Darkroom zoning issues

[DBP]

My wife and I recently moved into a larger house, leaving my built in darkroom behind. This one has a huge unfinished basement, so we planned to add a darkroom, and as long as we were at it wall off a laundry room and add a bath, leaving the rest of the space as storage for my cameras, prints, and photo supplies, her musical instruments and yarn, and maybe a model railroad. (If we didn't have so many hobbies we could have kept the old house). Last we we ran into a sang pulling the permits for the basement. The plan examiner decided that adding the darkroom meant the basement would be a living area, and therefore would require an outside exit. Unfortunately, as the basement is about 6 feet below grade, that would require excavating a chunk of foundation, and with it, needing to re-mediate other soil issues that had caused some settling after the place was built in 1964, to the tune of about $12K to $15K.

Has anyone else ever heard of anyone interpreting a dedicated darkroom space as living area before? The examiner said the laundry and bath do not constitute living area, so I am really confused.

 

[winger]

We had to pull permits when I built my basement darkroom in Massachusetts and that didn't come up there (and MA is pretty tight with zoning rules, too). We didn't have a second exit either and it was underground by about as much. I think, though, that it might have been called a workroom or something instead of a darkroom, but I don't know there'd be a difference. It was still considered "unfinished" partially because we didn't put down real flooring in it.
Can you "redo" the plans and just have a sink, without calling it a darkroom and just say it's part of the laundry area or storage that's set apart? I know leaving out info can be interpreted as lying, but is it really their business?

 

[DREW WILEY]

Ha .... sounds like the stereotypical inspector waiting for a bribe. You could go to city hall and see what is actually on the codes books. But
there might be a legitimate concern that someone else, in the future, could convert your darkroom into a den or rec room, or even bedroom.

 

[Rick A]

Change the dark room designation to utility area. When you get your permit, don't wall it off only plumb in the sink. After final inspection and c of o in hand, wall that pig off and put in the dark room.

 

[mr rusty]

Yep, not much difference between a darkroom and utility room. Suggest working around what is permitted - perhaps even ask examiner for advice "we want to make best use of space without adding an exit - what do you recommend?"

Just a thought though, if you do intend to spend alot of time down there ;-) please do have half a mind to fire escape routes. These rules are not there for fun and sometimes s**t happens. I probably "bent" the rules a bit putting my darkroom at the back of my garage, but I made sure I put an opening window in, as otherwise the only escape is through the garage itself. I get involved with fire strategy planning at work, so it makes me think about this.

 

[gone]

Yes, maybe you could change the designation. Put a laundry type sink in there along w/ a washer and call it the laundry room? And yes, keep it unfinished looking. No tile, minimal electrical hookups, unfinished walls, etc. Fix things up after the inspection.

Worse comes to worse, get a licensed contractor who knows the ins and outs to pull the permits. They know how to work around these things.

 

[snapguy]

zone

I certainly would never have mentioned "darkroom" to a building inspector. I am leery about what might happen -- such as what happened to you. I happen to know that if you mention "stage" in a commercial building, that is, a stage for performing arts, the building insurance rate goes sky high but if you call it a "platform" the insurance rate stays low.
Even you leave the "darkroom" out of your plans, how do you know the inspectors might not come around in a few months to see if you have an illegal darkroom? It happens.
I'm afraid the fox is out of the henhouse. You should probably contact an attorney who knows local issues well. It might be cheaper in the long run.
Then there is a possible hazmat hassle. You may be on their list for good.

 

[bascom49]

This is a fire safety issue. You do not necessarily need a full entry / exit doorway for your planned uses. You may be able to satisfy the requirement by installing a window with the lower sill no higher than 30 inches with exterior window well that would serve as emergency egress from the basement. If you were planning a bedroom, (bedrooms are different than other uses) this would most be likely be required in addition to an exterior exit / doorway.
It is possible that you may be able to install an alternate emergency exit from the basement to the upper floor or overhead sprinklers but I doubt it. Couldn't hurt to ask though.

From a resale stand point you are smart to make all improvements under permit. Savvy buyers will know to ask for all such documentation.

If you could swing it, making a provision for future bedroom with bath during this planned construction might make sense from an increased appraisal for your property. The cost of installing a window well and full exit / entrance way might balance out with a higher appraised value after improvements.

No matter what, once you receive any permits for construction, your local tax office will raise your property taxes ( one of the reasons for permitting is so there is a record of improvements for just that purpose).

You could ask your realtor for their advice.

Your bigger concern with adding exits through the foundation is drianage, flooding, and water seepage. Make sure your contractor and or architect is experienced in planning for proper drainage post construction.

Charles

 

[Bob Carnie]

One thing to consider is the potential for inspectors to look at your darkroom, -----after the fact.

For example in Toronto GTA , silver recovery is mandatory in commercial darkrooms, also back flow prevention devices at the water and drain entrance and exit points from any building. This includes home darkrooms.

Without these in place our darkroom would be shut down, it is the same issue here for home darkrooms, which btw is not a very well known bit of information.
Being a commercial darkroom , means that I am open to inspection at a moments notice. And it has happened twice since 1990 when I established my darkroom. I have always
made sure that I am in compliance , including wiring and drains for water heater if you decide to get a bigger unit so you can wash your clothes and wash prints at the same time.

For private home darkrooms all it would take is a phone conversation with the governing bodies and that home darkroom would be inspected and if not in compliance it could/ would be shut down.
This is the case in Toronto GTA and has been so for over 10 years .. The backflow device issue was made mandatory about 6 years ago.

I do not know the rules in Alexandria VA, but it would be prudent before you start working to understand all the potential rules governing your space, which includes the silver and backflow issues.

just my 2 cents

 

[pbromaghin]

Permits? We don't need no stinking permits...

 

[Maris]

My second-last darkroom was built with local authority planning permission but it was a chore doing the paperwork and covering every conceivable objection.

My last darkroom is just a room with a door and window that blocks light when closed, an airconditioner in the wall, a couple of water points (hot and cold) in the wall, and a drain point near floor level. Nothing is permanently built in . The enlargers go on tables with wheels. The sink is on a stand with wheels and connects to the water supply and drain with quick connect/disconnect flexible hoses. I can return the room to empty in minutes single-handed if operating a home darkroom becomes an indictable offence.

 

[wy2l]

Building permits... ah, fond memories of living in Massachusetts:

The night before the inspector arrives, put a bottle of premium whiskey behind the old tree in the back yard.
If he's honest, it will be there after his visit.
If he's not, it will be gone the next day.

Never had an occasion where the bottle was there the next day.

"Nothing on the level,
Everything is a deal,
No deal too small."

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

Isn't a darkroom a work area like a garage workshop?

 

[bsdunek]

Permits? We don't need no stinking permits...

Right! I don't ask permission for ANYTHING that I do inside my house. Of course, I wouldn't live in any of the mentioned places - too restrictive.

 

[winger]

Right! I don't ask permission for ANYTHING that I do inside my house. Of course, I wouldn't live in any of the mentioned places - too restrictive.

Yeah, I was told by the permit guy in a MA town that about the only thing they let you do without a permit is paint. And some towns restrict that if you're in a historical district.

 

[MattKing]

Right! I don't ask permission for ANYTHING that I do inside my house. Of course, I wouldn't live in any of the mentioned places - too restrictive.

Good luck dealing with your insurance company if you try to make a claim with respect to non-permitted changes.

I'll bet there isn't any municipal rules that deal specifically with darkrooms - see if you can access the rules themselves and see where a darkroom might best fit in.

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

I live in Davis, Ca. Rush Limbaugh calls it "The People's Republic of Davis". We have the thermostat police. Had my hot water heater inspected and the inspector also inspected my house for a smoke detector in every room. Ugh.

 

[Neal]

Dear DBP,

Does it simply require an emergency exit? A sort of half culvert sort of thing with a ladder?

Neal Wydra

 

[Wayne]

Wow. What's next, the Massachusetts toilet police telling you when to flush?

 

[mgb74]

In virtually every case where I've worked with a building or electrical inspector, I've found them helpful. Yes, they may be wrong or have to apply code that make not make sense, but they aren't out to get you. And I have never once felt that they were angling for a bribe.

All the suggestions to rename the area are somewhat pointless given that you've already applied for a permit.

Mr. Rusty has it right: explain to the building inspector how it will be used, show how it's really no different that any other workshop, and ask why he/she interpreted this as living space

 

[hacked - sepiareverb]

I live in Davis, Ca. Rush Limbaugh calls it "The People's Republic of Davis". We have the thermostat police. Had my hot water heater inspected and the inspector also inspected my house for a smoke detector in every room. Ugh.

Our previous house was a nightmare, we were required to have smoke detectors in the kitchen, which had a low ceiling. Not just any smoke detector, but one that was wired to be connected to all the others we had to install in the house (thankfully not every room). No end of trouble. Could barely boil eggs without setting it off, removing the battery from that one caused them all to chirp every few minutes. Safety before function.

Common sense rarely enters into any scenario with building codes in private houses it seems. Vermont requires smoke detectors and CO2 detectors in every house that is sold. The units must be less than two years old, yet they do not need to be installed, they just must be "in" the house. They are most commonly delivered to the house before the closing and sit in their packages eternally.

 

[aoresteen]

My last two houses I have had darkrooms. The plans always said "utility/storage rooms". After the CO was issued then the darkroom was built. I'm currently building out a darkroom in my 'utility room'. All my builders/contractors advised against putting the term 'darkroom' om the plans.

 

[mopar_guy]

Another way to do this is to make a room and say that it is a "future" plumbing fixture and that means that you do not intend to actually install a fixture right now, but that you are installing the rough-in only for plumbing and that you are installing the basic electrical outlets and light fixtures.

 

[Tom1956]

For corn's sake. [insert eye roll here]

 

[Mainecoonmaniac]

I like it!

Another way to do this is to make a room and say that it is a "future" plumbing fixture and that means that you do not intend to actually install a fixture right now, but that you are installing the rough-in only for plumbing and that you are installing the basic electrical outlets and light fixtures.

It's going to be another "laundry" room.