Congo large format lenses

Mark O'Neill · May 12, 2008

I have just for the first time heard about "Congo" large format camera lenses from japan. Apparently they have been in production since the 1920's but why don't they show up in books or in the market place? Have any of you LF users had any thing to do with them? Are they worth buying? Would like to hear from anyone who may have experienced these lenses?

David Grenet · May 12, 2008

I have one, but I'm afraid I don't really have anything to compare it to so I probably can't help there...

The one I have is a 300/5.6 telephoto lens mounted in a copal 1.

Dan Fromm · May 12, 2008

http://www.hevanet.com/cperez/testing.html

http://www.thalmann.com/largeformat/

http://www.cosmonet.org/congo/index_e.html

And learn to search for yourself!

mmcclellan · May 12, 2008

Here's a link to info on them: http://www.cosmonet.org/congo/index_e.html

It appears that the Osaka camera lenses sold in the U.S. are probably Congo. Interesting selection!

munz6869 · May 12, 2008

I just got one in the post today (coincidentally). It's a cute little 90mm/3.5 in a Copal 0 - clean and bright, and now the 2nd "modern" lens I own. I read some Congos are dogs, but at least on the groundglass this looks snappy - can't wait to try it out!!

Marc

Laurent · May 12, 2008

David Grenet said:
I have one, but I'm afraid I don't really have anything to compare it to so I probably can't help there...

The one I have is a 300/5.6 telephoto lens mounted in a copal 1.

I'd be interested about your feedback about using it for 4/5 ? I own a Tachihara and would love to get a long lens for it, so the light weight of these seems interesting.

Tomf2468 · May 12, 2008

I have an Osaka (believed to be same as Congo) 120 and 210. Very light, coated, modern shutter. All around great lens. Won't beat a brand new modern Rodenstock wide open, but will come $%#@* close to matching it at F16 to F64

Trevor Crone · May 12, 2008

I have a 240mm Tele-Congo in Copal Press No.1 shutter. Certainly sharp with plenty of movement on 5x4. Got it on Ebay a few years back, as new.

David Grenet · May 12, 2008

Laurent said:
I'd be interested about your feedback about using it for 4/5 ? I own a Tachihara and would love to get a long lens for it, so the light weight of these seems interesting.

This lens is not particularly light weight (and definitely not compact) - it measures 5.5cm out from the front of the shutter and has a filter thread of (I think) 62mm!

As for using it, it covers 4x5 wide open with some movements and (without anything to compare it with) certainly seems sharp enough.

As far as I can tell, they don't make this one any more...

Maris · May 12, 2008

I have and use the Commercial Congo 210 f6.3 and the Commercial Congo 360 f6.8 on 4x5 and 8x10 formats. The 210 covers 8x10 but with NO movements. The 360 actually has a maximum image circle of 510mm; much more than the published spec of 415mm.

Back in the 1990's I used to sell the Congo range of lenses and still have the old price lists and specification sheets.

John Kasaian · May 12, 2008

To my understanding the Commercial Congo is a multicoated version of the venerable Kodak Commercial Ektars. Good stuff

Phillip P. Dimor · May 13, 2008

I've a 135mm f4.5 Yamasaki Congo lens in a Seiko shutter. It's a good 'press type' lens and I use it handheld on a 4x5 crown. It's sharp and has great contrast. I've a shot of a lake focused at infinity and the very edges of the negative are a little soft however. I received the lens for free and am happy with it. If I were paying for a new lens I might go for something else (and probably not a 135mm..)

The commercial-ektar type ones do look very nice though. And the soft focus lens is interesting..

Laurent · May 13, 2008

Re : Congo lareg format lenses

David Grenet said:
This lens is not particularly light weight (and definitely not compact) - it measures 5.5cm out from the front of the shutter and has a filter thread of (I think) 62mm!

As for using it, it covers 4x5 wide open with some movements and (without anything to compare it with) certainly seems sharp enough.

As far as I can tell, they don't make this one any more...

My mistake... I was thinking of the 300/8 and 400/8 ones, advertised for about 400 grams. The 300 does seem to barely cover 4/5 but the 400 seems OK and is still light.

Anyone uses these ?

Ian Grant · May 13, 2008

The sales approach from Congo is rather laid back and relaxed, no push, no real marketing. The website is hardly ever updated. The News page is still 1997 !!!! OK other pages are 2004 or 2005.

Congo are a sleeper. They could play a very valuable role in LF photography, making the lens types no longer made by other larger companies.

Suggestions would be:

Wide Angle Protars, the Ross & Zeiss Patents lapsed years ago, it would be wonderful to be able to buy a small multi-coated modern version.

Hypergon's, the Goerz wide angle with the propeller, again a MC version.

Dagor's, it's unlikely Schneider will make them again

Ian

highpeak · May 13, 2008

I have a commercial congo 210mm F6.3 and I am very happy with it's performance. It's also my smallest 210mm lens, even smaller than my 150mm caltar IIN. I carry these two lenses when ever I go hiking with my 4X5 camera.

Ole · May 13, 2008

Ian Grant said:
... Suggestions would be:

Wide Angle Protars, the Ross & Zeiss Patents lapsed years ago, it would be wonderful to be able to buy a small multi-coated modern version.

Hypergon's, the Goerz wide angle with the propeller, again a MC version.

Dagor's, it's unlikely Schneider will make them again

Ian

Hypergons: Nice, but virtually impossible and would be very expensive, even from Congo. The deep curvature in thin material makes it one of the most expensive lenses it's possible to produce.

Dagors: Why? Besides, Schneider still makes one: The 550XXL.

WA Protars: Not as easy as it seems, and they would still be f:18. But maybe there is a market for them? In most cases I'd rather have - no, forget that: Congo already is making a small, lightweight double-Gauss moderate WA. Maybe I could wish for a new edition of the last version of the Angulon, preferrably complete with a suitable center filter.

Ian Grant · May 13, 2008

I'd rather have a newer version of the f16 Ross Protar, the patented Zeiss f18 version was based on the earlier Ross patent, their licensing agreements must have been very complex.

Ian

Ole · May 13, 2008

Ian, the Ross lens was made under licence from Zeiss. Ross made them f:16, but Zeiss were not willing to accept the quality loss caused by increasing the maximum aperture from f:18 to f:16. Besides, the 4,5 - 6,3 - 9 - 12 - 18 - 25 aperture scale was "standard" in Germany at the time (one of many "standards", but at least that's what Zeiss used).

NavyMoose · May 13, 2008

Osaka Lenses

Tomf2468 said:
I have an Osaka (believed to be same as Congo) 120 and 210. Very light, coated, modern shutter. All around great lens. Won't beat a brand new modern Rodenstock wide open, but will come $%#@* close to matching it at F16 to F64

After reading this thread, I started looking online for Osaka lenses, specifically the 120mm. The coverage looks pretty good, especially for 4X5. The price is half what the Nikkor-SW 120mm is. Can you please post some photos taken with this lens?

What kind of movements are you capable of using this lens with a 4X5? I have a Toyo 45C, which I use for landscapes.

Thank you.

Sincerely,

Navy Moose

Mark O'Neill · May 14, 2008

thanks for the congo replies

Now I am a ware that congo is a reputable manufacturer I will seriously consider a purchase.The 400/f8 tele is looking good at around $700 from the congo web site price list. Thanks to all respondants. The only problem is finding a retailer in Australia, or do I trust purchasing directly from Japan?
I'll keep you posted about what transpires.

Tomf2468 · May 14, 2008

Osaka

Some 120 Osaka examples:
http://www.ferguson-photo-design.com/buttons.html
http://www.ferguson-photo-design.com/art/inside.html
http://www.ferguson-photo-design.com/art/lily-bud.html
http://www.ferguson-photo-design.com/art/wormwood.html

I bought mine many years ago. At that time (assuming my 50 year old memory is working) Bromwell had a ?30? day return policy if you didn't like the lens http://www.bromwellmarketing.com/

After reading this thread, I now doubt that Congo and Osaka are the same lenses. They may come from the same plant, but the maximum f/stops are different between the two lines.

NavyMoose said:
After reading this thread, I started looking online for Osaka lenses, specifically the 120mm. The coverage looks pretty good, especially for 4X5. The price is half what the Nikkor-SW 120mm is. Can you please post some photos taken with this lens?

What kind of movements are you capable of using this lens with a 4X5? I have a Toyo 45C, which I use for landscapes.

Thank you.

Sincerely,

Navy Moose

NavyMoose · May 14, 2008

Wonderful photos!

I'm going to keep thinking about this, when I get my kiss in the mail from the IRS I will make my decision.

Thank you for the links.

Navy Moose

ReallyBigCameras · May 15, 2008

Tomf2468 said:
After reading this thread, I now doubt that Congo and Osaka are the same lenses. They may come from the same plant, but the maximum f/stops are different between the two lines.

The Osaka lenses from Bromwell are definitely made by Congo. The only difference is the name on the lenses, who sells them and who provides the warranty.

Congo makes multiple designs in some focal lengths. So, that might explain any differences in max. aperture, but the 120mm Wide Angles are both f6.3 max. Also, what Bromwell sells is a subset of what Congo offers. If you look at the tables here you will find everything Bromwell sells under the Osaka name in one of the tables.

I still have and use my little multicoated 90mm f6.3 Congo Wide Angle I bought several years ago. I actually tested five of the Congo Wide Angles, three 90s and two 120s, and kept the best of the 90s. The coverage is a bit tight on 4x5, but as long as I remember to check the corners of the ground glass for mechanical vignetting, it's not a problem.

Prior to getting the little 90mm Congo wide angle, I'd used a Linhof select 90mm Angulon as my wide angle for backpacking. The Angulon was plenty sharp (as long as I didn't push the movements), but on color transparency film it had a much cooler color cast than my modern multicoated lenses. The color rendition of the Congo was much more pleasing to my eye and a better match to my other lenses. So, I kept it and sold the Angulon and have never regretted that decision. It's so tiny that there's never an excuse not to take it wherever I go - and it's been on many long backpacking trips with me over the years and has been used to make some of my favorite images on many of those trips.

Kerry Thalmann
Really Big Cameras

alanrockwood · Feb 5, 2011

Any more comments about Congo large format lenses?

werra · Feb 6, 2011

Well, I have 300/5.6. Barely covers 5x7, so quite a lot of room for movements in 4x5.
Not the sharpest lens in the pack tho, center is ok, edges fall a bit apart even on 4x5. But it certainly is lightweight (aluminium elements, 370g without shutter) and compact for the focal length and aperture. And pricewise it is much cheaper than, say Schneider tele-xenar 270, or alike, without compromising image quality that much.

4x5: http://www.flickr.com/photos/werra/4753820938/
5x7: http://www.flickr.com/photos/werra/4649579256/

Vignette on both images is caused by moderate tele shade, not by lens limits.

Congo large format lenses

Mark O'Neill

David Grenet

Dan Fromm

mmcclellan

munz6869

Laurent

Tomf2468

Trevor Crone

David Grenet

Maris

John Kasaian

Phillip P. Dimor

Laurent

Ian Grant

highpeak

Ole

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Congo large format lenses

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