D-23 techniques and an unknown developer puzzler

[sun of sand]

I've read about D-23 and it's qualities but maybe those with experience can tell me some real Do's and Do Not's
Dilutions/split 2 bath development etc ..never done "2 bath" with film or paper

I can search
and I DO search
but maybe there are a few tips that won't be found everywhere



As for the unknown developer
Mallinckrodt SOFTONE
Low contrast films and plates for moderately fine grain
Use undiluted for 20 min. Tank/16 Tray and Fine Grained Films 15 minutes
68 degrees

Seems to be a metol only developer
Inner container perfect white developer
Most other old developers have turned much darker-assuming HQ with metol- or glycin at coffee colored
Also due to the name "Soft One" as in 1 developing agent -metol
Rest of can appears to be sulfite -perfectly white- but mixed in were streaks of very slightly yellowed chemical
"Yellow chemical" seemed to be different than the rest only because it shifted around/avalanched with ease in comparison
Maybe just slightly oxidized sulfite.

Solution turned ever so slightly creamy yellow.

D-23 is my thought but with less metol which -I figure- gives the longer development times
Agfa 42 Low Contrast/Soft gives times in the correct range but contains HQ ..and since this developer was perfectly white, I doubt it.

Any ideas? Has to be nearly identical to something.

 

[Anscojohn]

Regarding D23: quite frankly, I never saw much use in the two bath approach. Of course, I am not a zoner; but just straight D23 replenished with DK25R always seems to give me a very large quantity of easily-printable negs on roll film without any additional folderal. Eastman's caveat about using a fresh stop bath is a good one; especially if one lives in a hard-water area. Sulfite scum can lurk on the neg and not be apparent until the film is dry. I cannot think of any more caveats. D23 is about the most "forgiving" soup I have ever encountered and I have been using it almost exclusively since the mid-1970s. Oh, one other thing: when in doubt starting out, use the times for your chosen film when developed in straight D-76 and you shall not be far off.

 

[gainer]

I agree with Anscojohn about the differences between D-23 and the two-bath versions. I could not find differences between any of the results when developing times were adjusted to give the same contrast. That being the case, I quit using the 2-bath because it used extra vessels. The thinner emulsions of current films are another hindrance.

It's easy just to mix 2 tsp Metol and 4 tbs sodium sulfite in water to make a liter and forget about the second bath.

 

[Rlibersky]

I use the 2 step bath if I forget how I exposed a film or exposed a roll with different ISOs. I have found 3 minutes in solution 1 and 4 min in solution 2 will get me good results with most films. This has include (120) Delta 3200.

For my portrait work Plus-x and D23 is the best.

 

[sun of sand]

Thanks. Sounds like I'll try the two solution bath technique to see what it does and doesn't do for my eyes
Amidol two bath method as well
I'll do the fresh stop, though. I'll search sulfite scum


Found out this SOFTONE is most likely plain D-23. Old Kodak lab book gave times of 19 and 15 while Ansel used 12min for whatever film he was using, it seems
D-25 has bisulfite in it for finer grain so am wondering if there isn't maybe a lesser quantity "pinch/couple grams" of that in there. D-23 seems moderately fine grain already so any bisulfite should make it only slightly less grainy ..so who knows
I believe bisulfite is somewhat yellow, though

Is Windische? formula same as diluting D-23 1:4 or so? ..I know

 

[Jim Noel]

I have used D-23 for special projects for 30-40 years. My most common use is 2 bath so I can increase contrast for some of the alt processes. With HP5+ it provides a beautiful scale for figure work.

 

[BradS]

I've been using D-23 and several variants for just about everything for a few years. I did the borax after bath for a full year and came to the same conclusion as Gainer and AnscoJohn. It's not worth the extra effort. The extra effort is extremely minimal but so too is the effect as far as I could tell. I did notice some very slight differences...but, I can not attribute those to the borax afterbath for certain.

For me, the straight developer is plenty good. Awful damned good, in fact. More importantly for me, it is extremely forgiving. I have gotten so used to it's forgivness, that I don't even bother to check the temperature of the developer for example.

I love it with HP5, FP4 and 320TXP.

 

[analogsnob]

I have used D-23 with and without a "B" bath of 1percent Kodalk (always at 3 minuits) for many years with success. I have always thought of D-23 with Kodalk more as a cousin of waterbath than a divided developer as the priciple density comes from time in D-23 and the Kodalk adds accentuation of the exaustion effects benifitting the shadows.

I have also used the Kodalk treatment with DK-50 and HC-110 with some success.

The windisch formula is D-23 diluted IIRC 1:4 with water and the compensating action is striking. It does not blow out highlights even with plus development.

 

[dancqu]

I've read about D-23 and it's qualities but maybe
those with experience can tell me some real Do's
and Do Not's Dilutions ...

I've found D-23 to work well at a 1:7 dilution.
Takes a while; Across 120, 500ml, 16 minutes,
a few inversions to start and at 2 minute intervals.
Gives good speed and very compensating. Dan

 

[nickandre]

The yellow color is oxidized metol. The sodium sulphite stops the metol from oxidizing. However, the metol doesn't dissolve easily when the sulphite already is. The procedure is to dissolve some of the sulphite and then the metol, followed by the rest of the sulphite.

 

[sun of sand]

I had just read your 1:7 D-23 thread when I saw your post, Dan. I'm no stranger to long processing time experiments so I'll give it a shot or two when make a second exposure of something

an aside
Just spent 22 minutes enlarging onto '57 Velox 3
1:13 for same ballpark density on Azo 2 postcard 1960's or earlier
17 minutes for Ansco/Gaf Lustrex 2
f11 4x5 to 5x7 from normal negative using a DII and Agfa 135 1:3 2min no fog truly showing ..perhaps slightest little bit?
Grade 3 of Velox should drop it's speed in relation to the grade 2's

Go 4x5 to 8x10 with a dense negative onto Azo might only be looking at 4 hours?




I'll try out these suggestions in the coming month/s and see what I get
Interested in D-23 for the high contrast snow scenes we sometimes get around here


I actually knew well enough to add a pinch of sulfite before dissolving metol, tiberiustibz
tiberisutibz? mind my asking..
The metol itself was absolutely perfect. The faint yellow was in the sulfite section of the container. Seems odd only that little "trace" would oxidize ..and I've never seen/noticed oxidized sulfite before
bisulfite doesn't make seem to make sense in such a small quantity