Colour conversion filters

[spoolman]

does anyone still use colour conversion filters such as 80A,81A,82A,85B etc.

Doug

 

[AgX]

I do.
At least in theory the results are better, than filtering at the printing stage. (Which contradicts my typical argumentation, that only the practical effects count...)

 

[Mick Fagan]

Yes, 81A with colour negative for portraiture work. Also works well if an inanimate subject is in shade, takes the coldness out of things.

Started using this filter around 30+ years ago when I was doing a lot of colour negative work and printing my own negatives.

I add 1/3 of a stop for this filter.

 

[spoolman]

the reason I asked is that I just had a friend give me a number of these filters in different sizes that he doesn't need anymore so before I list them for sale I wanted to check to see if anyone uses them still.

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

I find them critical for working with Ektar color neg film, though only need three at most in the field : a light pinkish 1B skylight filter for modest blue correction, an 81A or KR1.5 for bluish overcast skies, and an 81C for deep blue shadow under deep blue skies, especially at high altitude. Once cyan crossover happens with this film, it's very difficult to post-correct. Using correct color temp filtration at the time of the shot is far far more efficient.

 

[spoolman]

I find them critical for working with Ektar color neg film, though only need three at most in the field : a light pinkish 1B skylight filter for modest blue correction, an 81A or KR1.5 for bluish overcast skies, and an 81C for deep blue shadow under deep blue skies, especially at high altitude. Once cyan crossover happens with this film, it's very difficult to post-correct. Using correct color temp filtration at the time of the shot is far far more efficient.

Hi Drew: so there is a use for these filters albeit very limited.

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

I wouldn't say very limited. The same color temp rules technically apply to all films. But most traditional color neg films (including "Portra") are in fact optimized for default portraiture hues, and hence artificially warmed and relatively low contrast. Ektar is different, is not warmed, and has higher contrast for sake of a cleaner more saturated look more similar to slide films. And that makes it a lot more difficult to post correct if crossover occurs due to significantly off color temperature at the time of the shot, with 5500K being its "daylight" standard. I won't go into the technical reasons here; but NO, just fooling with color balance in Photoshop or using an enlarger colorhead setting afterwards generally won't correct it.

And for some reason, many slide films don't look too bad when they're incorrectly color balanced. Some people even preferred that overt bluish look for certain subjects. But if you try the same thing with Ektar, you get cyan-contaminated crossover instead, spoiling actual blues and violets, etc. Just the opposite of traditional color neg films, where all the warm tans, oranges, and yellows tend to "dump" into some stereotypical "fleshtone" category. In older Vericolor days, yellows would go pumpkin, earthtones would trend pinkish, and, on the opposite side of the color wheel, natural vivid green would go cyan-inflected "poison green". So with respect to that, I would consider Ektar quite an improvement outside of portrait per se applications.

But there are also creative reasons for using warming filters. For example, an 81 or 81A is often used by film-makers to obtain that subtle amber cast characteristic of many classic movies, such as the Godfather or Barry Lyndon, for example.

 

[spoolman]

I wouldn't say very limited. The same color temp rules technically apply to all films. But most traditional color neg films (including "Portra") are in fact optimized for default portraiture hues, and hence artificially warmed and relatively low contrast. Ektar is different, is not warmed, and has higher contrast for sake of a cleaner more saturated look more similar to slide films. And that makes it a lot more difficult to post correct if crossover occurs due to significantly off color temperature at the time of the shot, with 5500K being its "daylight" standard. I won't go into the technical reasons here; but NO, just fooling with color balance in Photoshop or using an enlarger colorhead setting afterwards generally won't correct it.

And for some reason, many slide films don't look too bad when they're incorrectly color balanced. Some people even preferred that overt bluish look for certain subjects. But if you try the same thing with Ektar, you get cyan-contaminated crossover instead, spoiling actual blues and violets, etc. Just the opposite of traditional color neg films, where all the warm tans, oranges, and yellows tend to "dump" into some stereotypical "fleshtone" category. In older Vericolor days, yellows would go pumpkin, earthtones would trend pinkish, and, on the opposite side of the color wheel, natural vivid green would go cyan-inflected "poison green". So with respect to that, I would consider Ektar quite an improvement outside of portrait per se applications.

But there are also creative reasons for using warming filters. For example, an 81 or 81A is often used by film-makers to obtain that subtle amber cast characteristic of many classic movies, such as the Godfather or Barry Lyndon, for example.

Hi Drew:would the other filters like 82A & B and 85A & B have any use as well ?

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

82 series ones are cooling filters, and useful the opposite direction, when the lighting is too warm. But 85 series are strong conversion filters are for sake of shooting tungsten-balanced film under daylight conditions. Since tungsten-balanced films are no longer made, there's not likely to be any current demand for 85's. You never stated what brand or quality of filters these are. But if they're high quality glass ones, most sound like keepers. If poor quality, you won't get much for them anyway.

 

[MattKing]

Since tungsten-balanced films are no longer made,

Outside of the motion picture film market.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Well, Matt ....Those folks can be awfully snooty, ....I mean, real deal Harrison & Harrison filters; and if he's got a set of those (unlikely), they would be worth a fair amount.

 

[MattKing]

Drew,
A lot of people seem to be re-purposing ECN materials for still use....

 

[spoolman]

82 series ones are cooling filters, and useful the opposite direction, when the lighting is too warm. But 85 series are strong conversion filters are for sake of shooting tungsten-balanced film under daylight conditions. Since tungsten-balanced films are no longer made, there's not likely to be any current demand for 85's. You never stated what brand or quality of filters these are. But if they're high quality glass ones, most sound like keepers. If poor quality, you won't get much for them anyway.

Hi Drew: most of the filters are made by well establish companies like Hoya, Vivitar, Pentax, Toshiba, Kenko and some lesser known ones like General, Black's etc.

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

I'd just keep em and learn to use them, or at least have fun doing so.

 

[spoolman]

I'd just keep em and learn to use them, or at least have fun doing so.

Hi Drew: I don't have any lenses that take those thread sizes and I need the money so I'll put them on Photrio and see what happens.
Doug

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hi Drew: I don't have any lenses that take those thread sizes and I need the money so I'll put them on Photrio and see what happens.
Doug

What thread sizes?

 

[spoolman]

What thread sizes?

Hi Steve: I have a Tiffen 80A, Hoya 80B and a Toshiba 81B in 49mm, a Hoya 85B in 52mm, 2 Hoya 82A filters and a Hoya 80A filter in 55mm, a Vivitar 81A,81B and 82A in 58mm and a Toshiba 81B in 58mm. These are all the colour conversion filters. I have other filters in these sizes and polarizers and a 1A in 62mm and other filters,mostly polarizers, in larger sizes.

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

Well, it's an odd lot. But step rings are fairly cheap. But if you decide to sell, don't expect much. Other than Hoya, they're all cheap brands.

 

[spoolman]

Well, it's an odd lot. But step rings are fairly cheap. But if you decide to sell, don't expect much. Other than Hoya, they're all cheap brands.

Hi Drew: I don't expect much from anything these days but I find that items like these filters have a better chance of finding a home here on Photrio than on eBay. At least here I don't have to deal with the fees that eBay charges.

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

Well, good luck with that, and in general.

 

[spoolman]

Well, good luck with that, and in general.

Thanks Drew. I just had someone else drop off a quantity of darkroom things along with more filters, this time Wratten CC and CP gelatin as well as a large set of Cokin filters.

Doug

 

[DREW WILEY]

Well, try to restrict actual gel filter to indoor use if you can. That way they'll last a lot longer.

 

[spoolman]

Well, try to restrict actual gel filter to indoor use if you can. That way they'll last a lot longer.

Hi Drew: these as well as other items are going up for sale here on photrio eventually.

Doug