Does anyone know what was the predominant method used in 30s and 40s when sepia toning was very popular? Of course these prints are older so there might been bleaching by sunlight or just plain aging, but they seem to have much lighter color and less red than what I'm getting...
Well, that is not my experience. I find the one-step method much easier than dealing with the bleach and redeveloper for the following reasons:
Residual silver halide, left behind by poor fixing, will cause staining with sulfide toners. Furthermore, residual thiosulfate, left behind by poor washing, can also cause staining and even highlight loss with sulfide toners. To avoid staining from residual silver halide or thiosulfate, it is, therefore, essential that FB prints are fully fixed and adequately washed in preparation for, or anticipation of, sulfide toning. For direct sulfide toning, a preceding 30-minute wash is sufficient. The bleaching process, required for indirect sulfide toning, calls for a complete 60-minute wash prior to bleaching. Otherwise, residual fixer will dissolve bleached highlights before the toner has a chance to redevelop them. Likewise, a brief rinse after bleaching is highly recommended, because the interaction between bleach and toner may also cause staining. Washing minimizes the risk of unwanted chemical interactions between fixer, bleach, and toner. Indirect toning, after bleaching, must be carried out to completion to ensure full conversion of silver halides into image forming silver. Otherwise, some residual silver halide will be left behind, since the toner was not able to redevelop the bleached image entirely. This is rare, because indirect toning is completed within a few minutes, but if residual silver halide is left behind by incomplete toning, the print will eventually show staining and degenerate, similarly to an incompletely fixed print.
I also find the results of direct sulfide toning much more visually pleasing, but that's, of course, a matter of taste. As you said, there is more than one way to skin a cat, and one has to find out what works best for oneself. One advantage of properly executed indirect sulfide toning is that it is the most archival toning process known to man, direct sulfide toning being a close second and selenium toning being a distant third.
I've always wondered, any difference between thiocarbamide and sulfide sepia toners besides smell? ... I'm assuming they both offer the same level of protection ...
Does someone know how Michael Kenna gets his so subtle tones? I met him very recently... but did not dare to ask!
I've always wondered, any difference between thiocarbamide and sulfide sepia toners besides smell? I've always just used the thio sepia toners so I could work without the odor. I'm assuming they both offer the same level of protection, but how about differences in tone?
Thomas
Properly executed processes should work fine, but some processes are easier to execute properly than others. How do you know that the print is fully redeveloped after bleaching?
I've only experimented a little in this area, but there seems to be a considerable difference, The short story is that thiocarbamide seems a bit more delicate in most cases. But there is also quite a variety of thiocarbamide redevelopers, unlike sulfide. A good example is Defender 6-T (Varigam toner), which lets you choose between three bleaches and three toners, each combination giving a different result. (My brief experience were that all combinations were different, some very different but some quite close to one another.) There are some good examples of thiocarbamide toning along with comparisons to sulfide toning in Rudman's book, if you can find it.
Both thio and sulfide put off the same amount of gas that will fog papers and film correct? It's just that one smells and the other doesn't.
I've always wondered, any difference between thiocarbamide and sulfide sepia toners besides smell? I've always just used the thio sepia toners so I could work without the odor. I'm assuming they both offer the same level of protection, but how about differences in tone?
My unscientific way of knowing is that after the re-development doesn't show any more change, usually after about 30 seconds (with the toner I use, Moersch MT-3). I develop for a full minute, just to be safe. ...
My unscientific way of knowing is that after the re-development doesn't show any more change, usually after about 30 seconds (with the toner I use, Moersch MT-3). I develop for a full minute, just to be safe.
- Thomas
Does someone know how Michael Kenna gets his so subtle tones? I met him very recently... but did not dare to ask!
I used to re-develop for one minute, but recently changed to 2 minutes just to be on the safe side.
Ralph,
If I bleach it incompletely or redevelop it half way in bleach/redevelop sepia toner... then follow it up with selenium toner, that will convert all silver to more stable form, correct??
Bleach-redevelopment sepia toning is meant to be taken to completion. If you want partial toning you should use one of the direct toners: brown toner, polysulfide toner, selenium toner.
Thomas
Properly executed processes should work fine, but some processes are easier to execute properly than others. How do you know that the print is fully redeveloped after bleaching?
I tried sepia toning for the first time today. Paper was Ilford MGIV FB and toner was Photographers' Formulary 221.
...
The result is.... the print is just as dark as the original and it's really brown/red. It's not the subtle kind of sepia.... it screams out SEPIA! It also looks like I lost contrast a bit. Overall, it's not pleasing at all.
The instruction says bleach for 1 min and redevelop for 1 min so that's what I did.
Redeveloping for 30, 60, 120, 240 and 480s, followed by another bleach should show the difference in protection or how 'fully' the redevelopment really was.
If I see a change at 30s still, I mix fresh toner. .
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