

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A point worth noting: "ID-11" is Ilford's name for D-76. This actually gets a bit confusing: There's a published D-76 formula (widely published on the Web, as in here or Dead Link Removed). You can mix it yourself from this formula or use numerous minor or major variations of it. Ilford's ID-11 is reportedly very similar to the published D-76 formula, but AFAIK its precise composition is a trade secret, so the only people who know just how close it is aren't saying. Kodak's commercial D-76 is very similar to the published D-76, but it varies a bit to facilitate commercial distribution of a single-packet powdered product and to make for more consistent effects over time. (Ilford's ID-11 comes in two packets that you mix together, and the original mix-it-yourself formula actually becomes more active over time, at least until it begins to degrade and eventually die.) As with ID-11, the precise composition of Kodak's commercial D-76 is, AFAIK, a trade secret. You'll get pretty much identical results with any of these products, and probably with other manufacturers' D-76 clones, with the caveat about activity changing a bit as the mixed solution ages.

If you're just starting out and decide to use D-76, you can mix it yourself, use Kodak's D-76 packets, use Ilford's ID-11, or use other clone products, such as Photographer's Formulary's TD-16. If you've got a local store you want to support, you can buy whichever of these products they happen to stock. If you must buy by mail order, you can buy whichever product you prefer, based on price, claimed minor differences, politics, etc.

If you are going to do D76 - Buy some Sodium Sulfite, some borax and some Metol and make your own D76(h)
100g Soduim Sulfite
2.5g Metol
2g Borax
Per liter in that order - heat 750ml of water to 125 F deg water - add the rest of the water after mixing.
You can cut the mix to 500ml or even 250ml to mix 1:1 with water
This basic version of D76 works well and is cheap and you can mix it as you need it. That way it does not go bad on the shelf. I weigh out my chems and seal them in little bags - looks like a drug operation when I do. Then I just pull a "kit" when I need it.
Chems can be bought at artcraft chemical http://www.artcraftchemicals.com/
or photoformulary: http://photoformulary.com/

I'd also recommend starting with D-76/ID-11 and using nothing else for a year. It's like learning 35mm photography with a 50mm lens. It defines what "normal" is, and once you've got it under control, you can see what makes other developers interesting.

I can definitely second most of the advice here, and D76 is a good place to start. Mainly because it's readily available and there is a lot of knowledge about it. Most people that have ever done b&w film photography know what it is so you can get help if you did something wrong.
I will add this: Print often! Print your negatives a lot. That is in fact the only way you can know whether you did something wrong when you developed your film or not.

For me - I usually get one or two frames on each roll that I am really happy with. Sometimes more, sometimes less. But I would say I spend maybe half an hour on each negative that I'm happy with. I scan it first to proof it (I know, evil me) because it's cheap. A contact sheet works as good or better for that purpose. Then I try really hard to make a fine print.

I shot and developed film for 3-4 years, and I tried various films and developers. It wasn't until I started printing that I started to really see what difference the different combinations would offer, and honestly the difference is not that huge. If you try really hard, it is possible to get fine results with damned near any film / developer and paper / developer combination out there.
The advice here is to keep it simple. I actually have a piece of paper taped to my darkroom wall that says 'KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid' on it. Less is more. I promise. You will be able to get much more variation out of HOW you use your materials as opposed to WHICH materials you use. Unless you need grain like Ilford Delta 3200 from Ilford Pan-F+ (ISO 50) or something silly like that.

Keep it simple - learn by printing - you will be surprised by how fast your learn to control your outcome.

- Thomas

Don't confuse yourself.

Pick one developer, and only one; and use that one only for at least a year before you ask us again.

My personal recommendation is Ilfotec-HC, which AFAIK is very similar to HC-110.
The reason for that is that it's a concentrate that lasts for ages, and it works with everything. Grain is less objectionable than with Rodinal, in my experience. Effective film speed is slightly higher than with D-76/ID-11, again in my experience.

I too use staining developers when they give the best results, but in my experience they are a waste of time and film until you know exactly what you're doing and why.

Conclusion: There are several thousand members here, and they will give you several million answers. Every single one is correct. So pick one developer, and use that until you have a very good reason to try something else.

Thanks for all the help. Having read a ton of posts on different developers, I never expected to find such strong support for D-76. I'll start with either that or HC110 and stick with it like you've suggested. Have a great weekend.

"For 35mm [HC-110] isn't a very good choice."

Hogwash.

HC-110 is a good choice. D-76 is a bit more versatile, but you have to mix it from powder. I like the results from D-76 a bit more, but that's a personal preference. Rodinal is also a good choice.
There are other good developers, but these would be my choices for starting out.

HC-110.

It is flexible and economical, and gives excellent results (including with 35mm).

When you get more experienced, you can adjust your results, by adjusting the dilution.

Until you get more experienced, you probably won't notice the difference .

None of the other recommendations are bad either. Make your initial choice from among them, and based on practical factors like availability, and your choice will be a good one.

Matt

I started out using staining developers. I can attest to the advice that was given to not do that. Digitaltruth.com has a page called the "massive development chart," which lists the development times for many different films and developers. The trouble with staining developers, apart from the inconsistant results, is that there isn't much data to start with on chart. It's hard to get the developing times right. If you used D76 or HC110, you can at least get a time to start with for any film on the market. I had read so much abour PMK and Pyrocat-HD that I couldn't wait to try them, and I really should have waited. I ruined lots of expensive film.

--Gary

One advantage of something like HC-110 (or Rodinal) is that it is a liquid, one shot developer, with excellent keeping qualities. Since you always make up fresh developer from a long lasting concentrate, you're not left wondering if it has gone bad.

If HC-110 is readily available, go for it. It's a good, economical, universal developer.

I started with Rodinal, since it was cheap, readily available, and lasts forever. I still use it, along with Diafine and home-brewed PC-TEA.

What ever you use pick one and stick with it until you realy know what it will do. Plan on at least one year. I started with D-76 for Tri-X and Plus-X for about three years and then moved on only when I found a film that I didn't like the results from D76 so I tried HC-110. My mother got interested after I built my first darkroom but she chased magic bullets. If she didn't like the results she would change film and developers. She never had enough stability in her work to figure anything out. She gave up in three years. 34 years later I still love it.

IMHO - Buy a decent thermometer and a timer with a clear read-out

Learn to develop your film consistently by accurately controlling your process inputs (time/temp/agitation)

There is far more to be won and lost as a new starter in repeatable processing of your Negs than from the nuances of Dev A v Dev B

The key is consistency

Stick to one film / one developer / one process

When you become more proficient then you can start to experiment

Personally, I have been developing my own film for more than 30 years and I am still using the same developer as I started with (ID11 at 1+1) but have learned to adjust the developer time and film speed to get what I want

Good luck

Martin