Developer for FPP Infrared film also known as Rollei 400 Infrared.

[John Wiegerink]

Just got an email from FPP saying my box of their 4X5 Infrrared film is arriving by Pony Express today and need a little advice on which of my film developers to use for processing it. Here is what I have: Rodinal, FX-39, Pyrocat-HDC and Xtol-R. My two main film developers are Xtol-R(Adox XT-3R) and Pyrocat so I would rather use those two. Now, if Rodinal or FX-39 works better I could use either. I also have some unmixed ID-11 if needed. Like I said, I would prefer to use Xtol-R or Pyrocat, which ever works best.

 

[Mark J]

It's a short-scale film and often needs help in the highlights. I get pretty good results from PMK, so would say try Pyrocat HDC yourself.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Thanks Mark! I should also add that I'm going to be using a R72 filter with and will use a base ISO of ISO 6 and bracket on both sides. Now I just have to find the developing times for Pyrocat-HD(C)?

 

[John Wiegerink]

Update! I did a different search and found an old thread where our Andy talks about developing Rollei IR 400 in Pyrocat-HD and lists his times. At least I now have a starting point.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I'm sure you'll be quite pleased with it in Pyrocat! Don't forget to share your results!

 

[Mark J]

Excellent. I couldn't offer anything from PMK as it's not the same thing. It's fairly long - eg. 15mins at 21 C.
I wouldn't waste too many shots at ISO 3 by the way. The only time it looked like 3 to me was in early evening as the sun was going down on a clear day, and the subjects had mostly blue light from the sky in the shadows.

 

[John Wiegerink]

I'm sure you'll be quite pleased with it in Pyrocat! Don't forget to share your results!

Andy,
I promised I would share the old 1898 4X5 Cyclone Senior box camera results and I will. I'm going to load a couple of sheets of this Fpp stuff and see how it works. I got all the light leaks in the camera sealed so it's plenty light tight. I'm just a little worried about it being a falling-plate camera when using infrared film. It works fine with HP5+ and Shanghai GP3 100, but this infrared film might be different in it. I'm going to also load two film holders with FPP infrared and shoot it with the Chamonix 4X5 to compare. I'm going to use your times for constant agitation and Pyrocat-HD. I usually don't use constant agitation, but will with this film. Oh, I copied your reciprocity graph to my iPhone also. It's going to be a little tricky with the Cyclone box camera since I only have a one shutter speed of 1/60th of a second and three f-stops of f16-22-32. If I calculated them right??? Well, off to load the plate holders and film holders. Let you know how the test shots go later this evening.

 

[bluechromis]

That film is very contrasty, and it is easy for shadows to block up. Speed-increasing developers like Xtol types, and I think FX-39 helps keep the shadows open. If you used the Rodinal, it might be wise to rate the film lower because Rodinal usually causes a loss of speed. Henning Serger says the effective speed of this film without a filter is less than 100.

 

[John Wiegerink]

That film is very contrasty, and it is easy for shadows to block up. Speed-increasing developers like Xtol types, and I think FX-39 helps keep the shadows open. If you used the Rodinal, it might be wise to rate the film lower because Rodinal usually causes a loss of speed. Henning Serger says the effective speed of this film without a filter is less than 100.

Thanks for that info. I think I remember reading here that Henning said he used FX-39 for this film. That is, if my memory is working right today. I think I'm going to rate it at ISO(EI)100 and soup it in Pyrocat-HDC for a first try.
I just loaded one 4X5 holder and two Kodak 4X5 septums and I'm pretty sure Andy heard me cussing up in western Canuck land. What a PIA! I think a person ought to practice loading sheet film holder before they even buy this film. You could practice by going to the kitchen and cutting Saran wrap to 4X5 size. Yes, it's about that thin. I'm sure I have a couple of moon creases in one or two sheets after my loading experience. Also, I felt for normal notches and could not find any. So I wasted one sheet and checked it with lights on. There it was, a corner has been slightly cut off. Live and learn, I guess.

 

[Mark J]

Yes, it's like tissue paper !

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Thanks for that info. I think I remember reading here that Henning said he used FX-39 for this film. That is, if my memory is working right today. I think I'm going to rate it at ISO(EI)100 and soup it in Pyrocat-HDC for a first try.
I just loaded one 4X5 holder and two Kodak 4X5 septums and I'm pretty sure Andy heard me cussing up in western Canuck land. What a PIA! I think a person ought to practice loading sheet film holder before they even buy this film. You could practice by going to the kitchen and cutting Saran wrap to 4X5 size. Yes, it's about that thin. I'm sure I have a couple of moon creases in one or two sheets after my loading experience. Also, I felt for normal notches and could not find any. So I wasted one sheet and checked it with lights on. There it was, a corner has been slightly cut off. Live and learn, I guess.

Saran wrap! Great analogy!

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

...at least it doesn't "cling"!

 

[Mark J]

It certainly clings to the bottom of a developing dish !

 

[John Wiegerink]

It certainly clings to the bottom of a developing dish

Yes, I'm a little worried about trying to load it in my SPP445 tank being as thin as it is.

 

[John Wiegerink]

I took the 4X5 Cyclone Senior to the old Pere Marquette railroad grade to shoot a couple of infrared shots of a 40' tall concrete coal tower from the days of steam. I set my tripod/camera up on the edge of the new paved bike and walking trail where the tracks used to be. Framed the shot, took a spotmeter reading then grabbed the shutter release cord. As I was just ready to trip the shutter and wham. I was hit from behind from a high speed biker. It was the last thing I remember until I regained consciousness. He hit me so hard it flip me into the air and slammed my the back of my head on the paved trail. When I came to there were three teenagers standing over me and one bike laying on the pavement. I thought I was paralyzed since all I could move was my left hand. After about four or five minutes I could finally get to my knees, but still couldn't walk for about another 4 to 5 minutes. They picked up my poor old camera and tripod and helped me to my truck. It took me a couple of minutes to figure out which way my cottage was, and is actually only right across the lake from where I was at. Yup, the wife put me in her car and off to the hospital we go. Two bloody elbows, banged up left hip, big knob and cut on the head, plus a concussion. 4 1/2hrs later I'm a little sore, but back home thank God. The worst part of it was I had no idea they were coming up behind me and I just couldn't figure out why I was on the ground, bleeding and couldn't move. Yes, photography can be a very dangerous business. I'm starting to think I might be too old for this hobby. If I'm not too stiff and sore in the morning I'm heading back out to finish the job, but I'm going to be watching behind me very closely.

 

[Todd Niccole]

I use D19 or Dektol with Rollei IR. I like the high contrast and it seems to produce lower grain than standard developers like ID-11 and oddly Microphen which I have tried.

Bright & Sunny 720nm filter f/11 exp 1/30:
D19/Dektol(2:1) 3.75min

D19(1:1)/Dektol(1:2) 4.75min

 

[John Wiegerink]

I use D19 or Dektol with Rollei IR. I like the high contrast and it seems to produce lower grain than standard developers like ID-11 and oddly Microphen which I have tried.

Bright & Sunny 720nm filter f/11 exp 1/30:
D19/Dektol(2:1) 3.75min

D19(1:1)/Dektol(1:2) 4.75min

I would have never thought to try either of those developers. I could see higher contrast with Dektol, but lower grain is hard to figure. That old achromatic meniscus lens on the Cyclone camera is low contrast so it could use a boost. I have one developer I'm going to try that I forgot about, which might give results similar to your Dektol results. It's a gallon of Ethol's UFG developer that I have mixed for replenishment. It's a very active developer, which might work just fine. We'll see I guess. My 74 year old bones are a little sore this morning, but I'm heading back out to shoot that old coal tower after breakfast.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I took the 4X5 Cyclone Senior to the old Pere Marquette railroad grade to shoot a couple of infrared shots of a 40' tall concrete coal tower from the days of steam. I set my tripod/camera up on the edge of the new paved bike and walking trail where the tracks used to be. Framed the shot, took a spotmeter reading then grabbed the shutter release cord. As I was just ready to trip the shutter and wham. I was hit from behind from a high speed biker. It was the last thing I remember until I regained consciousness. He hit me so hard it flip me into the air and slammed my the back of my head on the paved trail. When I came to there were three teenagers standing over me and one bike laying on the pavement. I thought I was paralyzed since all I could move was my left hand. After about four or five minutes I could finally get to my knees, but still couldn't walk for about another 4 to 5 minutes. They picked up my poor old camera and tripod and helped me to my truck. It took me a couple of minutes to figure out which way my cottage was, and is actually only right across the lake from where I was at. Yup, the wife put me in her car and off to the hospital we go. Two bloody elbows, banged up left hip, big knob and cut on the head, plus a concussion. 4 1/2hrs later I'm a little sore, but back home thank God. The worst part of it was I had no idea they were coming up behind me and I just couldn't figure out why I was on the ground, bleeding and couldn't move. Yes, photography can be a very dangerous business. I'm starting to think I might be too old for this hobby. If I'm not too stiff and sore in the morning I'm heading back out to finish the job, but I'm going to be watching behind me very closely.

Glad that you are okay!! I guess we need to wear a reflective vest and helmet out there now.

 

[Mark J]

That's a shocking incident John. Glad that you weren't too badly injured. I once had a near miss with a mountain-biker, in the Lake District. Glad he didn't hit me, there are multiple ways in which that could be very painful.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Glad that you are okay!! I guess we need to wear a reflective vest and helmet out there now.

I think it was because I was motionless that he didn't see me. Ha-ha! I guess I'm going to invest in a vest and hardhat or move to Canada where it's not as crazy. If I do that I want a place near Tim Hortons. Getting ready to head out and try this shoot one more time.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Got the job done and made it back in one piece. Time to hit the darkroom and see how things come out. Will post results this evening.

 

[John Wiegerink]

That's a shocking incident John. Glad that you weren't too badly injured. I once had a near miss with a mountain-biker, in the Lake District. Glad he didn't hit me, there are multiple ways in which that could be very painful.

Thanks Mark! It's amazing how fast these newer bikes can go. Back in the 50's when I got my first bike it had ONE speed, fat tires and took much more energy to get up to anything close to FAST. Oh, and you can't even hear these new fang dangled bikes coming they're so silent and almost deadly.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Got the job done and made it back in one piece. Time to hit the darkroom and see how things come out. Will post results this evening.

Please don't "hit" the darkroom!

 

[Sirius Glass]

I have had great results with XTOL and replenished XTOL.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Please don't "hit" the darkroom!

Yes sir! I just came out as slowly and carefully as I went in. My attempt with the old Cyclone was a total waste of time. The negatives are a dense as a brick. I know they weren't over developed, so something cause a tremendous over exposure. Much more than I could ever make in a mistaken setting. I honestly think it is the falling plate design that caused the over exposure. All the plates are in line waiting to be exposed, but have no protection except for the plate holder directly in front of it. That's the only thing that stops it from receiving direct light. There is space in between each plate holder, and I think rays are sneaking in from all around the sides. I shot Shanghai GP3 100, and it comes out perfectly fine in the Cyclone, but Infrared is a whole different ballgame with this camera. I was in the darkroom when Sirius posted, but must have read his mind. I developed two sheets of GP3 and two sheets of FPP IR in my replenished XT-3 that were taken with my Chamonix 4X5 and Fuji A180mm f9. They aren't 100% perfect, but pretty darn good. I'm going to try two sheets of FPP IR in my replenished Ethol UFG developer just to see what happens. The last two sheets of FPP IR were taken with the Chamonix/Fuji also. I'll post how they look when I'm done. Now, off slowly and carefully to the darkroom.